Very close-up, slo-mo of the Columbia launch debris.

Florida Today ^ | 02/01/03

[Atchafalaya]

IMOH it was the wing that failed for whatever reason and pitched the fuselage broadside to the airstream tearing it apart.

[ironman]

I think they dump any remaining fuel before finally touching down though.

[XBob]

75 point well taken - actually, it is a flying 'truck'

Actually, NASA has already done this and has designed and even test flown a few different designs, but has never gotten any funding much.

The reason - the shuttle job/parts/program employs people in nearly every congressional district in the country.

Your idea would not employ nearly as many people in so many congressional districts.

PS, It was designed this way from the start, as a way to get it funded.

[kanawa]

No hand-holds under there.

For the sake of a tether...

What art of engineering allows incidents of debris to be incorporated into an acceptable design?

[XBob]

which type of 'foam'?

[Atchafalaya]

I reply again as I realize you were speaking about the launch. Once again was it foam or ice. Huge difference in density and the chunk of debris' ability to cause damage. How fast; we'll find out soon, as NASA will be agonizing over their "ok" no harm done descison.

[XBob]

tell that to the guys who carry the partially full hypergol 'watermellons' in the back of the pickup trucks back down to the HMF. (hypergolic maintenance facility)

[Dan Day]

Unless that "frost" was what was left of dozens of tiles.

That's my thought as well -- pulverized ceramic (and the SS tiles are quite fragile) would look like that.

One thing I don't get -- if the most heat-critical parts of the shuttle (the nose, and the leading edges of the wings) are covered with a tough carbon composite material and not tiles, why not cover *all* of the heat-critical areas with the composite?

[Alice in Wonderland]

It was a block of white "foam" ... sort of like what you describe as 'merangue' in post #26.

[Atchafalaya]

Just a little dent in the leading edge of the wing could give an inroad to heat erosion at plasma temps.

[XBob]

88 "One thing I don't get -- if the most heat-critical parts of the shuttle (the nose, and the leading edges of the wings) are covered with a tough carbon composite material and not tiles, why not cover *all* of the heat-critical areas with the composite?"

They would like for it to get off the ground, and glide a bit. Even as it is, it has the glide angle of sort of aerodynamic rock.

[RedBloodedAmerican]

Sheet of ice lifting off the wing.

[ELS]

It would seem logical that every flight would include a space walk to ensure the integrity of the tiles.

One of the NASA managers at the press conference today said that the astronauts cannot access the tile side of the shuttle during space walks.

[ironman]

Yep there's probably some fuel left but not too much compared to lift off. Hydrazine I suppose.

[XBob]

89 - "It was a block of white "foam" ... sort of like what you describe as 'merangue' in post #26."

ok, good - you don't even need a pencil to put a hole in that, just stick your finger through it.

That is not the insulation from the tank, that is perhaps what the tank insulation ran into at several hundred miles per hour, depending on whether it hit the top or bottom of the wing. That is the white tile on the top.

[Dan Day]

They would like for it to get off the ground, and glide a bit. Even as it is, it has the glide angle of sort of aerodynamic rock.

Please be more specific. What are you saying -- that the composite material is a lot heavier than the tile, per square foot covered?

[XBob]

94 - "Yep there's probably some fuel left but not too much compared to lift off. Hydrazine I suppose."

right on, they are:

monomethylhydrazine (fuel) and nitrogen tetroxide (oxidizer)

[Atchafalaya]

I'm wrong as far as polyurethane. That said, if the foam is ceramic based, it has have more mass and be more able to cause damage as it apparently struck the wing.

[slimer]

Were they equipped to do space walks? Did they do them? I don't know.

According to a NASA official, they are not capable of seeing the under side of the shuttle while in space. He further stated that, they are not capable of doing a space walk to the underside of the shuttle and they are not capable of repairing tiles while in space.

[XBob]

96 - "Please be more specific. What are you saying -- that the composite material is a lot heavier than the tile, per square foot covered?"

yes