Losing My Religion

Sonoma County Independent ^ | April 2-8, 1998 | David Templeton

[Gamecock]

I honestly don't know much about CC. Please share your expiriences with this Church in supporting or refuting this article.

[Maximilian]

"This is not religion," we were told, and quickly parroted to our wide-eyed friends and family, "this is a relationship!" That relationship with Jesus was further expressed, and distanced, from the incense-and-icon atmosphere of Catholicism and other formal expressions of divine longing by the instantly recognizable symbol that had become Calvary's logo: not a cross or crucifix (too negative, too brooding), but a dove, an oddly misshapen outline of a descending dove that resembled a melting B-52 on a suicide dive. We loved it, dutifully scribbling the shape in the margins of our Bibles, wearing it on T-shirts, and dangling it from chains around our necks.

I wonder if this is where the Cleveland diocese got the inspiration for their gay logo?

[Gamecock]

Comments like these make my wonder about the fruit being tilled:

We even held communion services, using peanut-butter sandwiches and grape soda for the sacraments.

and

I remember Sandy, a fierce 10th-grade convert. While out on a "harvesting trip" at the local mall, she once chose to literally soil herself rather than locate a restroom and risk letting the couple she was preaching to escape. Later on, during an emotional prayer meeting at the church, she stood up to testify, stating ecstatically, "I wet my pants for Jesus!"

Not once did anyone suggest that perhaps she was losing perspective.

Will our Arminian friends agree with me, seeing how by their theology one can scare people away from Christ by wetting themselves?

[Gamecock]

You want a pic?

[Diago]

not a cross or crucifix (too negative, too brooding), but a dove, an oddly misshapen outline of a descending dove that resembled a melting B-52 on a suicide dive.

"I wonder if this is where the Cleveland diocese got the inspiration for their gay logo?"

Max, I may owe the gay gestapo an apology. I had thought it was inspired by Satan.

[drstevej]

***Later on, during an emotional prayer meeting at the church, she stood up to testify, stating ecstatically, "I wet my pants for Jesus!"***

To paraphrase the late Lewis Grizzard,

"D*mn, sister, I don't believe I'd a told that!"

[Wrigley]

Do new Calvary Chapels pay a "franchise" fee to Chuck Smith's church?

[PetroniusMaximus]

I'm not defending this church but this man sounds like a surface conversion.

No change of heart.

No mention of repenting.

[lockeliberty]

Thanks, that explains a lot.

[fishtank]

"The bottom line that led to my escape, however, is a less philosophical question: If Jesus truly lives in my heart, I asked, why do I still feel so god-damned empty?"

King David wrote down lots of his frustrations - with and about God, but I don't think he ever cursed Him. Correct me if I'm wrong.

[fishtank]

"But I will never again believe that I am so wretched that no one but Jesus can love me."

Hmmm. I'd put this another way. An individual can be so bad that no one but Jesus would love him.

[fishtank]

For the record, I don't know enough about CC to comment on them. My comments were about Rick Ross's attitudes.

[drstevej]

This is a hit piece. I give it no creedence.

I am unfamiliar with Calvary Chapels, but this isn't the guy I want for a tour guide.

[Calvinist_Dark_Lord]

Regretabbly, this sounds as if it's a hit piece on Calvary Chapel in particular, and churches in general. While not in a "charismatic" group, i am a member of a Reformed Denomination that has several "Mega-Churches" (Large amounts of parishioners, >5,000 every Sunday). The fact of the matter is that as many people are going out the back door as come in the front, and Growth is stagnant, or vvvvvveeeeeeeeerrrrrrrryyyyyyyy slow.

The psychobabble presented can be made to apply to any church, denominational or nondenominational, and i would be slow to accept what the critics don't know the first thing about in spite of their "past experience".

It appears that Calvary Chapel is guilty of nothing more than human failure, and that is hardly unique to any congregation of the Christian Church.

i seem to remember Jesus saying

"Many are called, but few are chosen"

Which is the best explanation that i've heard for those who "fall away".

[P-Marlowe]

Comments like these make my wonder about the fruit being tilled.....

Comments like these tell me something about the agenda of the author of the article:

The same huge parking lot--which once seemed unfillable, even by the large numbers of people attending services 17 years ago--is packed with cars bearing anti-choice bumper stickers and glib slogans: "Life without Jesus is Hell."

I suggest that if he's looking for a Church that he can feel comfortable in, that he contact Bishop Gene Robinson for a recommendation.

[P-Marlowe]

...allow me to explain that "backslider" is born-again slang; it means ex-Christian. It's not a compliment.

I've never heard the term "backslider" to refer to an "ex-Christian." I've been a member of this "Cult" for over 30 years. My pastor always refers to backsliding as what we do when we stop moving forward in the Lord. When we sit stationary in our walk we backslide. His phrase is "if you are not moving forward, you are sliding back."

If someone refers to themselves as an "ex-Christian" they are not backsliding. They are off the slide altogether.

This guy apparently thinks that because Calvary Chapel did not fill his "needs" that Christ has failed him. But its not about filling his "needs" is it? It is about Christ changning us so that our will and his will are in conformity.

I suspect that this guy always wanted a God that would fill his needs and he never found it. IMO he never found it because he wasn't looking to find God, he was looking to find himself. Well you won't find yourself if you are looking for God. You will lose yourself.

He never learned that lesson. It's no wonder he didn't find what he was looking for at Calvary Chapel. They don't sell that there.

[Gamecock]

Well, like I said, I don't know a lot about them. Please show me where the writer is wrong.

[Calvinist_Dark_Lord]

I've never heard the term "backslider" to refer to an "ex-Christian." I've been a member of this "Cult" for over 30 years. My pastor always refers to backsliding as what we do when we stop moving forward in the Lord. When we sit stationary in our walk we backslide. His phrase is "if you are not moving forward, you are sliding back."

That's the first thing that made me suspicious. Who ever this person is, (s)he doesn't seem to have picked up the "lingo" or nuances of "Evangelicaleese". One would think that somebody associated with those Bigoted fundamentalists for that many years could at least speak the language correctly.

If someone refers to themselves as an "ex-Christian" they are not backsliding. They are off the slide altogether.

Or was at best a "social member" who showed up to put on a religious show, or could it beeeeeeeeeeeee...had another agenda??

This guy apparently thinks that because Calvary Chapel did not fill his "needs" that Christ has failed him. But its not about filling his "needs" is it? It is about Christ changning us so that our will and his will are in conformity.

"But, but, but...that means i can't bugger little boys any more, or support murdering babies, or supporting the genocidal policies of left wing dictators and oligarchies, or....i'd have to subjugate my desires to someone else and feel bad about all of the above, can't have that!"

I suspect that this guy always wanted a God that would fill his needs and he never found it. IMO he never found it because he wasn't looking to find God, he was looking to find himself. Well you won't find yourself if you are looking for God. You will lose yourself.

He found what he was looking for. Behold, the Gloria Patri to his god:

Oh Lord it's hard to be humble, When you're perfect in every way, i can't wait to look in the mirror, Cause i get better lookin each day!
To know me is to love me, i must be a hell of a man! Oh Lord it's hard to be humble, But i'm doin the best that i can. (With apologies to Mac Davis)

He never learned that lesson. It's no wonder he didn't find what he was looking for at Calvary Chapel. They don't sell that there.

Councellor, you have no need to defend against this piece of garbage, most of us saw right through it, and beat you to the punch on this one. However, if you want to play prosecuting attourney on the witness, be my guest, it will be amusing.