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He's celibate until marriage, and dates won't tolerate it
Chicago Sun-Times ^ | June 15, 2003 | Mary Mitchell

Posted on 06/15/2003 10:39:14 AM PDT by Mister Magoo

He's celibate until marriage, and dates won't tolerate it

June 15, 2003

BY MARY MITCHELL SUN-TIMES COLUMNIST

Ten years ago, Darren Washington, 33, made a dramatic lifestyle change. He decided to abstain from sex until he got married. It is a choice that makes sense in a world where sex can literally kill you. But the fear of sexually transmitted diseases was not the only thing that motivated Washington to try celibacy. Given the pain sexual relationships can cause, he wanted to be part of the solution--not part of the problem.

On Saturday, June 21, he will be one of the panelists for "What Men Don't Like To Talk About" at Being Single Magazine's 5th Annual Bachelor Breakfast.

Washington, director of external affairs for SBC Indiana, says his celibacy has frustrated some women.

"A lot of women wanted to be sexually active," he said. "And you have so many people fronting. What I found out is that women wanted a man who was going to be faithful to her because a lot of men are juggling different women, having sex with different women, and so women thought it would be OK if I was only having sex with them."

Some women backed away after realizing Washington took abstinence seriously.

"I told one woman I just wanted to be friends and she said she already had enough friends," he said.

Then, there's the hurry-up-and-get-on-with-it sister.

"I dated a very intelligent woman, an attorney, who was OK with celibacy," Washington said. "But after six months, she wanted me to make a commitment. She felt if she knew we were going to marry then she could abstain. I couldn't make that promise."

Washington, a state-certified HIV/AIDS counselor, regularly speaks out about abstinence. He says he does so because it is the best alternative, particularly for African-American couples.

"I think a lot of people--men and women--don't understand the emotional and psychological effects that premarital sex cause besides teenage pregnancy and sexually transmitted diseases.

"When you give your body, you open an area to them that is really sacred. You exchange spirits with that person and that is how you end up with heartaches, pain and jealousy. There are women out here who are cheating just like men. You can't blame one [gender] more than the other. If men stood up and took the initiative and treated women with more respect and respected their bodies, women would want their bodies respected."

Sex shouldn't be part of a dating relationship, Washington said.

"You really truly have to be patient and wait for the right man to come into your life," he said. "There are a lot of men out here who have their pick of the litter. They date a lot of women and they know they are a good catch. They are financially together and a lot of these men are having sex with a lot of different women."

In the abstinence world, a date is a date.

"There are certain things that are off limits if you are not willing to be married," he said. "I can go out with different people to have fun, but I don't expect sex and I don't expect them to take their clothes off."

But for a lot of men, sex is seen as their reward for showing his date a good time.

""I don't expect a woman to have sex with me because I took her out to dinner and spent $100," Washington counters. "That should be normal if I am trying to win her hand and to prove to her I'm the man of her dreams.

On the other side, women who do not have romantic feelings for a man may get involved with him sexually because he is financially solid and drives a nice car, Washington pointed out.

"We have to stop using each other," he said. "One way to do that is to abstain."

Of course, the real question is whether Washington is really one of those brothers on the down-low. He chuckled when I asked, but admitted it wasn't the first time he's been asked about his sexuality.

"People live an alternative lifestyle for sexual liberation, not sexual resignation," he said. "Right now, a lot of people are looking for a cure to AIDS. My issue is, yes, we need drugs that will stop the spread of AIDS, but what about the people who don't have it. They need to abstain. If you can't put a ring on a woman's finger or you don't want to marry the brother, you shouldn't be out there."

As noted in a recent Sun-Times special report on marriage, African Americans marry at a significantly lower rate than other racial groups in the United States. By age 30, 81 percent of white women and 77 percent of Asians and Hispanics will marry, but only 52 percent of black women will do so, according to the federal Centers for Disease Control and Prevention.

After talking to Washington, I recalled something my father used to say when his daughters started dating: "Why buy the cow when the milk is free?" Of course, we didn't listen. As things have turned out, fathers knew best after all.

For additional information about next Saturday's panel discussion, please call (312) 567-9900.


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Front Page News; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: abstinence; aids; celibate; chastity; dating; libertines; loosemorals; morality; singles; std
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To: FourPeas
That's odd. My husband has always said that was one of the things that attracted him to me, that and my sense of right and wrong. Different strokes, I guess.

I once heard a Chineses Proverb that said something to the effect that a man that has nothing on his mind but sex has nothing of importance to think about

How nice that your husband enjoys you for more than a "playmate" , you got a keeper

121 posted on 06/15/2003 12:56:26 PM PDT by RnMomof7
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To: RnMomof7
Look at the facts. This guy obviously has issues, and if you can't see that, you're blinded by your belief system.

122 posted on 06/15/2003 12:57:15 PM PDT by Mister Magoo
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To: RnMomof7
Stats show the divorce rate is higher amount people that live together before marriage than those that do not

Of the events:

  1. First Base
  2. Second Base
  3. Third Base
  4. "Home"
  5. Cohabitation
  6. Ring #1
  7. Ring #2
It seems that there are 105 possible permutations (I suppose one could do the bases in non-standard sequence, but it seems likely). Are there any surveys that provide a somewhat detailed breakdown of marriage success for the different sequences, rather than just separating people into those where (5) precedes (7) vs. those where (7) precedes (5)?
123 posted on 06/15/2003 12:57:50 PM PDT by supercat (TAG--you're it!)
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To: RnMomof7
To me, self control shows maturity.

Being promiscuous does not prove that someone is a heterosexual. Being promiscuous proves that emotional maturity may take longer to achieve. Waiting until you are emotionally mature, makes the sexual experience have that much more weight, than a roll in the hay. Sex within the marriage framework, should be a reward for committed couples, given freely to each other.
124 posted on 06/15/2003 12:57:55 PM PDT by Pan_Yans Wife (Lurking since 2000.)
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To: hellinahandcart
A couple of things bother me:

1. It seems that every private matter is now some sort of public and usually political matter. On the left you have hedonists who broadcast every odd thing they do -- we are supposed to listen with admiration to all the details of their orgys and their gay or bi or transgendered genderbenderism. On the right, you have people making public professions of celibacy or virginity or whatever. I remember when Clinton was in office and a religious group held some sort of pro-celibacy rally near the White House. At the rally, a lot of teenagers proclaimed their intention to remain celibate. I am sympathetic to people wanting to counter the hedonists with something a little more sane, but I was dismayed at so personal a matter being turned into a political rally. I was thinking, "What's this? Are we supposed to have a national sex policy in the same way the left talks about having a national industrial policy or socialiced medicine?" I was also concerned about the physical integrity of so many young virgins being placed almost within reach of Bubba, but that is another story.

2. One thing you can be sure of -- the left will continue to politicize sex. They really don't see anything as being a private matter -- and I mean private in the sense that one is considered competent to make one's own choices without the help of the annointed. The left has co-opted sex -- sex is just another tool, so to speak, which is why some "transgendered" rally will predictably turn into a demand for more socialism, and a "gay pride" march will denounce "American imperialism" and demand socialized medicine and a 20 hour workweek. The left is anxious to bring all sorts of fringe people into the movement, lest they miss the all-important chainsaw fetish vote. It is all a numbers game.

3. I can excuse the left of their cynical numbers game because that is the way they think -- if they thought differently, they would no longer be the left as we know it today. I would be no more shocked at them then I would be surprised that a leopard didn't change its spots. However, I am disappointed when the right does the same thing and takes what should be a private matter and turns it into a public spectacle. It would be a victory for decency if the right could, as much as possible, de-politicize sex. I know this is not always possible because the left is busy making everything a political issue. Still, we should abstain from making new political issues of what should be private matters. A case in point is this story. Methinks that holding a press conference after a date, announcing that one is still celibate, is the most certain way to ensure that one's celibacy will continue forever! While a man not being able to commit to a relationship and not having sex might be more healthy than the usual (The "usual" being a man not being able to commit to a relationship but lying to his girlfriend of the moment and having sex) -- I have to wonder about a man so self-important to think that his personal situation is worth a press conference.

4. I really don't understand this trend in contemporary America to make every personal matter into a media circus or a political rally. I said I don't understand this trend to make everything personal a public matter, but I admit it is sometimes enlightening. I remember several years ago when Clinton's misconduct became headline news. At about the same time Bob Dole was advertising for Viagra. The leading Democrat was accused of being a serial rapist while a senior Republican politician talked about his impotence. That is everything you need to know about the American two-party system.

125 posted on 06/15/2003 12:58:49 PM PDT by Wilhelm Tell (Lurking since 1997!)
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To: Mister Magoo; hellinahandcart
After talking to Washington, I recalled something my father used to say when his daughters started dating: "Why buy the cow when the milk is free?"

OTOH, if one has already bought the cow and the milk dries up, why keep feeding it?

126 posted on 06/15/2003 12:59:04 PM PDT by sauropod (Mo Dowd is a Stepford Wife Wanna-be. She wanted to be a Douglas Wife...)
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To: jlogajan
Gene pool could use a little chlorine, huh?
127 posted on 06/15/2003 12:59:40 PM PDT by 4mycountry (Japanese drain pipe is so tiny, please don't flush too much toilet papers.)
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To: Mister Magoo
The best line of the whole article: "We have to stop using each other," he said. "One way to do that is to abstain."
128 posted on 06/15/2003 12:59:46 PM PDT by Hildy
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To: FourPeas
No, I don't think I'm reading too much into it.

They were dating for six months and she wanted a committment (and sex)

No, she was willing to abstain until marriage also. She just wanted to know that it was all LEADING to marriage, so that the abstinence would be (a)bearable (b)OVER with, someday, and he couldn't assure her of his good intentions in that department.

Even though I'm only hearing his side of things, I will take him at his word, and here's what HE said she said: "But after six months, she wanted me to make a commitment. She felt if she knew we were going to marry then she could abstain."

That doesn't say anything about marrying there and then, or even setting a date. They were already abstaining from sex with each other, so there was also no question of their getting engaged and then having sex before the wedding. The problem was, she's on the marriage path, he's obviously not. Not with her, anyway.

He should have let her down easier and earlier. What woman wants to wait indefinitely for a man to determine his own feelings? The fact that he didn't "use" her sexually doesn't change the fact that he still messed with her head.

And that's not nice either.

129 posted on 06/15/2003 1:00:12 PM PDT by hellinahandcart
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To: Pan_Yans Wife
"Being promiscuous does not prove that someone is a heterosexual. Being promiscuous proves that emotional maturity may take longer to achieve. Waiting until you are emotionally mature, makes the sexual experience have that much more weight, than a roll in the hay. Sex within the marriage framework, should be a reward for committed couples, given freely to each other."

AMEN, SISTER :)

130 posted on 06/15/2003 1:01:11 PM PDT by Okies love Dubya 2
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To: avenir
Are you saying that after six months you know someone well enough to get married? Uh uh.
131 posted on 06/15/2003 1:02:09 PM PDT by Hildy
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To: hellinahandcart
Home cooking is good ;-).
132 posted on 06/15/2003 1:03:45 PM PDT by sauropod (Mo Dowd is a Stepford Wife Wanna-be. She wanted to be a Douglas Wife...)
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To: hellinahandcart; FourPeas
Even FreeRepublic has many women not worthy of him.

Personally I think I'm too good for the little pompous ass (as well as too old, thank God). I'd never treat a man the way he treated her.

I reread the article, and I have to conclude that he does come off as a pompous ass. That tone of moral superiority kind of grates on your nerves. It's so ironic that this article turned up this morning, as I was thinking about my 5 year dry spell, and how cranky I'm getting, hahahaa!

It's one thing to have good morals, but the whole purpose of dating when you are young is to find the person that you will spend the rest of your life with. There should be signs of affection; if there isn't when you're dating, there sure won't be any after the marriage.

133 posted on 06/15/2003 1:04:18 PM PDT by TheSpottedOwl (America...love it or leave it. Canada is due north-Mexico is directly south...start walking.)
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To: Hildy
My husband and I dated and lived together for two and a half years, before we married. However, I knew that I could marry him, within the first three months, and I would have, if he had asked me then. Instead, we waited, until later.

We have been married for seven years, now. Having said all of that, I do NOT recommend cohabitation! And, I do not know if I would do everything the same as I did back then.
134 posted on 06/15/2003 1:04:35 PM PDT by Pan_Yans Wife (Lurking since 2000.)
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To: Hildy
Are you saying that after six months you know someone well enough to get married? Uh uh.

Well, I got engaged after 4 and married after less than 8½. So it's not entirely out of the question.

Still, I think what she was asking was not a promise that he would with certainty marry her, but a discussion of what issues remained to be resolved, and a promise that if all such issues were resolved satisfactorily he would be willing to marry her.

135 posted on 06/15/2003 1:06:40 PM PDT by supercat (TAG--you're it!)
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To: Mister Magoo
>>>But if you are still celibate at 33, there is something wrong.

Uh, nooooo, that means you've actually waited to have sex instead of sleeping around. What's wrong with that? Is there a law that says you can't keep it to yourself? That you can't wait until you're married to let it out? If my daughter finds a man who has waited all his life and hasn't done it somewhere else, I would die 100% happy.

And BTW, he said he started being celibate. He wasn't always that way. Read the article.

I personally applaud this man. I think it's great, what he's doing. So many people --esp. guys--- want to have as much sex as possible. It's really nice to hear that not everyone has that on their mind--and that some people still have morals. He may not have the first stuff now, but it's still great that he's waiting for marriage before he does it again.
136 posted on 06/15/2003 1:07:20 PM PDT by 4mycountry (Japanese drain pipe is so tiny, please don't flush too much toilet papers.)
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To: supercat
I don't think it was wrong of her to want a time-frame. Either you know you want to marry, or you know you don't. She did the right thing, by moving on.
137 posted on 06/15/2003 1:07:52 PM PDT by Pan_Yans Wife (Lurking since 2000.)
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To: supercat
Of the events: 1. First Base 2. Second Base 3. Third Base 4. "Home" 5. Cohabitation 6. Ring #1 7. Ring #2

Time that should be spent building a relationship being used to play often means when the 7th inning stretch comes one of the two has taken their ball and bat to look for a new field to play in

That way you never have to get to know the fine points of the game, or what the other player may have really been capable of

138 posted on 06/15/2003 1:08:58 PM PDT by RnMomof7
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To: Wilhelm Tell
The left is anxious to bring all sorts of fringe people into the movement, lest they miss the all-important chainsaw fetish vote. It is all a numbers game.

Because they are running out of normal people.

I have to wonder about a man so self-important to think that his personal situation is worth a press conference.

Well, let's be fair. He's part of a breakfast panel discussion called "What Men Don't Like to Talk About".

Bwaha! I am imagining a very silent breakfast meeting. Most men I know, when they don't want to talk about something, do not make a sound...

139 posted on 06/15/2003 1:10:15 PM PDT by hellinahandcart
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Comment #140 Removed by Moderator


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