Free Republic
Browse · Search
Religion
Topics · Post Article

To: SoothingDave; blue-duncan
If you can grant that things may not be what they appear, then you can grant that transubstantiation is a possiblity.

Transubstantiation is a possibility and I suppose so is the idea that Jesus was made of bread. The problem is that all evidence points to the fact that no "transubstantiation" takes place and that from a physical standpoint the bread starts out as bread and ends up as bread and nothing physical occurs to change it.

Your idea that things may not seem as they appear brings up an interesting premise. The earth appears to be 6 Billion years old, but the bible states that it was created about 6000 years ago in six days. Yet most Catholics scoff at the idea that God literally created the universe in 6 days, yet they buy into the idea that the bread is really flesh despite the fact that by all appearances it is nothing more than bread.

Why can't you guys buy into a 6 day creation if you so readily accept that something that is by all "appearances" bread is really human flesh?

148 posted on 12/07/2005 6:15:01 PM PST by P-Marlowe
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 135 | View Replies ]


To: P-Marlowe
Yet most Catholics scoff at the idea that God literally created the universe in 6 days, yet they buy into the idea that the bread is really flesh despite the fact that by all appearances it is nothing more than bread.

Why can't you guys buy into a 6 day creation if you so readily accept that something that is by all "appearances" bread is really human flesh?

Because the Church sees the Gospels as eyewitness accounts of Jesus' ministry, while the Pentateuch, the prophets, and apocalyptic literature employed both literal recounts and literary devices unique to the time those texts were written. The Catholic Church, going back even to Saint Augustine, has maintained that the story of creation is not to be taken as a literal unfolding of a week of 24-hour days. It's impossible even from a literal stand point since God did not create time until the fourth "day". How were the first three days "marked", exactly?

Augustine believed that the "six days" were actually one "day" - you know - "this is THE DAY the Lord has made". (Sirach: "God created ALL THINGS SIMULTANEOUSLY"); And that this single "day" is re-presented six times to the reader (or listener) of Sacred Scripture as a means of condescending to our finite brainpower and general lack of understanding of how God thinks and behaves. It goes much deeper than that, however. You have to understand the importance of numerology in Old Testament society to know that the number "seven" in Hebrew ('sheva') means "to swear an oath [upon something]". In the story of creation, God builds Himself a house to dwell in (earth and all its inhabitants). On the seventh day, He "sevens" Himself - He swears an oath upon Himself and accepts Adam (man) as a member of His family, as part of this household He's set up. Of course, Adam and Eve promptly throw that gift away. Man becomes alienated from God's family due to Original Sin, which is expiated through Baptism, when Catholics teach that a person (infant, child, adult, whatever) is accepted into God's covenant established in Creation. But the early believers of Yaweh knew exactly what was meant by the use of "seven" days.

The seventh day, the time of "rest", is not just about giving the Sabbath as a day of rest - it also refers to the "day" when we enter God's rest in eternity.

And that's just for starters.

A prominent Catholic theologian (and former Protestant preacher) once said, "the Protestant churches love reading the menu (the Bible). They'll read it over and over and over and over... But they never sit down to the meal (the Eucharist)."

Why is it that Protestants believe that Christ could change water into wine at Cana, but couldn't change bread and wine into His body and blood? It doesn't compute.

155 posted on 12/08/2005 5:27:20 AM PST by Rutles4Ever
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 148 | View Replies ]

To: P-Marlowe
Transubstantiation is a possibility and I suppose so is the idea that Jesus was made of bread. The problem is that all evidence points to the fact that no "transubstantiation" takes place and that from a physical standpoint the bread starts out as bread and ends up as bread and nothing physical occurs to change it.

Perhaps you need to spend a little more time studying "transubstantiation." You still don't understand it, so you still make nonsensical statements.

SD

159 posted on 12/08/2005 6:55:12 AM PST by SoothingDave
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 148 | View Replies ]

Free Republic
Browse · Search
Religion
Topics · Post Article


FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson