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To: Blogger
Catholic Doctrine: Mary never sinned. Biblical Doctrine: Romans 3

Oh brother. If I had a dollar for every Protestant who misunderstood Romans 3...

It is taken out of context, and that is crystal clear when we go to where Paul was quoting, the Psalms of David, in where the Psalms ALSO talk about RIGHTEOUS people who follow God. In a nutshell, Romans 3 is talking about WICKED people - and in context, wicked JEWS. Merely being a Jew didn't make one righteous. The Jewish dietary laws and circumcision didn't make one righteous, but faith in God, which even the GENTILES could have. Thus, one chapter prior, Paul refutes the idea that ALL men are wicked.

Furthermore, Cross-referencing Luke 2 with Leviticus 12 shows that Mary was considered unclean after the birth of her son and brought a sacrifice to the temple in order to atone for herself. If she were sinless, this would have not only been a fruitless exercise but would have been blood unnecessarily spilt.

So why did Jesus get circumcised and baptized by John??? Because He needed to repent of His sins? Because He needed to become a child of God??? Have you ever considered that people do things out of love, not out of requirement? Once you can wrap your mind around that concept, you will come to understand Catholicism and God's action in the world. All is done out of love.

Regards

2,137 posted on 12/19/2006 9:22:00 AM PST by jo kus (Humility is present when one debases oneself without being obliged to do so- St.Chrysostom; Phil 2:8)
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To: jo kus

Circumcision and Baptism were both PICTURES. Circumcision showed Israel's covenant with God. Baptism showed ones repentance. Baptism does NOT make one a child of God. Accepting God's gift through Jesus Christ does.

The Law of Moses specifically called the purification (which Mary had to undergo) a means of atonement.

You are massively confused on the book of Romans. Those evil Joooooos. All means all, buddy. And newsflash, that includes you.


2,139 posted on 12/19/2006 9:25:59 AM PST by Blogger
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To: jo kus; Blogger
In a nutshell, Romans 3 is talking about WICKED people - and in context, wicked JEWS.

So according to Catholicism, Paul's purpose in writing Romans 3:23 was to say that: "For all wicked Jews have sinned and fall short of the glory of God. Many of you must have thought that some wicked Jews were sinless, but I am here to correct you and state that in fact, ALL of the wicked Jews have sinned." This is a very profound statement. What were the rest of us supposed to think about wicked Jews until Paul came along to tell us that they all sinned? :) This reminds me of that Time Magazine cover story where it was announced for the first time that scientists had discovered that men and women were different.

2,797 posted on 12/22/2006 6:35:40 PM PST by Forest Keeper
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To: jo kus
Oh brother. If I had a dollar for every Protestant who misunderstood Romans 3...

It is taken out of context, and that is crystal clear when we go to where Paul was quoting, the Psalms of David, in where the Psalms ALSO talk about RIGHTEOUS people who follow God. In a nutshell, Romans 3 is talking about WICKED people - and in context, wicked JEWS.


This passage doesn't just speak of wicked Jews.
Romans 3:9 What then? are we better than they? No, in no wise: for we have before proved both Jews and Gentiles, that they are all under sin;

10 As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one:
The passage ultimately says that all humanity (besides the God-man Christ) have fallen short of God's expectation of their lives.
Romans 3:23 For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;
The passage doesn't say that all are wicked ... merely that All have sinned (to a more or less extent ... in their lives).

2,800 posted on 12/22/2006 7:03:29 PM PST by Quester
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