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Opus Disruption in KC-St. Joe (The Catholic Right: Sixteenth in a Series)
Talk to Action ^ | Sun Nov 19, 2006 | Frank Cocozelli

Posted on 11/27/2006 3:45:02 PM PST by Joseph DeMaistre

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To: ThanhPhero
Would that all our American dioceses could have such bishops.

I'm not Catholic...but I venture to say that I agree.
While it's sad that the convoluted Amendment 2 passed in MO,
but, if Finn hadn't quietly, but insistently shook people awake,
it would have passed with 80% approval, not by just a few % points.

Finn (and some other influential clergy-persons) did a good job
fighting a $30+ million ad campaign filled with double-talk, if not
outright fraud.
21 posted on 11/27/2006 6:29:43 PM PST by VOA
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To: livius
"He said he absolutely refuses to use CE and BCE"

As do I. I think a freeper once posted that if in a position where someone was forced to use it, to think of it as "Christian Era" and "Before Christian Era." :)

22 posted on 11/27/2006 6:32:58 PM PST by sageb1 (This is the Final Crusade. There are only 2 sides. Pick one.)
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To: Joseph DeMaistre
Sounds good to me. This is just about the most ridiculous piece of tripe I have ever read.

he falsely miscasts the value pluralist aspects so fundamental to American democracy society as "nihilism" and "moral relativism." More ominously, he sees his flock not as much as living as citizens in America democracy, but as part of "a kingdom."

The Kingdom of Heaven, maybe? Sorry, but when the Son of Man comes to Judgment sitting on the clouds of glory, you don't get to vote on it.

23 posted on 11/27/2006 7:10:19 PM PST by Cicero (Marcus Tullius)
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To: Joseph DeMaistre

How can we advocate for distributive justice in a pluralistic society? We can't impose our values on people who hate the poor and take away their right to exploit the poor for financial gain in a pluralistic society? We can't support government welfare, in a pluralistic society, when there are others who seek the truth without coercion. Pluralistic society. Pluralistic society.


24 posted on 11/27/2006 8:27:28 PM PST by nickcarraway
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To: Joseph DeMaistre

This is news??


25 posted on 11/27/2006 8:45:33 PM PST by marshmallow
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To: marshmallow
This is news??

Sure. When a Catholic bishop actually acts like a Catholic bishop, it's definitely a "man bites dog" story.
26 posted on 11/27/2006 9:03:12 PM PST by Antoninus (Don't click my name...)
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To: nickcarraway

If these people really believed in a pluralistic society, they would have enough room for traditionally minded people who believe in God, Country, family and an ascetic morality.

They aren't pluralists in practice. They are narrow-minded dogmatists who are guided above all by hedonism, narcissism, self-absorption
and self-destruction. Anyone who gets in their selfishness is the problem. The irony is, although they deny it, they believe everyone has to think the way they do.

But that's part of human nature. It's a matter of having enough humility to look at your own problems before pointing the finger at others. They are moral absolutists whether they want to admit it or not, just not the kind of absolutes that are in civilization's best interest.

The barbarians would be proud.


27 posted on 11/27/2006 9:11:05 PM PST by Joseph DeMaistre (There's no such thing as relativism, only dogmatism of a different color)
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To: Pyro7480

Dear Bishop Finn may be the one of the great saints of these days keeping Missouri from burning under the wrath of God. And I mean, burning.


28 posted on 11/27/2006 11:04:29 PM PST by Maeve ( Our Lady of Ephesus, pray for us.)
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To: Joseph DeMaistre

After he cleans up things there, perhaps he should be moved to Los Angeles.


29 posted on 11/28/2006 2:57:21 AM PST by PAR35
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To: Antoninus
Sure. When a Catholic bishop actually acts like a Catholic bishop, it's definitely a "man bites dog" story.

We already know about Finn.

I was referring to Cocozelli's (who?) miserable opinion of him.

30 posted on 11/28/2006 5:32:36 AM PST by marshmallow
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To: Maeve

I got to meet Bishop Finn when I was out in Missouri, campaigning against Amendment 2. I definitely got a good impression from him. May he receive a red hat someday!


31 posted on 11/28/2006 5:46:46 AM PST by Pyro7480 ("Give me an army saying the Rosary and I will conquer the world." - Pope Blessed Pius IX)
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To: Campion
A surplice is the lace overgarment often worn by altar boys or choir members over a cassock, and inflicts no pain whatsoever (or so I've been told).

Were you never an Altar Boy? I wouldn't say that it inflicts pain, exactly ... but it can get awfully hot in the Summertime, wearing a cassock and surplice over dress clothes (including a necktie).

32 posted on 11/28/2006 6:22:42 AM PST by ArrogantBustard (Western Civilisation is aborting, buggering, and contracepting itself out of existence.)
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To: Joseph DeMaistre
Haven't read all of these articles, but the read like the "Evangelical theocrats" fear mongering that is common here and elsewhere.

They are trying to turn the Catholic Church against itself much like the way they turned many against the evangelicals.
33 posted on 11/28/2006 6:30:54 AM PST by redgolum ("God is dead" -- Nietzsche. "Nietzsche is dead" -- God.)
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To: Joseph DeMaistre
A diocese that includes 130,000 Catholics residing in 27 countries of northwest Missouri, KC-St. Joe has long been known as a bastion of Catholic progressiveness.

Uh no. If he means Catholic liberalism, then he is definately wrong. The midwest Catholic church is however more independent from politics, unlike in many places in the northeast like Boston.

34 posted on 11/28/2006 6:34:08 AM PST by KC_Conspirator
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To: redgolum

They can try to turn Conservative Catholics against each other, but so did the Communists and the French Revolution. They failed. Catholics have the papacy and the magisterium to act as their Northern star.

Evangelicals do not. Protestantism inevitably collapses when confronted by Revolution. The Catholic Church suffers blows, but has always proven resilient in the long run.

Secularism may have the upper hand today, but it may not 200 years from now. Progressive "Catholics" aren't Catholic, period.


35 posted on 11/28/2006 7:33:35 AM PST by Joseph DeMaistre (There's no such thing as relativism, only dogmatism of a different color)
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To: sageb1

When I first saw BCE and CE I read it without thinking as Before Christian Era and Christian Era. I thought it was just
the academic writer in Biblical Archaeology Review getting fancy with the terms. When I found out it was supposed to be Common Era it just seemed contrived and petty.


36 posted on 11/28/2006 8:10:14 AM PST by ThanhPhero (di hanh huong den La Vang)
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To: Joseph DeMaistre
I'm here in the Eparchy of Passaic

That is Eastern Rite, yes? I am amazed. When out of area (I am Roman Rite) for Sunday I have always looked for an Eastern Rite Mass because I expect that I will find no dancing girls and no innovative priests either, just a proper predictable orthodox Mass. Going into strange Roman rite churches when in another city, I have found them, indeed, strange.

37 posted on 11/28/2006 8:15:58 AM PST by ThanhPhero (di hanh huong den La Vang)
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To: Joseph DeMaistre
Evangelicals do not. Protestantism inevitably collapses when confronted by Revolution. The Catholic Church suffers blows, but has always proven resilient in the long run.

I would disagree with that. Many examples to the contrary. But the problem in the US for both cultural Catholics, and cultural Protestants is that most in the the US have no real sense of history. Each generation seeks to reinvent themselves (which is normal in a way), but for the last hundred years or so in the USA, the older generation has not transmitted their values. So we get where we are today.

38 posted on 11/28/2006 9:40:32 AM PST by redgolum ("God is dead" -- Nietzsche. "Nietzsche is dead" -- God.)
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To: redgolum

I am referring to those Catholics who are committed to their faith.


39 posted on 11/28/2006 9:48:31 AM PST by Joseph DeMaistre (There's no such thing as relativism, only dogmatism of a different color)
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To: Joseph DeMaistre
I am referring to those Catholics who are committed to their faith.

In which case you are probably correct. But a committed non Catholic Christian can also weather the gales of revolution.

40 posted on 11/28/2006 1:23:16 PM PST by redgolum ("God is dead" -- Nietzsche. "Nietzsche is dead" -- God.)
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