Cross-Species Birds May Offer Clues

Science - AP ^ | 2003-01-23

[Junior]

"It connects back to some of the earliest roots of evolutionary thought, but also connects to very real issues in human medicine," molecular evolutionist Michael Braun at Smithsonian Institution (news - web sites)'s National Museum of Natural History said after reading the new research.

And creationists say evolution has no practical applications...

[Junior]

Ping.

[GraniteStateConservative]

Science: We used it to switch birds' beaks, so imagine what we could do with it if we weren't high!

[stanz]

The implications are far-reaching.

[VadeRetro]

I wonder if "molecular evolutionist Michael Braun" knows what gore3000 knows, that every discovery of science in the past 50 years has dispoven evolution.

[dirtboy]

I wonder if "molecular evolutionist Michael Braun" knows what gore3000 knows, that every discovery of science in the past 50 years has dispoven evolution.

I wonder if you have bothered to contemplate just how absurd that claim is...

[Junior]

Just goes to show you, these folks ought to consult with LBB before making any pronouncements. After all, he is the end-all and be-all of both science and religion.

[mikegi]

(Letting them survive to hatch with beaks they didn't know how to use would have been unethical, Helms explained.)

Actually, I think this should have been an important part of the experiment. Would they really not know how to use them? Or would the changes induced be extended into the brain itself?

I don't think that any of this should be surprising. During the embryonic phase, the separate parts of the developing body are running independently. I can imagine that, in the future when genetic control is figured out, you would be able to grow a new arm by resetting the clock on a section of tissue. Feedback from the developing arm would stimulate blood vessel growth, etc. Of course, the bone development at the shoulder would be problematic...

[VadeRetro]

I wonder if you have bothered to contemplate just how absurd that claim is...

I didn't even contemplate the spelling of "disproven" adequately. But the real question is whether gore3K has contemplated much of anything, ever.

[LiteKeeper]

YEC skeptical read later

[johnny7]

Fascinating! When I was a fishing guide, I would catch a fish and clip-off certain fins.

If done properly, the fish would just swim in circles.

When someone hired me, I always knew where the fish were.

[elfman2]

Incase you’re ever interested in reading criticism of your claims

[VadeRetro]

... your claims.

I guess I needed a "</sarcasm>" on that post. I'm extremely unimpressed with gore's arguments.

[smokinleroy]

Reminds me of a joke:
A group of biologists proclaim they can produce life and that God is now irrelevent. God hears this and challenges them to a contest to see who can produce life first from mud. The contest begins and the biologists start collecting mud. God says "Not so fast. Get your own mud."

[stanz]

The mud was the scientists'. Their ancestors crawled out of it.

[Nebullis]

Shades of Spemann. Getting at the centers, in this case, the neural crest, where evolutionary change occurs.

[Nebullis]

Let me elaborate a bit. There's often a question about how one change can work when the rest of the organism doesn't change with it to make it work. We see an induction of complementary changes in the host tissue by the transplanted tissue. Cells are very robust and accommodating.

[PatrickHenry]

Ping (in addition to Junior's ping).

[This ping list for the evolution -- not creationism -- side of evolution threads, and sometimes for other science topics. To be added (or dropped), let me know via freepmail.]

[js1138]

Are you saying God can change the rules after the game begins? Sounds like gore2000. Hint: "from mud" implies the availability of mud, but I suppose logic doesn't matter much anyway.

[Fester Chugabrew]

"That means neural crest cells carry species-specific programming for beak growth . . .

What?! "Species-specific programming"?! Where did the programming come from? How did it get there?

So Dick and Jill monkey around with the birds only to tell us what we already knew. Big news! Human medicine has only to gain from this incredible experiment. As if their evolutionary assumptions added something to science. If only all the birds throughout history had folks like Dick and Jill to play with their embryos this world would be a better place, to be sure.