Does the Bible EVER talk about the importance of being justified before man? First, Abraham didn't HAVE any witnesses to be justified before! Who but the angel of the Lord and Isaac were present? The angel SPECIFICALLY told Abraham "NOW I KNOW". Not, now, man considers you justified.
This seems strangely at odds with Christ, who talks about the Pharisees desiring to be justified before men. When does Jesus talk about men being justified before men (and not God) as a good thing - similar to Abraham?
Yes, but he didn't receive imputated Rightousness in Gen.12, he received in in Gen.15
He was righteous in Genesis 12 for obeying God despite not knowing what lay ahead. When God says someone is righteous, that man IS righteous, imputed or infused...
I think you mean Gen.22, but once again, that only showed that he had been saved, it didn't add any Rightousness to him.
He was being declared righteous - thus, justification is a process. If God declared Abraham righteous more than once, than justification is not a one time event.
The beginning of the faith issue begins in James 2:14, begins with 'what does it profit, my brethren though a man say he hath faith and hath not works, can faith save him?
You are assuming that it means eternal damnation, but there are other things that a believer has to worry about, like discipline from the Lord.
First, the discussion about faith begins before James 2:14. Thus, the rhetorical question doesn't just pop out of thin air!!! Secondly, it refers to eternal damnation, because James is speaking to people who already HAVE been saved through Baptism. James is saying that a person who merely SAYS they have faith has a dead faith. He goes on to show his readers through the use of Abraham that a person is properly justified by faith working in love (as Paul would say). Works alone doesn't save, but neither does faith alone. It is difficult how you could miss that.
He was justified by works, works that showed his faith.
Let's try another approach... Does a person have faith, so-called saving faith, if he does not have works? It is clear in Paul's example of Abraham that Abraham WAS INDEED "working" or doing something. His faith was "working". Thus, a faith without works is lifeless, as Paul and James and Jesus all say.
Faith alone is dead.
Regards
Then how do we know what happened?
It was history that was revealed to us and glorified God.
As for God now knowing, do you think God did not always know what Abraham would do?
That is simply an a figure of speech, known as Anthropopatheia (Ascribing to God what belongs to Human and rational beings...)
In fact, it made the faith hall of fame in Hebrews 11.
This seems strangely at odds with Christ, who talks about the Pharisees desiring to be justified before men. When does Jesus talk about men being justified before men (and not God) as a good thing - similar to Abraham?
Being justified before God showing obedience to God's will, is what God wants, and that is what God revealed about what Abraham did, showing Abraham's growth as a 'Friend of God'.
Yes, but he didn't receive imputated Rightousness in Gen.12, he received in in Gen.15 He was righteous in Genesis 12 for obeying God despite not knowing what lay ahead. When God says someone is righteous, that man IS righteous, imputed or infused...
It does not say that Abraham had any Righteousness imputated to him in Gen.12, only that he obeyed what God told him to do.
The only time that imputated righteousness is mentioned is in Gen.15.
So, you are going to have to show by scripture where rightousness is imputated more then once.
I think you mean Gen.22, but once again, that only showed that he had been saved, it didn't add any Rightousness to him. He was being declared righteous - thus, justification is a process. If God declared Abraham righteous more than once, than justification is not a one time event.
No, the scripture is not referring to that of sacrificing Issac, but is a reference to Gen.15, when Righteousness was imputated to him.
James 2:23 is speaking to the revealing of that righteousness by his works, not any added righteousness being added.
Friend of God is a sign of maturity, not salvation.
Not everyone who is saved is called the 'friend of God', like Lot for example.
The beginning of the faith issue begins in James 2:14, begins with 'what does it profit, my brethren though a man say he hath faith and hath not works, can faith save him? You are assuming that it means eternal damnation, but there are other things that a believer has to worry about, like discipline from the Lord. First, the discussion about faith begins before James 2:14. Thus, the rhetorical question doesn't just pop out of thin air!!! Secondly, it refers to eternal damnation, because James is speaking to people who already HAVE been saved through Baptism. James is saying that a person who merely SAYS they have faith has a dead faith. He goes on to show his readers through the use of Abraham that a person is properly justified by faith working in love (as Paul would say). Works alone doesn't save, but neither does faith alone. It is difficult how you could miss that.
No, the faith question begins in vs.14.
The first 9 verses are talking about how one is suppose to not favor the rich over the poor.
10-13 talks about the fact that if you break one law, you have broken them all.
Vs 14 begins the discussion on faith and those who say they have it but do not produce any works to show they do.
As for Baptism, No one is saved by water Baptism (which I assume you are talking about), and it is not even mentioned in the chapter.
Abraham is a saved man, showing his salvation by his works, not a man being saved by his works.
The works show his maturity not his salvation.
He was justified by works, works that showed his faith. Let's try another approach... Does a person have faith, so-called saving faith, if he does not have works? It is clear in Paul's example of Abraham that Abraham WAS INDEED "working" or doing something. His faith was "working". Thus, a faith without works is lifeless, as Paul and James and Jesus all say.
No, Paul says very clearly in Rom.4:5, that to one who worketh not, but believeth....
Thus, works are removed from salvation.
They have to do with Christian growth, not salvation.
Faith alone is dead.
No, but those who reject it are.
I notice that you did not even attempt to answer Rom.4:5.
You did not address the issue of Lot and his salvation despite not having any works
But to him that worketh not
I think we have reached the end of this discussion.
Thank you.