Bill Would Limit Smoking by Apartment Dwellers - & allows law suits if your smoke drifts

kxtv ^

[chance33_98]

Bill Would Limit Smoking by Apartment Dwellers

California smokers may soon have one less place to light up. A new law would make it difficult for apartment dwellers to smoke at home.

Assembly Bill 210 would make it illegal to smoke in any in any common area of a multifamily dwelling, including outdoors. It would also forbid use of tobacco products in any apartment not specifically designated a smoking unit.

If it becomes law, AB 210 would allow residents, landlords or homeowner's associations to sue tenants who allow second-hand smoke to drift beyond their apartments.

The bill's author says that the legislation is necessary because drifting smoke can be both a nuisance and a health hazard. "You can sue someone to force them to turn off their stereo at 2 a.m., but you can't sue someone to force them not to smoke, even though it comes into your apartment," said Assemblyman Joe Nation, D-San Rafael. "There's something wrong with that."

Critics say it's not the government's job to tell people where they can smoke, and call the measure a violation of their rights.

The bill comes up for committee hearings later this spring. Assembly Bill 210 can be read in its entirety by clicking on the link below.

Full Text of Assembly Bill 210

[Walnut]

And I hate to admit this but my husband and I smoke our
own meat ! whaat will they do to us now?

[Walnut]

would the landlord have a form that had the question on it "Do you smoke?" yes or no. Right
something like the insurance form that asks if you smoke , and if you don't the policy is cheaper? I know how I would answer

[Walnut]

can I get in on this too.
I quit a while ago and I still love the smell of smoke. I try to sit between my smokng buddies when we get together. It works for me.

[muggs]

I didn't say anything about smokers damaging property.

Most of the expenses are normal, as you say. We always paint, clean and shampoo the carpet. That will usually take care of most problems. We replace carpet as necessary. Occasionally we will need to paint an apartemnt more than once if someone was a heavy smoker and lived there a long time.

I just had a guy move and we had to paint the place twice but the guy lived there 11 years. I have other apartments that have been painted 11 or more times in 11 years.

Smokers, IMO, are no worse than people that like to fry greasy food. That really makes a mess in the apartments. Any extra costs incured by renting to smokers are more than off set by being able to fill a vacancy quicker. If I automatically eliminate smokers from my list of potential renters it takes longer to fill vacanies. Vacanies equal lost income which equals higher rent increases for the residents living at my property. Since most don't object to living in a building that allows smokers it doesn't make business sense to have non-smoking buildings.

[Illbay]

I am only "impolite" because I DARE to point out that smokers' "rights" don't extend past their personal space.

That makes me "outrageous" if you are an "impolite" smoker.

[VRWC_minion]

Since when did the "STATE" create anyone's rights???

The state creates propery rights. It creates land rights, stock rights, personal property rights etc through the creation of laws. If there were not state to create these laws and inforce them you could not own property.

[VRWC_minion]

The very first "property" rights we have is to our own body and the work it produces. From there, we can assume that we must have to right to own the things we buy with the labor our body produces, and so on and so on.

I agree. We start with our inherent rights. We as a group once decided to use these rights to overturn the King's rule and institute a new state founded on a democratic republic. In doing so we turned over our powers to the state according to the constitution of the state. In these constitutions we reserved or limited the power of the state. Sone of these limitations related to property is the right not to be searched, right to not have to quarter troops and finally the right to be reimbursed by the state if your property is taken.

Some of the laws passed by the states creates not only property but the resultant rights and obligations that go along with that property.

Absent the state there would be personal property but you would only be allowed to keep what you could carry or defend. There would not be any intangible property (ie no Micrsoft products), there would be no stock ownership, no nonprofits, no deeds to real property,. All your property would be subject to merely what you can either carry or fight to defend.

So, your restuarant owner and rental property owner is subject to the laws passed by the state which restrict his right to the use of his property as well as he benefits from the laws that allow him the enjoyment of his property.

The one constant theme that I have told the smokers that they don't want to hear is that if they really cared about the owners rights they would help him get reimbursed for the taking of his property, which could be measured by the decrease in the value of his business attributable to the lost revenues. The smokers using this property right claim don't want to hear that because it doesn't fit with their agenda which is totally selfishly geared toward smoking and not toward property rights.

[VRWC_minion]

The government routinely oversteps its bounds but my rights remain intact. Always.

And the various constitution's provided a way to compensate you for your property rights.

[HamiltonJay]

Great Dane, I never suggested it would.

[Darnright]

>Let me guess...
This wil be called..... Ta daaaaah!

The Neurotic Neighbor Protection Act?<

ROFL!!! I'm a non-smoker, and I freely admit to my avoidance of cigarette smoke, but good grief, this intrusion into people's lives (and HOMES) is beyond the pale!

You know, there are some very good, effective ionic air cleaners marketed today. If I lived in an apartment and was bothered by noxious smells, I'd beat feet to the store and buy one of 'em.

My dad smoked unfiltered Kools until he was too sick to do so with lung cancer. He died in agony. Cured me of EVER wanting to smoke tobacco or anything else for that matter. However, I will defend my fellow citizens' right to make their own personal decision on whether to use tobacco products.

[HamiltonJay]

My experiences have been smokers inately do more damage to rental units. I am not suggesting they destroy the place by smoking, but that cleaning up and readying the apartment for a new tenant requires more work and money.

If I rent to a smoker even for only a year, a thorough washing and repaint is always neccessary. Non smoker repaint is rarely needed between short term tenants, and touch ups are possible... touching up a smoked in apartment even with a good cleaning doesn't work... paint never matches no matter how good you clean... so even the most minor blemish requires an entire room to be repainted.

Carpeting doesn't wear out in one year, but I am guaranteed it will need a thorough cleaning if a smoker lived there, not so with a non smoker. Not that non smokers don't ever need cleaning as well, but its a given if the unit was rented to a smoker.

I have nothing personally against smokers, but a unit lived in by a smoker does in general take more effort and time to be cleaned and prepared for another tenant. Cigarette smoke gets into and onto everything, its just a fact of life. Its just like pets... they incur with them, no matter how well behaved certain things that you don't have without them. Of course with Pets you can demand extra deposits and rents for your troubles... Generally not the case yet for smokers... I do suspect though it will in time though.

Security Deposit is always close to rent, but not exactly.

[unixfox]

WHATS NEXT GRILLED BURGERS?

Don't laugh, it's coming sooner than you think. Hell, in some places you can't even order a steak rare anymore. All for YOUR safety of course.

[HamiltonJay]

Gabz, I respect your statements, and I guess we'll just have to agree to disagree on why we oppose the bill.. but rather than get hung up on the differences of our opposition we can focus on the fact that we both don't agree with it and as such are on the same team at least in this matter.

[HamiltonJay]

hahahahaha.... There should at least be some sort of demerit system or something for people who do that... ugh! :) Someone please tell all the H1B's doubling the amount of cologne is not the same as cologne + deodorant!

[Protagoras]

Laws aren't for the polite.

OUTLAW RUDENESS!

They're for the terminally IMPOLITE

Death seems like a preoccupation for you. You aren't going to make another death threat are you?

[Illbay]

Why make a "death threat" against someone who is killing himself anyway?

[Protagoras]

The state creates propery rights. It creates land rights, stock rights, personal property rights etc through the creation of laws. If there were not state to create these laws and inforce them you could not own property.

You are in need of remedial education. Your bizzare interpretation of the origin of rights is astounding.

[Protagoras]

Why make a "death threat" against someone who is killing himself anyway?

So if they weren't you would make the threat?

[Walnut]

I know a landlord who says
IF IT TAKES A LITTLE MORE TIME TO CLEAN AFTER A SMOKER HAS LIVED THERE, SO BE IT. , yOU HAVEN/T SEEN ANYTHING UNTIL YOU HAVE HAD SOME OF THE NON SMOKERS he has had. wow
yOU WOULD NOT BELIEVE THE CLEAN UP, THE HOLES IN THE WALLS.
gIVE him A SMOKER ANYTIME. iF ALL he HAs TO DO IS PAINT OR WASH WALLS. THEY ARE GREAT!!!!!!!
fact is, lots of tenents bring something with them for you to clean up after they leave. Its the nature of the beast. If you complain about everything then get out of the business. then again there are the great tenents too. Most of them are. hes running 50 50 there is a balance

[HamiltonJay]

Walnut, we are not talking idividuals... you can always get a bad individual, smoking or non smoking. I am discussing the baseline... as a baseline smoking requires more cleanup there is no way around it... does that mean that there is never a non smoker who thoroughly trashes an apartment? Of course not. Does that mean there is never a smoker who thoroughly trashes an apartment? Of course not. As a whole however a smoking unit requires more money and time to get ready for the next tenant, just as a unit with pets will require more time and money to get ready for the next tenant. And while security deposits can cover the expenses of the repairs/clean up they don't cover the lost time of the unit not being rented.