Posted on 12/08/2004 11:08:38 PM PST by Mike10542
Hey fellow freepers, having been swept up in the battle of conservatives first liberals and believers in God vs. non-beleivers I clearly have chosen the right side here (hence me writing on Free Republic). The alignment of Jews like myself and many fellow Christians is one that I feel is very necesary to win the war against evil and have peace in our time. Although I choose to ignore all the leftists and others who try to break up this loving partnership by saying "They are only on your side becuase they want the Jews in control of Jerusalem so Christ returns," I am looking to explore what the Bible really teaches about the Jewish fate from the Christian perspective. It is hard to find what the majority opinion is because the internet is, well, the internet. What I have made out so far is that during rapture I beleive 2/3's of Jews are killed, but one third survive. So my questions are:
1) What do the 2/3's of Jews die from (war, just happens????)
2) What happens to the remaning 1/3 of Jews after they survive?
3) Do any of this remaining 1/3 of Jews make it past the final judgement of God (some interpertations say no, others say the remaining Jews are allowed to pass once accepting God and I think Christ)
I truly beleive in my Jewish fate as I have been raised Jewish, but my mom is Christian. So each religion I respect and believe are good. Ultimately, I hope us Jews and Christians both make it together to the promised land (and only the Muslims are sent to hell!)
Thanks for all your answers. Also, feel free to direct me to anywhere where I can learn more about this subject.
BTW, it's not nice to refer to another poster without pinging them.
Christ saved all of us but it is up to each individual to receive His gift.
You are correct about prayers and as I now retire to bed, I shall include him.
Have a good night and a Merry Christmas!
Thank you, same to you. :)
However, there is not much hope of your understanding it all unless you are willing to read - without bias -the entire Torah, Prophets and the B'rit Chadasha (renewed convenant).
In Isaiah 53, a portion of scripture that is rarely if ever read in synagogue, the prophet speaks of the suffering servant (Yeshua - which translated means 'and he will save his people from their sin').
If you will read and consider who this servant might be, comparing both Jewish writings AND respected Christian commentaries, you will be hard pressed to come to any conclusion other than that Yeshua is the Messiah. No other explanation is borne out by Scripture, and the Rabinnic explanations generally obfuscate the issue and generally contradict themselves in the process.
Regarding the Rapture (harpatzo in the Greek, meaning to "catch away") it is prophesied to occur "when the fullness of the gentiles be come in".
The nation of Israel was to be "a light to the Gentiles", but they failed. The church is supposed to bless Israel and pray for the peace of Jerusalem, and they also failed. The church is trending that way now, but many still follow a "replacement theology" wherein the term "Israel" is spiritualized and the church has redefined itself as "spiritual Israel" - even though Romans 9,10 & 11 make it unmistakably clear that G-d will never forsake his people. The book of Daniel, most notably Chapters 9 and 12, Daniel is given visions from G-d, through His messenger Michael, of the unfolding history up to and including the "end-times". And in Chap. 12, Verse 1, Michael says "and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a naiton even to that same time: and at that time thy people shall be delivered, every one that shall be found written in the book.Which book would that be? The Lamb's Book of Life - written in Yeshua's blood that was shed for the whole world, as well as for His people Israel, most of whome, heartbreakingly, rejected His messiaship.
The "time of trouble" is the "time of Jacob's trouble - a time the church refers to as the great tribulation. It is at the end of that time that the plan of redemption will come to its fulfilment in Yeshua's return to claim of his people - those who have accepted his identity as Redeemer and L-d of L-ds, the one who reconciles the world to the G-dhead. At that time there will be neither Jew nor Gentile, but rather only each individual's belief in Him, and in His purpose for being born, crucified and resurrected.
If you will examine ALL of the evidence, you will be able to come to your own conclusion. Hope this helps.
>Indeed, it is. This is why people like Bandaneira need our
>understanding, patience and prayers. Afterall, Christ died
>for him too.
AMEN!!!
Christians are redeened BY the REDEEMER! And belief that the Christ died for us and living as we should,is how we are saved.You said something akin to that,hence,you discredited /refuted yourself. LOL
If you don't believe that, you most certainly are not a Christian.
That's not an optional belief.
It's as fundamental as any principle of Christianity.
Ephesians
2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves:
it is the gift of God:
2:9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.
I'm sorry to have to tell you this, but your understanding of orthodox Christian theology is sorely lacking.
Real Christians pray that all people are saved. Jesus did not teach us to pray our enemies go to hell.
Someone asked about the RAPTURE,which is not Biblical prophesy;"THE RAPTURE" isn't in the Bible. It's a relatively "new" idea,which was an extrapolation on Revelations and goodness knows what else.
What do you imagine bothers me...the Second Coming,or some tinfoil Christian fiction? Take your choice.Here's a hint,it isn't the former. :-)
Interesting concepts. But may I ask, how do you decide what is "evil"? If I slap you in the face, you might get upset. But in my universe, slapping is perfectly acceptable, and besides, you have no rights in my universe, only I do So YOU are the evil one for trying to stop me from exercising my right to follow my "good" beliefs.
Also, what do you mean by "divinity"???? Please define the term.
How about "redeem" - redeem from what? And exactly what is the "course of human history"? And if you have the power to "change" it, you can only prove that by revealing what was to be versus the "changed" version.Can you do that? And exactly what's being "changed"?
Why not read the oldest source book on human history - the Bible - and see exactly how history can be written in advance?
I am a Christian,though many so called Christians on FR,make me wonder if they are.
Reread what I wrote and if you are still in a quandary,get someone with better comprehension skills to explain it to you.
You need to do some reading in your Bible, you are embarrassing yourself.
1 Thessalonians
4:15 For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which
are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent
them which are asleep.
4:16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with
the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead
in Christ shall rise first:
4:17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together
with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we
ever be with the Lord.
4:18 Wherefore comfort one another with these words.
Read post # 112
People like you,who make ridiculous statements,such as "you need to do some reading in your Bible",for example. You have no idea if I've ever read the Bible,or how many times I've read.LOL
The historical fact is,generation after generation have thought that they were living in the "END TIMES",since Jesus was crucified.They weren't. Will they come? When GOD sees fit.
OTOH,there is NOTHING at all in any scripture,which says what the modern novels say will happen and the RAPTURE stuff is NOT a universally Christian ethos/principle.
Good night, my friend. Keep studying your Bible
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