Episcopal Church Problems

vanity | Sunday, August 10, 2003 | altura

[altura]

We had discussed posting what happened in our Episcopal churches this Sunday morning.

I’m in the diocese let by Bishop Stanton, one of the 11 Bishops who walked out of the General Assembly in protest. He wrote a letter to all the parishioners to be read to each congregation by the Priest.

Our Priest did not want to read the letter and said so. However, she did because she had taken a vow to obey the Bishop. In itself the letter didn’t say much other than expressing his deep concern for the direction of the Church and announcing the meeting on October 12th to which all of the Priests and other leaders of the diocese will be expected to attend.

He also mentioned the meeting called in England by the Archbishop of Canterbury.

Prior to her reading this letter, she preached on the lesson from Ephesians, which was read today, quoting the following:

“Put away from you all bitterness and wrath and anger and wrangling and slander, together with all malice, and be kind to one another, tenderhearted, forgiving one another, as God in Christ has forgiven you.”

She also suggested we e-mail Bishop Stanton with our opinions.

Does anyone else have an experience to share?

[altura]

Someone said something about sharing our Sunday morning experiences.

[altura]

ping

[churchillbuff]

Our Priest did not want to read the letter and said so. However, she did because she had taken a vow to obey the Bishop...

Why are you in a parish with a female priest who's OK with ordaining gay bishops? I have to assume you're a theological liberal, or don't care enough to find a parish with an orthodox priest.

[I still care]

In a way I see some good coming out of this. This is forcing people to "come out" in more ways than one. This is almost like dividing the sheep from the goats, although I don't pretend to know your priest's spiritual walk. But it does sound as if she is a liberal interpreter of the gospel.

As to her choice of sermons, it sounds as if she needs to take the WHOLE counsel of the gospel. Here is one from Paul for her (In this he talks about someone who is sleeping with his stepmother, but the thought is the same):

I'll tell you what I would do. Even though I'm not there in person, consider me right there with you, because I can fully see what's going on. I'm telling you that this is wrong. You must not simply look the other way and hope it goes away on its own. Bring it out in the open and deal with it in the authority of Jesus our Master.

Assemble the community--I'll be present in spirit with you and our Master Jesus will be present in power. 5Hold this man's conduct up to public scrutiny. Let him defend it if he can! But if he can't, then out with him! It will be totally devastating to him, of course, and embarrassing to you. But better devastation and embarrassment than damnation. You want him on his feet and forgiven before the Master on the Day of Judgment.

Your flip and callous arrogance in these things bothers me. You pass it off as a small thing, but it's anything but that. Yeast, too, is a "small thing," but it works its way through a whole batch of bread dough pretty fast. So get rid of this "yeast." Our true identity is flat and plain, not puffed up with the wrong kind of ingredient. The Messiah, our Passover Lamb, has already been sacrificed for the Passover meal, and we are the Unraised Bread part of the Feast.

So let's live out our part in the Feast, not as raised bread swollen with the yeast of evil, but as flat bread--simple, genuine, unpretentious.

I wrote you in my earlier letter that you shouldn't make yourselves at home among the sexually promiscuous. I didn't mean that you should have nothing at all to do with outsiders of that sort. Or with crooks, whether blue- or white-collar. Or with spiritual phonies, for that matter. You'd have to leave the world entirely to do that!

But I am saying that you shouldn't act as if everything is just fine when one of your Christian companions is promiscuous or crooked, is flip with God or rude to friends, gets drunk or becomes greedy and predatory. You can't just go along with this, treating it as acceptable behavior.

I'm not responsible for what the outsiders do, but don't we have some responsibility for those within our community of believers?

God decides on the outsiders, but we need to decide when our brothers and sisters are out of line and, if necessary, clean house.

[AppyPappy]

Technically, she is a Priestess.

[FreeRep]

We attended a Southern Baptist Church today after the Southern Baptist Convention
excellent statement. Having been born in the Episcopal church (cradle Episcopalian) my whole immediate family have resignation from our birth church. My family has supported the ECUSA during the past years with many extra gifts from gardens to a new roof. It is sad we have to leave but we need to find a church that follows God's word.

[xring]

Our Reverend's sermon this morning was right on the money, IMHO.

First, he recapped what really happened, as opposed to the media's coverage.

The he went on to express not only his dissapointment and consideration of our congregation's emotions, but continued on to disagree with the results of the convention AND with the cop-out reasons and explanations given by those who voted for bishop robinson (small letters).

He continued on to inform us that there ARE some things we can do about it, it WILL be discussed at this weeks vestry meeting and we should count and pray seven times seventy so as to be calm, thoughtful and informed before we act.

Can't wait for Tuesday night.

[madprof98]

At our Catholic mass this morning, we offered a prayer for the Episcopal Church and the Anglican Communion. Everyone knew what the issue was. Interestingly, the Episcopalians who regularly attend mass with us were not there this a.m., nor was one Catholic member whose wife is an ordained priest in the Episcopal Church.

[ex-Texan]

I am a Lutheran and occasionally attend an Episcopal church because it is across the street from where I live. I also go to a Centering Prayer group with many Episcopal church members. I did not go to either one because I wanted to avoid just this sort of experience. I have nothing against women in the pulpit but prefer to attend a church where a man leads the assembly. Episcopal churches in America and England will be in conflict for months with the New Hampshire church over the choice of a gay bishop. The conflict is inevitable and will be very disruptive in my personal opinion. I want to avoid the "debate" entirely.

I have decided to attend a Lutheran Church that takes me an hour out of my day to come and go each day. 'Nuff said.

[Jmouse007]

I live in New Hampshire and determined to attend the Episcopal Church in our area to see if the "priest" (in this case the "priestess") would take a scriptural stand and condemn as heresy or apostasy and sin the vote taken this past week. Well, she started off after the "gender neutral" scriptures were read (I followed along in my Bible and boy was that ever an eye opener) by quoting from the closing message given by the head Episcopal bishop who supports the homosexual bishop at the end of their weeklong meeting to approve this wicked man. This was the gist of the message she gave:

"We need to meet in unity and in love in the field that exists BEYOND RIGHT AND WRONG." (That is a direct quote)

She then went on to say "while some may disagree with what has taken place, we must maintain our unity in Christ and love one another in the bond of peace". She went on with this for 15 minutes, "love," "love," "unity," "unity.” The people just sat there and took it. Needless to say, all I could do was visibly shake my head in disgust as she went through her dribble, the whole thing broke my heart.

As I left I signed their guest book (something visitors had been encouraged to do), this is what I wrote after I put in today's date:

"ICABOD... There is NO FIELD beyond right and wrong."

This priestess to a false christ and false gospel is going to be in huge trouble when she stands before Christ and has to give an account of those whom she has deceived.

[Humidston]

Priestess indeed! I simply cannot understand anyone allowing a liberal female so-called pastor/priest to lead them in worship. Same for gay.

Sorry.

[walden]

My priest made clear both his own and our bishop's (diocese of Texas) absolute disagreement with the National Convention, although he didn't talk specifically about how we would go forward. He did emphasize that we shouldn't let politics interfere with our mission of spreading the gospel, and that whatever we do, we must do in love.

It was a very good message that I greatly needed to hear, as I have been very saddened and angry over what I have seen as this hijacking of my church. It's been particularly upsetting for me, as I myself had left the church for many years, and only came back last spring, when I experienced a transforming re-birth of my faith.

So, now I wait and pray. I hope God will show us the way forward at the October meetings.

[churchillbuff]

one Catholic member whose wife is an ordained priest in the Episcopal Church.

Hey, my head is still spinning from reading that sentence!!

[Humidston]

Please, as long as you continue attending, keep your money OUT of the collection plate until this shakes out. That money goes to feed the evil, collectivist NCC and probably pays for Robinson and his sweetie to have a nice vacation to Disneyland on gay day.

And btw, I left for a much more scriptural and independent church years ago. It took a little adjustment at first, but I know now that I can follow and TRUST the message!

(IMHO, God is more interested in the message - not the form and substance of the worship service.)

[Matchett-PI]

"..my whole immediate family have resignation from our birth church.."

As Luther, Calvin, et.al, would say, leaving an apostate "church" in protest is an honorable thing to do.

[brbethke]

Our priest ducked the issue, promising that he would talk about it on Sunday the 24th but that he didn't want to say anything now. I was disappointed but not surprised, as our Overweight Dyke group was out in full force today, crowing about their "success" and shoving their rainbow diversity ribbons in everyone else's faces.

[altura]

Why am I in a parish with a liberal female priest?

For several reasons.

I have been in this parish for over 30 years. It is my church home. I love it and I love most of the parisioners.
We are currently without a permanent priest and the woman priest was assigned as an interim. She is a wonderful person, more liberal than me, but still very spiritual and committed.

I'm not sure what her fears are about the October meeting. She may be afraid that a split would align us with ultra conservatives who would not want women priests (I think this fear is groundless). She may just hate, in principle, to see the Church split (as do I, but it may be necessary). She may hold the mistaken belief that to object to Robinson is to hate gays (it is not).

I'm sure she will tell us more in the weeks to come.

I don't know where the majority of priests in the Diocese stand on this issue (we did vote "no.")

But I am sure that The Bishop holds the whip hand, i.e. the money and the property.

[altura]

Thanks for the prayers ... we'll need them!

[Humidston]

**rainbow diversity ribbons***

You're kidding, right? Surely you jest(??)
Unbelievable!

[altura]

How sad that this all happened just when you re-discovered your faith.

But all will be well.

One morning last week right before the vote, I woke up cranky because of all this on my mind. I thought I heard Jesus say, "let not your heart be troubled." I felt a lot better.

Later on, when the allegations arose about Robinson, I thought He was taking care of it. (ha, ha)

But I still think He is, maybe not exactly as we would want or expect.