Posted on 11/22/2004 4:51:06 PM PST by Land of the Irish
Then take a hike.
I didn't realize I was arguing stupidly.
I hope in the future I can meet your lofty expectations. Heaven knows I wouldn't want to offend you as you have no problem offending the rest of us.
And by the way, Perricone IS Opus Dei. So is Barreiro in Rome who has already taken over another independent chapel.
You can stick that in your delicate sensibilities.
They had women in polyester pants suit distributing the Eucharist while some flamer played "On Eagles Wings" on the organ? Yeah, I believe that.
Like hell it does. I've read it. Structure does not equal substance.
Remember what it says on the posting thing: Loose lips sink ships.!! ahha
So it says something about gyrating hips, hollering, dressing up like a clown, or having lowering mass attendence? (of course, Im refering to a good portion of the N.O. masses ive seen, except for the clown thing. Maybe there are a good number of good priests trying to escape from the hippie like antics of the Church hierarchy)
THE 60's ARE OVER SINK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
You support bullshit polemics? Or rather, sound and well reasoned argumentation?
Is this the only evidence you can cite? HMMMM!?
Uh, The Didache is equal in structure and substance.
Or, if you prefer, here's Justin, Martyr's account from the CCC:
1345 As early as the second century we have the witness of St. Justin Martyr for the basic lines of the order of the Eucharistic celebration. They have stayed the same until our own day for all the great liturgical families. St. Justin wrote to the pagan emperor Antoninus Pius (138-161) around the year 155, explaining what Christians did:
On the day we call the day of the sun, all who dwell in the city or country gather in the same place. The memoirs of the apostles and the writings of the prophets are read, as much as time permits.
When the reader has finished, he who presides over those gathered admonishes and challenges them to imitate these beautiful things.
Then we all rise together and offer prayers* for ourselves . . .and for all others, wherever they may be, so that we may be found righteous by our life and actions, and faithful to the commandments, so as to obtain eternal salvation.
When the prayers are concluded we exchange the kiss.
Then someone brings bread and a cup of water and wine mixed together to him who presides over the brethren.
He takes them and offers praise and glory to the Father of the universe, through the name of the Son and of the Holy Spirit and for a considerable time he gives thanks (in Greek: eucharistian) that we have been judged worthy of these gifts.
When he has concluded the prayers and thanksgivings, all present give voice to an acclamation by saying: 'Amen.'
When he who presides has given thanks and the people have responded, those whom we call deacons give to those present the "eucharisted" bread, wine and water and take them to those who are absent.
My point is, Mr Sink Spur, that what you are providing is structural at best. It is not conclusive and provides little insight into the substance of the ritual itself. Your claim has been refuted many times over. Is that all you got?
You need to do a search on this forum for past Opus Dei threads. There is plenty of evidence within and outside this forum.
A high index of suspicion has been raised for Perricone with documentation he gave an Opus Dei retreat (hint: OD priests are capable of giving their own retreats. Kind of difficult to give an OD retreat unless you have been trained according to their ideology).
Here is Barreiro:
To: Dajjal; Land of the Irish
You do know Fr. Ignacio was educated at Opus Dei's Roman Seminary?
Do you still think they are a no good organization?
7 posted on 10/10/2003 7:15:36 AM PDT by Hermann the Cherusker
http://209.157.64.200/focus/f-religion/998558/posts
It has never been refuted. It is, in fact, the substance of the ritual.
Does Justin, Martyr's account more closely reflect the Novus Ordo, or the Tridentine?
I'll check it out. Thanks and God Bless!
Opus Dei is a cult. Opus Dei hates tradition. Opus dei loves the Novus Ordo. Opus Dei defends EVERYTHING JPII does. Those things aren't good in my book.
Yada, yada, yada. I know the accusations. I'm not disagreeing. I am saying that this is a public forum. You are accusing someone of something publicly without backing anything up. Accusations without proof are baseless and defamatory.
OK. Believe whatever you want. The evidence is clear, AFIAC.
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.