The Man of Virtues Has a Vice (Bill Bennett gambles)

Newsweek ^ | 1/2/03 | Jonathan Alter and Joshua Green

[mabelkitty]

Man, I hope and pray this gets HUGE media play this week-end.

[Warhead W-88]

Do you contend that it's wrong to urge morality?

I asked earlier (but no one responded):

Are you against lying and dishonesty? Do you "preach" honesty, in the sense that you urge your fellow men to be honest?

Do you judge people for being dishonest?

I'm assuming the answers are "yes."

So-- are you yourself perfectly honest? Not "quite honest," etc. Perfectly honest.

Do you ever lie, deceive, or mislead?

If the answer is "yes," and I assume it is if you are a human being, then you, my friend, are a HYPOCRITE. You are a MORALIST who does not actually live up to his self-declared moral code.

Being a hypocrite is not the worse thing in the world. ANYONE who champions moral behavior is a hypocrite, because even those who champion moral behavior engage in immoral acts, EVERY DAY.

The only way to avoid being a hypocrite is to declare that there is no code of behavior worth aspirit to at all; to become a self-declared reprobate; to endorse a Satanic/Croley sort of "Do What Thou Wilst" moral nihilism.

IF you do that, then congratulations, you will avoid being a hypocrite.

"But," as Captain Kirk might say, "At... what... PRICE?"

Congratulations, you're no longer a hypocrite. On the other hand, you have now embraced the moral code of an intestinal parasite.

[GraniteStateConservative]

Josh doesn't understand that blowing thousands of dollars to Bennett is like blowing $10 to us. That makes it no vice at all.

[mabelkitty]

Indian casinos are exempt from Federal oversight, so they can set any hold limit they want. Bad odds. Stay away unless it just opened and they are trying to get business.

[lonestar]

Trying to achieve money by chance is a very immoral activity.

My guess would be he, as many others, has lost more $$$ in the market the past few years.

It could be he enjoys the "activity" and knows he isn't going to "achieve" a lot of money.

I see nothing wrong with it if you have the money to lose and don't lose more than you can afford. If he considers it entertainment, there are people doing a lot worse.

[mabelkitty]

I don't recall Mr. Bennett forcing his gambling hobby on anybody, so I hardly see how we should be involved in this.

Oh, yeah. He's a Conservative so it's open season.

[Mustang]

Re: your "...Am I a hypocrite?..."

Don't know, don't care...just don't put in motion your FReeper handel...too much radiation and extinction would follow.

Mustang sends from "Malpaso" News.

[arielb]

a lot of people will say that investing in the stock market these days is like gambling :)

[zoyd]

Sugar, Tell me how Bennett's gambling is immoral to society?

The thousands of families torn apart by financial ruin caused by addictive gambling is WELL DOCUMENTED, Sugar. To sit at your computer and defend gambling as something that doesn't cause harm is pretty laughable. You sit at a table, drink alcohol, and risk large sums of money for your own adrenalin rush. Nothing moral about that. Nothing virtuous about that, when you could be putting that money to good use, IF YOU WERE A MORAL PERSON. Drinking a beer doesn't make you immoral, but alcohol causes hundreds of thousands of deaths a year. Throwing a quarter into a slot doesn't make you a bad person, but losing your life savings and flushing your kids' college fund on a losing hand of blackjack is definite harm.

And you talk about the benefits of tipping? Sheesh.

I'm a libertarian, sugar. Legalize it everywhere, that's fine with me. Just don't try and tell me it's helping society, and DON'T try and con me into thinking that it doesn't ruin plenty of lives.

And Bennett doesn't think about the 'individual'. He's concerned with 'societal' implications or virtuous or non-virtuous behavior. That's his bread and butter. Try your argument on Bennett inre: drugs. "Well, Bill, I can handle my cocaine. I've got lots of money, I'm single, and I just sit in my room and snort coke. I'm not hurting anyone." Bennett's first response would be about the 'societal' harm of drug use, not necessarily the individual implications. Well, use that argument for gambling, and you'll understand why casino gambling is illegal in the majority of states in the US.

[mabelkitty]

I doubt it. I have yet to see the post that backs up the claim that this is immoral.

[zoyd]

His gambling isn't a conflict because it's not on his bitch list.

Huh? If murder isn't on MY bitch list, can I go off killing people and call myself 'moral'?

Sheesh.

[Fizzie]

Mabel,
I doubt the security cameras on the casino floor would help in this case. Most likely, someone in the marketing department or in the Slot Club department pulled up his player card records.

I, too, wonder how the Nevada Gaming Control Board will look at this. More immediately, though, it is horrible PR for the offending casinos. Opens up a can of worms. If news outlets can get access to a player's habits, why not spouses seeking higher child support? No need for the courts to subpoena anymore!

[mabelkitty]

Your post makes no sense.

Please clarify it one more time.

[zoyd]

but you must be a taxin' Dem.

Strike Three, Sugar. Liberarian. I'd let you keep a lot more of your own money than you would.

[discostu]

But how is his gambling ruining some one else's life? That arguement is completley disigenuous and complete ignores the very simple concept of cause and effect. How many people are going to NOT destroy their family with gambling if Bill stops? None. So why should he bear the moral burden for their addiction?

And understand when I say this that I'm the classic degenerate gambler, I suck at it and a I can't stop once I start. So I don't go anywhere near it, I don't even go to the concerts at the Indian casino without a stern chaperone. Finding out Bennett gambles is having no effect on my urges, if he quit tomorrow it would have equally little effect.

[discostu]

Way to deliberately misread my post. So I guess you're immoral because you're a liar. Try repsonding to what I actually said.

[mabelkitty]

I WIN I WIN!!

I WAS THE FIRST ONE ON THIS THREAD TO STATE THIS WAS THE HOMOSEXUAL AGENDA FOLKS, AND HERE IS THE FIRST LIBERAL/HOMOSEXUAL MORAL RELATIVISM POST !!

I WIN I WIN I WIN!!

[Warhead W-88]

Hah. I may not be a "degenerate gambler," but I too suck at it -- or at least have no luck whatsoever -- and I have a tendency to bet more than I'd really like to lose.

I myself have given up casino gambling completely, although I still play poker for low stakes (plus, I'm gambling with chumps and buffoons, so I'm actually using my time productively).

[MattinNJ]

Please tell me what possessed you to add the little bit while getting drunk , never did this article or anyone ever mention Bill Bennet getting drunk while playing the slots.

I did not mean to infer that Bennet was drinking. Perhaps I should have been clearer. My bad. I meant to imply that, as a grown man, he should be allowed to plunk down his hard earned cash and knock back a few cocktails without any hypocritical liberal busting his chops.

Last time I looked, it was a free country and gambling and drinking were legal. I should have said "I would not have a problem IF he decided to drink himself silly while gambling."

[AmishDude]

I'm just flabbergasted, though.

This is what they've got?

That Bill Bennett, a three of clubs in the Republican Most Wanted Deck, indulges in legal behavior which is viewed as immoral by some and as an innocuous wink-wink venal sin by most others?

THIS is what they're pedddling?

You've got it.