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To: Kolokotronis; jo kus; kosta50; Agrarian
Hi Kolo, thank you very much for that article about St. Gregory Palamas. I read the whole thing, and found it very helpful. There were enough terms in it with which I am still not comfortable using, so I don't think I have a solid understanding yet, but I do think I made a lot of progress. I think I get the difference between created and uncreated spirit, but I am not sure about grace. If the parallel holds, would created graces be things we might ordinarily call "blessings"? Uncreated grace is contrasted as that which exists only in people who have reached theosis?

I think that's where I got lost sometimes, when it "appeared" to me that there was some crossover between created/uncreated and the effects. For example:

"Life to the body is granted by the human spirit and real life to the soul is granted by the divine spirit. That is why the abandonment of the soul by the vivifying divine spirit causes its spiritual death, just as the abandonment of the body by the vivifying human spirit causes its physical death."

But then three sentences later, it says:

The death of the body is an inevitable consequence of the spiritual death of the soul, which is extended to the human spirit: the power which vivifies the body.

My poor little brain. :) I think I just need to get more familiar with the concepts on a definitional level, and then it will be much easier to relate them to one another. I am definitely going to bookmark this for further study. Thanks again.

One difference between Catholics and Orthodox I "think" I see is that to the Orthodox, divine grace is a lifelong pursuit that is never fully grasped until theosis is achieved. Catholics might say that sanctifying grace is achieved at Baptism. (Of course, this could be completely wrong, but I'm trying. :)

5,840 posted on 05/07/2006 3:21:48 PM PDT by Forest Keeper
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To: Forest Keeper; Kolokotronis
Ugh, I am not relishing the upcoming conversations on defining grace... Thanks, Kolo! Well, I guess it gives me an opportunity to learn more about it!

Catholics might say that sanctifying grace is achieved at Baptism.

Yes, we receive sanctifying grace at Baptism, but we continue to grow in this grace during our sanctification. This is one reason why Catholics see "Grace" as a created thing (as well as uncreated), since uncreated grace doesn't "grow" - it is impossible for God to "grow". Sanctifying grace is the most important thing to have in our souls - as it guarantees heaven if we have it when we die. It indicates we are in friendship with God, even if this level of grace is not that of a "saint".

Regards

5,847 posted on 05/07/2006 5:05:06 PM PDT by jo kus (I will run the way of thy commandments, when thou shalt enlarge my heart...Psalm 119:32)
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