France is no Eurowimp

National Post ^ | 30 Jan 2003 | Mark Steyn

[twyn1]

But once Sadaam is gone so too is the identity of being an "Iraqi" and that is where the problems will start.

Hmmm...not sure what you're trying to say here...the U.S. does not act as an "Empire" -- Was the identity of being French gone after WW II ?? or German ?? Why haven't we "taken over" Mexico (oil and plenty of agriculture there), or even Puerto Rico and the Virgin Islands ? If we are so determined to have a power base in the ME, why did Bush (41) bow to pressure and agree to leave Saddam in power, when it would have taken very little to push further and remove him, despite the whining of the press and others ("Highway of Death" crap, etc.)...

[MeekOneGOP]

Let's say you're the head of government of a middle-rank power. You have no feelings one way or the other on the morality of things, that being a simplistic Texan cowboy concept. What then should your line on Iraq be?

The first question to ask yourself is: Is Bush serious about war? If your answer is yes, the next question is: Will he win that war?

Answer: Yes, and very quickly. You know that, even if the drooling quagmire predictors of the press don't. So the next question is: How will the Iraqi people feel about it?

Answer: They'll be dancing in the streets...

That is my thinking exactly. Just like in Afghanistan when it was liberated from the Taliban...

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/727005/posts?page=92#92

http://www.guardian.co.uk/gall/0,8542,596125,00.html

Dancing in Herat
Afghans dance to celebrate the victory of the Northern Alliance in Herat, vacated by the Taliban on November 12.
Photo: Hasan Sarbakhshian, AP

November 16 2001: Afghanistan after the Taliban

Watching football
Afghans in their house in Herat watch the World Cup qualifying football match between Iran and Ireland on satellite TV on November 15. Television was banned under the Taliban.
Photo: Hasan Sarbakhshian, AP

November 16 2001: Afghanistan after the Taliban

Showing their faces
An Afghan woman and her daughter visit Kabul zoo. Under the Taliban they were not allowed to visit the zoo or show their faces.
Photo: Marco Di Lauro, AP

November 16 2001: Afghanistan after the Taliban

[Dionysius]

The French submarine "Tricolor" is sinking a lot of shipping!

[from occupied ga]

Maybe the taliban were on to something about the women not showing their faces.

[Britton J Wingfield]

Was the identity of being French gone after WW II ?? or German ??

Iraq is a lot more like Yugoslavia than France. It's made of several distinct peoples held together by a brutal strongman. That said, I think federalism could work for them, but we'd need to enforce it for a while.

You are correct that we are not an empire. If we were, we'd still own France, Germany, and we'd have taken Iraq 12 years ago and kept it.

[MeekOneGOP]

This isn't quite the same as being a bunch of spineless appeasers. As far as I can see, American pop culture only ever has room for one joke about the French. For three decades, the Single French Joke was that they were the guys who thought Jerry Lewis was a genius. I don't particularly see the harm in that myself, at least when compared to thinking, say, Jean-Paul Sartre is a genius. But, since September 11th, the new Single French Joke has been that they're "cheese-eating surrender monkeys," a phrase introduced on The Simpsons but greatly popularized by Jonah Goldberg of National Review. Jonah, you'll recall, recently flayed us Canadians for being a bunch of northern pussies, but it's a measure of the contempt in which he holds our D-list Dominion that we didn't even merit a pithy four-word sneer-in-a-can.

---

French PM: "It's Great to Be Collaborating with Germany Again!"

[MeekOneGOP]

...a simplistic Texan cowboy concept. What then should your line on Iraq be?

The first question to ask yourself is: Is Bush serious about war? If your answer is yes, the next question is: Will he win that war?

[MeekOneGOP]

Arms Inspector Meets With Saddam Hussein

[Savage Beast]

Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha! Oh Mark, please don't write any more! Hahahahaha! I can't stand it! I'm rolling on hahahaha floor... Hahahahaha! Can't stand up... Hahaha! My knees hahaha are so hahahaha! Oh please! Hahaha! Don't write any more! Hahahahaha!

[Fedupwithit]

Homer Simpson:

Lisa, weaseling out of things is important to learn. It's what seperates us from the animals.

...except the weasel.."

just classic stuff

[babaloo999]

They do have nuclear capabilities. Could be trouble when the muslims take over the country.

[F.J. Mitchell]

France is where they insert the suppository when the earth's hemorrorids flare up.

[Burkeman1]

Yes- the fact that we didn't impose colonial governors in Germany and France after WWII and force them to learn English means we are not empire- like that would have ever been considered? Never mind the 30 different countries around the globe we have troops or naval bases in. Never mind the "states" we prop up with puppets and the complient ruling elites we grease with foreign aid that never makes it to where it is intended to go. As for staying in Iraq 12 years ago- that was never in the cards as it was a condition of the coalition that Sadaam stay in power and we were only authorized to get him out of Kuwait. But forget even the coalition. We wanted Sadaam in power. We didn't want a religious and ethnic war in the heart of the ME to threaten the shakey regimes we already prop up there- namely Saudi Arabia. And we stayed in Saudi Arabia and Kuwait after he was out- and this is what ticked off OBL and AQ and lead directly to 9/11. But nevermind. We will go into Iraq- yet another Muslem land (this one containing the second largest oil reserve in the world no less) filled with "infidel" troops. No- that is not another talking point for AQ recruitment centers at all. I wonder who wants this war more- AQ or Bush?

IMO- we would have been better off if Iraq had taken Kuwait and Saudi Arabia back in 91'. I doubt 9/11 would have happened.

[<1/1,000,000th%]

Interesting...

[yendu bwam]

PS- France does treat West Africa like a colony only without the benefits of actual law and order. They intervene to protect their corporate interests and back any thug who will keep the "peace". The French prop up the currency of a dozen west african states.

Having spent some years in West Africa, I was shocked to discover how truly racist many French are - to the point of refusing to sit with Africans at bars, as an example. The French were truly despised by most Africans I knew. They loved Americans - even when they disagreed with American foreign policy. Nobody likes the French in my experience, except the French themselves.

[paul51]

Anyone who refers to the World War as the unpleasantness loses me on the merits

[Nonstatist]

Except for the last part about French "machinations" screwing up the last Gulf War

The word he used was subverting, and its true. They signed all these clandestine oil deals , through the UN auspices, with Sadaam. They and the Russians dont want war for mercantile reasons. These "deals" are a subversion of the ceasefire agreement.

[Burkeman1]

It has been my experience that Europeons in general are far more racist than Americans in private. It is their governments that put the lid on this racism by making it criminal.

[Siobhan]

Please would you give me a link or a source on this. I have heard various versions of the bauxite story before but have never found evidence for it.

[VaBthang4]

I love Steyn but I will not stomach a defense of France under any circumstance or perspective.

They've had some fifty years to dig this hole and one article doesnt do much to bring them out of it.