Democrats Question Whether Bush 'Hyped' Iraq Threat

Reuters ^ | Sun May 25, 2003 01:49 PM ET | Vicki Allen

[prairiebreeze]

Are the Iraqi people better off today than before our invasion and occupation? I think not.

Well, Linda, perhaps you've not considered just what it might be like to have your mother, or husband or cousins put through a tree shredder feet first. OR, maybe you haven't ever thought about how much "fun" it would be it you were hung by your feet, during menstruation for 3 or 4 days. Just for purposes of humiliation. Your child receiving an acid bath....well, that would be splendid, no??

See, the thing that you aren't recognizing is that "chaos" has existed in Iraq for a long time. Poor infrastructure, food and medicines withheld, malnourished kids, are just a couple of examples of what was there....IN ADDITION to all the torture, fear, and real oppression.

Governments take time. Improvements and repairs take some time. It's been only a couple of months. Do you place such harsh demands on your own productivity levels? If so, you might consider lightening up on yourself.

We have made mistakes only when we tried to ignore or appease terroists and hence showed weakness to an Arabic culture. Which is deadly as we saw on 9/11. Try to have a good weekend. The President and his admin. know what they are doing.

Prairie

[TomB]

Are the Iraqi people better off today than before our invasion and occupation?

How can you possibly think that a people WITHOUT freedom is "better off" than a people WITH freedom?

Read of the chaos in Iraq, of the demostrations against our presence and of the failure to establish a government. And the most troublesome aspect, the creation of more terrorists determined to eliminate us.

Do you think Reagan's success in bringing down the USSR was a good thing? Because after the fall, there was widespread chaos (there still is, in some areas over a decade later), trouble establishing a stable government, the rise of the Russian Maffia, and a dramatic rise in Islamic fundamentalism.

Following your tenuous "logic", the end of the Soviet Union was a bad thing. Do you believe that?

(there Seti, no name calling. how about a response?)

[FairOpinion]

Again, the Democrats want people to believe that either Bush deliberately lied about Iraq's WMD, and/or that our and other countries intel services make things up, rather than that Saddam hid his WMD, after all he had plenty of time.

The question really boils down to: "Do you believe Bush or Saddam?"

And the Democrats are united in believing and protecting Saddam, over the US.

[patriciaruth]

bump.

[quesera]

Bush has a habit of coming up with the goods right AFTER the dems stout spouting off about it.

In fact, he seems to do it so often I wonder if it is his strategy (after seeing what the presstitutes did to his dad).

Of course it's the only way to beat the RATS, strategery at its best.

[Mo1]

Can you say 60 seats in the senate!!

I sure hope so cause these Dems are really annoying the daylights out of me

[follow the money]

Democrats the party of Socialism,Joe Biden of Delaware one world U.N guy

[prairiebreeze]

(there Seti, no name calling. how about a response?)

YoooHoooo! Setttttiii! Are you interested in discussion or not?

I don't know TomB. Maybe you scared him off....or his head exploded.

Prairie

[ladyinred]

Did you write this?
Great post!

[follow the money]

US Department of State
International Information Programs

Washington File
_________________________________

21 May 2003

Senate Panel Authorizes Millennium Challenge Account
(But votes not to have a separate governing body) (710)
Kathryn McConnell
Washington File Staff Writer

Washington -- A Senate panel May 21 adopted a bill to establish a
supplemental U.S. foreign aid account but stripped it of a Bush
administration provision that would have required it to be managed by
a new corporation governed by a board of directors.

The Foreign Relations Committee also approved a bill authorizing
appropriations for a package of foreign aid programs and the U.S.
Agency for International Development (USAID) for the fiscal year
beginning October 1 (FY04), adding an amendment offered by Senator
Christopher Dodd, a Democrat, that would add Caribbean countries to a
list of African countries targeted for assistance by the Global Fund
to Fight AIDS, Tuberculosis and Malaria.

Senators Chuck Hagel, a Republican, and Joe Biden, a Democrat,
sponsored the amendment making the proposed foreign aid Millennium
Challenge Account (MCA) the sole responsibility of the secretary of
state. They said a new bureaucracy, the proposed Millennium Challenge
Corporation, would weaken the State Department's ability to
effectively manage foreign aid.

The Millennium Challenge Corporation would undercut the secretary's
"power and leverage" with foreign aid and development assistance,
Hagel said.

The MCA is a major Bush administration proposal that would
dramatically increase available U.S. foreign aid funds and channel the
additional money to countries that adopt market-based policies, govern
justly and invest in their own populations.

The senators specifically opposed the administration's proposed
inclusion of the secretary of the Treasury and director of the Office
of Management and Budget (OMB) on the corporation's board. "OMB, in
particular, does not have the expertise or experience to make foreign
policy," Hagel said.

The committee also approved an amendment offered by Democrat Jon
Corzine that would set aside 10 percent of MCA funds for assistance to
"bridge countries," or countries that are close to, but do not fully
meet, the fund's criteria for aid.

Both bills now go to the full Senate for debate. The House of
Representatives also must approve its own versions of the MCA and
foreign aid authorization bills. Final versions of both bills must be
passed by the House and Senate before being sent to the president for
signature or veto.

The committee voted to reduce by $300 million to $1,000 million
funding for the MCA in FY04, saying that the program needed time to
become established and effectively distribute its funds. The panel
also voted to cut $31 million from the administration's requested $731
million to fight drugs in the Andean region.

The committee approved two new funds requested by the administration
-- the Complex Foreign Contingencies Fund and a Famine Fund. It also
approved authorization of a $15 million Radiological Terrorism Threat
Reduction Act and a Global Pathogen Surveillance Act.

The Complex Foreign Contingencies Fund would support peace and
humanitarian intervention operations to prevent or respond to foreign
territorial disputes, armed ethnic and civil conflicts, and acts of
ethnic cleansing, mass killing or genocide.

The Radiological Terrorism Threat Reduction Act would authorize the
secretary of State to provide contributions and technical assistance
to the International Atomic Energy Agency (IAEA) to deal with the
threat of radioactive materials being dispersed by conventional
explosives, or "dirty bombs."

The foreign aid measure includes the authorization of appropriated
funds for humanitarian assistance and reconstruction efforts in and
around Iraq.

It would authorize continued funding for programs focusing on
strengthening and preserving democratic institutions and processes,
and conflict resolution in transition countries.

The measure includes the authorization of an additional $70 million
over the administration's request for the Freedom Support Act to aid
countries of the former Soviet Union and a $40 million increase in
funding for Eastern European and Baltic states under the Support for
East European Democracy (SEED) Act.

The measure authorizes increased funding of international military
training, peacekeeping, nonproliferation, anti-terrorism and demining
programs. Peacekeeping would get a $6 million increase over the
administration's request and nonproliferation, anti-terrorism and
demining would get a $100 million increase.

The bill would authorize funding for the Inter-American Foundation,
African Development Foundation and the Asian Development Fund.

The bill would make permanent a provision that foreign aid can be
provided through nongovernmental organizations (NGOs) as well as
through government bodies.

(The Washington File is a product of the Bureau of International
Information Programs, U.S. Department of State. Web site:
http://usinfo.state.gov)

[TomB]

Maybe you scared him off....or his head exploded.

I doubt if he even had a head in the first place.

Oooops, that's name calling, isn't it? No matter, I doubt either of them will be back.

Typical.

[Let's Roll]

Yeah, they didn't think the threat of a dangerous Iraq was hyped in 1998 when Klintoon was the one promoting it. They all signed off on it then. Are we supposed to believe that Iraq has mellowed in the last 4-5 years?

[Jeeper]

The people protesting in Iraq are mostly the '14th Century' Fundamentalist Shia Muslims who wish to make Iraq in Iran's image. We cannot let that happen. Once the utility services have been restored, most of the hardships on the Iraqi people will be relieved. It is up to them to determine the fate of their own country after that. And those terrorists your afraid of, they are coming no matter what we do. You can run and hide and be scared if you like. For me, we are finally stepping up to fight a war that began in Tehran in 1979.

[Dr. Frank fan]

Are the Iraqi people better off today than before our invasion and occupation? I think not.

How many Iraqi people do you know? Based on what, exactly, do you "think" this thing that you think?

Read of the chaos in Iraq,

So dictator is better than "chaos"? Are you sure?

of the demostrations against our presence

You mean, by religious extremist minorities trying to stir up trouble? Who cares.

And the most troublesome aspect, the creation of more terrorists determined to eliminate us.

Please list the terrorists you know of which this war "created". (Remember to provide evidence that, if not for the war, these newly-"created" terrorists you are listing, would have been, oh, software engineers or librarians....)

Anyway, if Iraq was a threat to this country either by itself or in the larger context of fighting Islamofascism, then frankly it doesn't matter to me if we "made the Iraqi people better off". Making a bunch of other people better off was never going to be anything more than a happy by-product of this war in the first place; if we haven't done it, that doesn't bother me. Not that you've shown that we haven't done it, or anything.

[Dr. Frank fan]

Why bother trying, Linda? These people are all True Believers. Their idea of a discussion is to just keep pumping each other up. Anyone expressing something different can depend on some name-calling.

As opposed to your idea of discussion, which is to chime in on threads and make oh-so-substantive posts like this one....

I just love the "no one wants to discuss anything seriously they just make empty posts" form of empty post. The irony :)

[South40]

Did I write it? No. It came from www.scrappleface.com

There’s lot’s of other interesting thoughts there too. Like this:

Republicans Raise Money to Help Gephardt Miss Votes

(2003-05-20) -- A grassroots effort among Republicans has raised almost a million dollars so far for Democrat Rep. Dick Gephardt's presidential campaign.

The fundraiser started spontaneously when Republicans learned that Rep. Gephardt has missed 85 precent of the votes in the House as he travelled around the country seeking support.

"We're thinking that if we can keep him out of the House, that's good for the country," said an unnamed organizer of the Gephardt Travel Fund. "We'd love to help some more of his Democrat colleagues miss some votes too."

The Gephardt Travel Fund will soon expand into a more inclusive effort which will allow Republicans to sponsor a missed vote for any Democrat candidate.

[Linda]

You mean I actually have a supporter here at FR? Yes, they (freepers) have one mind and that is the bush agenda. I voted for bush, thought he could straighten this country out after 8 years of clinton but I have the good sense to see bush and co. for the world domineering warmongers they are. Thanks for your input.

[Kaslin]

Again, the Democrats want people to believe that either Bush deliberately lied about Iraq's WMD, and/or that our and other countries intel services make things up, rather than that Saddam hid his WMD, after all he had plenty of time.

I chat in a political chat room that is frequented by both liberals or left wingers as I call them and some come in the room with "No WMD" and Bush lied. Trying to explain to them that Iraq is a large as Kalifornia (spelled on purpose like that) and it would take a while to do the inspection is like trying to talk some sense into a nincomboob, which of course most are.

The question really boils down to: "Do you believe Bush or Saddam?"

They would rater believe Saddam then Bush

And the Democrats are united in believing and protecting Saddam, over the US

Isn't that the truth

[RichInOC]

Ah, goody, two more idiots just volunteered to fly to Iraq and help search for the stuff...without protective gear, naturally. Why bother wearing all that hot, bulky crap if you're so sure you don't actually need it?

[Agricola]

If you are talking about the recent war then you have another supporter. I don't know if the Iraqi people are better off or not right now nor do I really care since it was not of our interest. If our occupations of Kosovo or Afghanistan are any indication then the results will be very mixed depending your ethnicity and religion. For Suni and Iraqi Christians the answer will be no (and we will do little if anything to stop minority persecution as that might entail casualties). And that is beside the point. This war wasn't sold of "Freeing" Iraq, or stopping Sadaam's brutality, but on the immediate threat to the US by WMDs'. But since no WMDs' have been found to date we have the disgraceful attempt of some who support this administration trying to justify this war with the fact that Sadaam was a brutal dictator. Even worse are those who point to the mass graves of Shia killed during the revolt we encouraged in 91' and then abandoned as justification for this war. Has there even been a more dishonest rationale in American history than that?