Why Jews and blacks vote Democratic: Part II (Dennis Prager)

TownHall.com ^ | 1/28/03 | Dennis Prager

[TheEngineer]

And rarely ever inflicted by Protestants.

If this is meant as a slam on Catholics... Maybe you should keep in mind that slavery in the South was perpetrated mainly by non-Catholic Christians.

I don't think any religous sect can lay claim to a perfect flock.

[x]

The argument looks pretty simplistic. Consider: the GOP of the 1950s and 1960s was more pro-civil rights on the whole than the Democrats were, but this did not prevent Blacks from lining up ever more tightly and thickly behind Democrats. Nor were Republicans particularly hostile to Jews, yet Jews went heavily for Democrats. Victimization, even vicarious victimization, is too simplistic an explanation.

[RLK]

While I'mm on the subject and in a good mood, let me add to my previous comments. Whether you live or die doesn't mean a damned thing to me unless I know you a lot better than I do. And judging from out ongoing discussion here in recent months, you are not the kind of person I would want around me. Sob stories about ancestors, threats, mau-mauing or whatever won't get you anywhere at my house except a quick trip out the door. Anybody who has no class or can't cut it is not somebody I want around me. Don't go thinking you are special. It's equal opportunity regardless of race, creed, or anything else.

[weikel]

No none can but anti semitism was generally a major force only in( muslim of course) catholic or orthodox lands.

[x]

That sort of social exclusion of Jews couldn't be exclusively attributed to one party or another. It's fashionable now to think that anti-Jewish feelings were the sole property of rich Republicans, but it's not the case. There was similar mistrust of Jews outside country club circles in all parts of the country, and even among the elite, upper class Democrats weren't so different from upper class Republicans. Also, it's not always easy to draw hard and fast lines between the kind of exclusitivity or self-exclusion by which groups, including Blacks and Jews maintain themselves, and the exclusion of outsiders practiced by majorities to deny advantages to minorities. It took a major change in thinking to convince us that these were not the same thing.

[TheEngineer]

No none can but anti semitism was generally a major force only in( muslim of course) catholic or orthodox lands.

And black slavery was generally a major force only in Protestant lands... So what's your point?

[weikel]

Look at the history of Spain. I think you'll get a diffrent picture. The only reason it declined is because after the defeat of the Spanish armada Britain had a virtual monopoly on the slave trade routes.

[weikel]

WASP aren't anti semitic( except for the rare left wingers).

[TheEngineer]

Again... What's your point?

[RLK]

And black slavery was generally a major force only in Protestant lands...

-------------------------

Where did you get that Idea? Some of the biggest slavers in history were Arabs who moved to southern East Africa.

[TheEngineer]

Some of the biggest slavers in history were Arabs who moved to southern East Africa.

Just add that to their long list of unattractive features.

I wasn't trying to assign the definitive blame for slavery here... I was just responding to weikel's thinly-veiled anti-Catholic thing. (At least I think that's where he's going, but he hasn't yet mustered the stones to just come out and say it.)

[William McKinley]

but no leftists or socialists considered it an ideological ally

No leftist leaders considered it an ideological ally; they considered it a competitor. They did because it appealed to the same commoners. A book I read showed the voting support various parties got in Germany as the Nazis rose to power. About half the votes the Nazis got came from people who had not voted before (the disenfranchised). About half the votes the Nazis got came directly from people who had voted for far left/communist parties previously. The right, center-right, and center-left parties had almost no change in their support over those few elections.

The people on the street saw Nazism as a kin of leftists and socialists.

[mhking]

Black conservative ping

If you want on (or off) of my black conservative ping list, please let me know via FREEPmail. (And no, you don't have to be black to be on the list!)

Extra warning: this is a high-volume ping list.

[wimpycat]

The way I see it, it isn't about slavery per se, but about the 100 or so years of false freedom that came after slavery...and THAT is within the living memory of many black people.

[hchutch]

And attitudes like yours are not part of the solution, thereby making them part of the problem, RLK.

[SJackson]

As far as blacks "memories of centuries of racism," very few black people I know were around centuries ago any more that very many Poles. One can't have memories of what happened before you existed except in dramatic arts expositions. I'm not into dramatic arts....It's equal opportunity regardless of race, creed, or anything else.

Setting slavery aside, the first century or so of freedom for blacks in America was an abomination. You don't have to be too many years past voting age to have lived at a time when opportunity for blacks wasn't equal.

Republicans need to acknowledge that fact (not assume any misplaced blame) if they hope to attract black voters to an agenda that provides equal opportunity far better than the Democratic alternative. RDB3 is right, you can't forget recent history.

[rdb3]

Republicans need to acknowledge that fact (not assume any misplaced blame) if they hope to attract black voters to an agenda that provides equal opportunity far better than the Democratic alternative.

That's all I'm saying. If I'm "asking" for anything, it's just that. But maybe some don't wish to attract, know what I mean?

Birth of Tha SYNDICATE, the philosophical heir to William Lloyd Garrison.
101 things that the Mozilla browser can do that Internet Explorer cannot.

[SJackson]

But maybe some don't wish to attract, know what I mean?

Yes, that's something Republicans need to recognize too. Failure only requires one weak link.

[hchutch]

And the best way to deal with the weak links and limit the damage they cause is to call them on it, IMHO.

[mhking]

Uh, I am not in the business of psychotherapy unless I'm getting paid for it. I'm not into hearing other people's emotional displays.

I'm not asking you to be my shrink.

I am asking you - no, demanding you listen to my views and concerns as you would anyone else's. I deserve no less than anyone else on that note.

Likewise, I have a responsibility to listen to and act upon your concerns. That's what good citizens do. It's called working together.

And as far as "centuries ago", most blacks don't buy that. They - as are Jews and Irish folk and others painfully affected by generational injuries - choose not to forget the pains and sins of their fathers. But in the same note, many are still alive who were directly affected by Jim Crow and by other forms of racism. I've had to deal with it in varying degrees in my lifetime. And while I remember those encounters, I don't wallow in my own self-pity. There is a difference.

Unfortunately, many of your compatriots would have me forget the unfortunate experiences of mine, and my father's and my grandfather's. I cannot and will not do that. It's unfair of anyone to expect me to do that. If that's the sort of attitude that you have a problem with, then I'm sorry, but that is who I am.

Now, would you rather someone like rdb3 or myself who tell you exactly what is going on in our own homes and in our own minds and hearts be ready to work with you to move into the future? Or would you have us change who we are to suit your "picture" of what we are supposed to be?