Let the neo-cons bellow, just bring the troops home

The Seattle Times ^ | 9/24/03 | Bruce Ramsey

[Burkeman1]

George, here's what to do in Iraq: Declare victory and bring the troops home.

A senator from Vermont once suggested such a policy during the Vietnam War. It would have meant a defeat. In this case, it might mean chaos, at least for a while, unless you can get more international help.

You asked for help from the U.N. That was good. Get back to them and say, "We're serious. We're on a fast track to leave."

To America's soldiers, you can say: "You're fighters, not social workers. The fighting's done, excellent work, and you can start going home."

Thousands of American families will thank you.

To the American people, you can say: "We've changed our minds about the occupation of Iraq. We'll need only part of that $87 billion I asked for. The rest you can keep."

Watch your poll numbers go up.

The warrior intellectuals — the neoconservatives — will bellow. Let them. They don't have any electoral votes. The American people never bought their "neo-Wilsonian" fantasies of empire. Asserting American dominance was never your argument for war. You said Americans had to depose Saddam Hussein in order to protect themselves.

That's done.

Our occupation of Iraq is not yet six months old and already Iraqis are making sure that we tire of it. This will not tend to get better. An antiwar feeling has arisen in the United States, and Howard Dean, a nobody from a small state, has ridden it to the head of the pack. Dean says he wouldn't have gone to war in the first place. Few notice that Dean also says we ought to stay in Iraq to do nation-building.

"Well, Howard," you can say, "I'm bringing the troops home. If you're elected, you can send them back."

Would America be giving up if we did that? We would be giving up the right to reconstruct Iraq our way. We would not be giving up anything the average American cares about.

Certainly, the American people would accept a change in policy. They have accepted the official story from the start — the weapons of mass destruction, the "link" between Saddam and bin Laden, the "Woman Warrior" story about Pvt. Jessica Lynch. They are not paying much attention to Iraq. They will accept a pullout.

Consider the alternative: Five years of occupation. Maybe 10. Bombs, demonstrations, dead Americans.

Think of the Democrats. In 2002 you beat them by offering to save America from a foreign threat. If you do that in 2004, you're going to be in trouble. Americans get tired of wars that drag on and on, and tend to toss out the political party that does the dragging. Look up the election of 1952. Also 1968. Ask your dad about the political shelf-life of military victory. It is less than one year.

Think of the economy. Business has been terrible since you became president. The people have been pretty forgiving about that. They know the dot-com bust was not your doing (nor Clinton's, really). You have given the people a tax cut, and Alan Greenspan has given them rock-bottom interest rates. In normal times, these would produce a snapping recovery. But war sits on business confidence like a fat man on a dog.

Your war, a Republican war, of which the politically profitable part is over. We are now in the losing part. The occupation of Iraq could drag on well past November 2004.

But you can forestall that. Lean on the U.N. for troops. Lean on the Egyptians; they owe us a favor or two for the billions we've doled out to them. Speed up the creation of an Iraqi government. You don't need to wait for elections. That's Iraq's business.

Then you can announce that most of the troops will be home by Christmas and you will not be needing all of that $87 billion.

Watch Wall Street jump. The dollar, too.

Nobody expects you to do this. It will shock your friends, but what's more, it will confound your enemies. It will also steer the Republican Party back toward that nationalistic but "humble" foreign policy you described three years ago, which best suits the interests, and the patience, of those who might vote for you in 2004.

Bruce Ramsey's column appears regularly on editorial pages of The Times. His e-mail address is bramsey@seattletimes.com

Copyright © 2003 The Seattle Times Company

[Billthedrill]

The 9/11 attacks were perpetrated by a terrorist organization with no ties to Iraq.

Well, not exactly. There has been no demostrated tie between Iraq and the atrocity perpetrated on 9/11, but there is definite physical evidence of ties between Iraq and al-Qaeda. Salman Pak, for example. Numerous intercepts that have been made public. Established relationships between Iraqi intelligence and members of al-Qaeda. Saddam actively cultivated relationships with a large number of Islamic organizations (the assertion made earlier that he was strictly secular is ludicrous - that individual may never have seen an Iraqi flag). Some of these that we know are Ansar al-Islam (al-Qaeda offshoot), Mujahedeen Khalq (Iranian Shi'ites), Hezbollah (Lebanese Shi'ites), and of course Hamas, in a big way.

It wasn't even ideological, it was just business, and that business involved terrorism in a large number of states, including Lebanon, Israel, Iran, the Yemen, Somalia, and the U.S., just to name a few off the top of my head. Nor was Saddam the only head of state involved. This whole thing is truly a network, and all sorts of people are playing who in theory would have nothing to do with one another.

[ConservativeStandUP]

You are right, I see the errors of my ways. If we only put all of our troops on the border, we will never, ever, be the victims of terror again.

What's it like to live in your world? Its not 1858, you can't solve our problems by sending the cavalry out to Indian country. I just read your profile, Coolidge was your favorite--it makes a lot of sense now.

But here's a suggestion, pack up the wagon and head on out to Amish country, you'll never have to cope with complicated world problems, like terrorism, or fanaticism...

Oh and by the way, as to reservists not knowing they'd have to fight? That's tantamount to the gay guy who went AWOL and was court martialed by the Marines. He claimed he didn't know the Marines actually killed people...you are in great company.

[Long Cut]

I got your little FReepmail, Lips. Nice...you've become Billy Badass again! I'd love to take you up on it, because I could use the practice and the fun, but as I'm RIGHT NOW, OVERSEAS, AWAY FROM MY FAMILY, defending YOUR right to stay home and cry in your beer about "statism" (while, of course, being utterly safe), I'm too busy collecting those "welfare checks" to bother right now. I'm facing real enemies, not schoolboys who can't grow up.

Keep trolling, tough guy. You'll find some Soldier, Marine, or Sailor someday who'll be more than happy to accommodate you. I just hope it's me.

Gods, people like you are so worthless. The sad thing is, you actually believe that YOU, yellow stripe and all, are what stands betwixt us and tyrranny. It is to laugh...

[68-69TonkinGulfYachtClub]

Long Cut said to Burkeman1 in post 223
"I got your little FReepmail, Lips. Nice...you've become Billy Badass again!"

Burkeman1 : You STILL don't get it do you?
This is the 2nd time, that I know of, that you have made negative posts
about the military AND active duty FReepers.
We, at Free Republic, support the military.

PRO MILITARY PING

[MEG33]

I am always ready for a pro military ping!We are accomplishing more great things in Iraq.The majority of Iraqis want us there.

We are training more border guards,soldiers and policemen.

Our doctors and medics are training the ambulance drivers to do more than pick up the person and hope to make it to a doctor.Our medics are being recertified as they help others.

We are catching bad guys and digging up caches of arms that can no longer be used against us.God bless our military!

[Soaring Feather]

Pro Military bump!!!!

Thanks Tonkin!

[Poohbah]

Pro military PONG! to your PING!

[MEG33]

Soldiers were paid in the Revolutionary war..poorly and late,but they were paid.If you doubt it google it.

[PigRigger]

Couldn't have said it better myself.

[sheltonmac]

I never said soldiers weren't paid.

[.cnI redruM]

>>>>>Our standing army paid for by you and me are not patriots but welfare recipients.

1) First of all, it was paid for by you and I. If you intend to disparage and condescend, at least get your grammar straight. Nothing is more grating than receiving vituperation from a man illiterate in his native tongue. The soldiers in America's standing army fight for your right to speak freely, not your right to mangle Standard American English.

2) Soldiers are no more welfare recipients than policemen, firefighters or ambulance crewmembers sitting around the station awaiting the unfortunate call to duty. We pay them to be ready in the event they are needed.

3) Armies of true patriots are a wonderful concept until your enemy shows up with digitally integrated networks of mutually supporting armored vehicles, field artillary, and close air support. At this juncture some faux-David Koresh and his militia of true conservatives will perform about as well as the real David Koresh performed at Waco when decisively engaged by Barracks Emporer Wastely Clark.

4) Please, go forth and insult your equals. You will, no doubt, find them stinking up a coffee shop in Burlington with their psuedo intellectual, deracinated blither while that standing army of welfare recipients allows them to disparage safely from within the comfortable confines of their persistent, all-encompassing delusions.

[montag813]

From a real conservative.

From a real idiot. Leave and declare victory? Yeah, sure. More like leave with our tail between our legs and to the ridicule of the world and the Democrats. What a dope this writer is.

[MamaB]

Thank you for serving. There are many of us out here who do appreciate it.

[kevao]

If we left now, how long would it be before the Baathists would be back in power to install another strong-man like Saddam (and probably Saddam himself if he's still alive).

Just think: We pull out now and in a few months Saddam Hussein is running Iraq again. And this guy thinks Bush could pass that off as victory?

[boxerblues]

Pro Military bump...

I see someone has been at it again with nothing good to say about the military

[PigRigger]

"invite more attacks like 911..."

These real "conservatives" and "patriots" will never acknowledge this fact.

We no longer live in a world where oceans and distance can protect us from harm. Either we accept the challenge and attempt to provide a solution of our choosing or sit back and wait for hell to reach our shores.

Sorry, although I don't like war nor do I enjoy sending our best and brightest off to fight, I do understand what we are up against.

Honestly, when over 90% of the armed conflicts around the world involve Islamic Fundamentalists can anyone really say there is no threat?

This is WWIII. How we choose to respond will dictate its length and horror.

[MEG33]

Bump!

[HiJinx]

Since you request comments, I would like to offer some.

The derision of our military that comes through loud and clear in your posts is neither wanted nor tolerated here.

God help you if you ever come face to face with any of the warriors currently serving in support of OIF/OEF/ONE.

God help you if you ever denigrate any of the million or so veterans now alive in the US.

You make me sick...to insinuate...no, state...that I am somehow a welfare recipient for serving my country honorably for over 20 years is a slap in the face, a slur on my honor.

Why don't you take your vile drivel elsewhere, to somewhere that someone might actually want to listen to your ignorant bile?

[boxerblues]

Hey Meg! I see this thread or should I say someone is still irritating a lot of people

[MEG33]

You,too, received FReepmail? ..and here I thought I was special......;)