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States Reconsider Limits On Law-Abiding Gun Owners
CNSNEWS.com ^ | 1/15/03 | Jeff Johnson

Posted on 01/15/2003 2:19:12 AM PST by kattracks

Capitol Hill (CNSNews.com) - As violent crime rates continue to drop in states that allow citizens to carry concealed firearms, some of those states are reconsidering the limits they place on that constitutional right.

Citizens of Virginia who hold a valid "carry concealed weapons" (CCW) permit will "officially" be allowed to possess their weapons in state parks beginning Feb. 12, 2003.

Gov. Mark Warner (D) ordered the policy change Sept. 23, 2002, after the commonwealth's attorney general, Jerry Kilgore (R), determined that the Virginia Department of Conservation and Recreation had "exceeded its statutory authority" by prohibiting legally possessed firearms.

Anti-gun activists decried the move.

"We could have an incident with these concealed weapons people," said Jim Sollow, board chairman of Virginians Against Handgun Violence. "When people have these weapons, our concern is that they tend to do dumb things with them."

But Erich Pratt with Gun Owners of America told CNSNews.com there's nothing "dumb" about defending oneself from a deadly criminal attack.

"Women have been raped and murdered in parks, so I think they would want to have a firearm for protection," he said. "You also have cases where people who are out in the parks have been attacked by a small gang of people, and [the criminals] will be armed despite any type of ban."

Pratt also argued that CCW permit holders are typically some of the most responsible and well behaved of citizens. The statistics appear to bear that out.

Virginia issued 172,347 CCW permits between July 1995 and April 2002.

During that same period, 0.2 percent of those permits (372) were revoked for any reason, including crimes committed that did or did not involve a firearm, medical deficiencies and individuals who moved out of state but did not surrender their permits. The average number of CCW permit revocations nationwide is 0.5 percent.

Despite those figures, Sollow questioned the need for private citizens to be armed in the parks.

"The other side couldn't say of anybody being assaulted or attacked or anything in a park where a gun, had they used it properly, would have warded off the bad guy," he claimed.

But an unarmed park visitor was killed during an argument at Holliday Lake State Park in Appomattox County in the early 1990s. Pratt noted that there are other incidents of violence in parks, but they often go unreported.

He said many citizens who merely display a gun to ward off criminals, but don't have to fire it, do not notify police for fear of harassment. That, Pratt added, makes it more difficult to track defensive uses of firearms.

In the fall 1995 issue of the Journal of Criminal Law and Criminology, researchers Gary Kleck and Marc Gertz reported the findings of their surveys on defensive gun uses in an article entitled "Armed Resistance to Crime: The Prevalence and Nature of Self-Defense With a Gun."

The pair determined that citizens displayed firearms, threatened the use of those firearms, aimed firearms at criminals, fired at criminals or actually shot criminals to stop crimes in progress 2.5 million times annually.

Virginia is not the only state to give its residents more leeway in carrying revolvers and pistols for self-defense.

"We are seeing a tidal wave across the nation of different states that are making it easier for citizens to carry concealed," Pratt said, noting that 44 states have some form of CCW law, even though roughly 12 routinely deny most applications.

"However strict or permissive the law may be, they are all heading in one direction, and that is to liberalize gun ownership," he said.

In fact, former Michigan Gov. John Engler (R) signed a law his last full day in office, Dec. 31, 2001, easing the restrictions on CCW permit holders in that state.

Among the changes, permit holders may carry in restaurants that derive less than half their profits from alcohol sales (but may not consume alcohol while carrying) and may carry their guns onto the parking lots of many locations - like schools, churches and hospitals - even though they are prohibited from taking the weapons inside.

Pratt said any expansion of the state's recognition of their citizens' right to self-defense is good, but he noted that such "safety-free zones" advertise the fact that patrons are defenseless.

"That's a wide-open invitation to thugs who, more than likely, are not going to face any resistance when they go into a church or school," he said. "It's simply ridiculous to say that a responsible teacher or principal or, in the case of a church, any responsible adult cannot, by law, have a gun to protect either themselves, their families or their children."

Only California, Iowa, Maryland, Minnesota, New Jersey and New York do not recognize an individual citizen's right to own and carry firearms for self-defense in their state constitutions, according to research by the NRA Institute for Legislative Action.

Thirty-seven states prohibit counties and cities from imposing limits on gun owners more stringent than those set by the state legislature.

Illinois, Kansas, Missouri, Nebraska, New Mexico, Ohio and Wisconsin forbid private citizens from carrying concealed weapons under any circumstances.

While California Maryland, Massachusetts, New Jersey and New York claim to have a CCW permit system, Pratt noted that those governments have effectively banned concealed carry by issuing permits only to a very limited number of people.

He said regardless of whether it is a state, county, city or even a private business that bans law-abiding citizens from carrying concealed weapons, they are making a "foolish" choice.

"They are adopting the failed path of Washington, D.C., which has basically put signs up everywhere in the city saying 'Your guns are not welcome here,'" Pratt explained. "Of course, we've seen that that doesn't stop criminals from bringing their guns and committing crimes.

"Washington, D.C., frequently has the highest murder rate in the country," he concluded.

According to data from the FBI's Uniform Crime Reports, the violent crime rate in the U.S. has dropped every year since 1991 and hit a 23-year low in 2002. In that same period, 17 states added CCW laws and 13 states eliminated some restrictions from existing CCW laws.

States with CCW laws experienced lower violent crime rates without exception.

On average violent crime was 24 percent lower; there were 22 percent fewer murders, 37 percent fewer robberies and 20 percent fewer aggravated assaults than in states that do not issue CCW permits.

Similarly, the states with the lowest violent crime rates all have "shall issue" CCW permit laws that force police to issue permits if applicants meet the qualifications established by the state legislature.

E-mail a news tip to Jeff Johnson.

Send a Letter to the Editor about this article.

 



TOPICS: Breaking News; Culture/Society; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: banglist; concealedcarry; guncontrol; guns
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1 posted on 01/15/2003 2:19:12 AM PST by kattracks
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To: kattracks
Mark Warner won with the help of the NRA. He ran strong in rural Virginia, where a Democrat usually doesn't stand a chance. The national Dems should listen to him but they won't. Warner's a good deal more conservative than many midwestern RINOs. George Ryan comes to mind in that regards and sometimes the party label doesn't tell you who'll advance American principles, such as defending the Second Amendment and the RKBA.
2 posted on 01/15/2003 2:24:55 AM PST by goldstategop
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To: kattracks
"We could have an incident with these concealed weapons people," said Jim Sollow, board chairman of Virginians Against Handgun Violence. "When people have these weapons, our concern is that they tend to do dumb things with them."

Isn't this the same barking sound we heard BEFORE the CCW law was passed?

And it didn't happen?

3 posted on 01/15/2003 2:25:37 AM PST by Pistolshot
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To: Pistolshot
Like CCW holders are going to shoot up state parks in VA all of a sudden?? Fat chance.
4 posted on 01/15/2003 2:30:37 AM PST by goldstategop
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To: bang_list
ping
5 posted on 01/15/2003 2:32:14 AM PST by kattracks
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To: kattracks
"States with CCW laws experienced lower violent crime rates without exception."

THIS is what needs to be heard.

F.Y.I.

6 posted on 01/15/2003 2:36:39 AM PST by dogbrain (HelllllOOOOOoooooo.....McFLYYYyyyyy....)
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To: *bang_list
.
7 posted on 01/15/2003 2:37:20 AM PST by Gun142
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To: kattracks
"We could have an incident with these concealed weapons people," said Jim Sollow, board chairman of Virginians Against Handgun Violence. "When people have these weapons, our concern is that they tend to do dumb things with them."

I'm more concerned about the dumb things criminals will do with their guns when they are assured that nobody else but them will be carrying them thanks to the efforts of weenies like this Jim Sollow. What is a man doing as a member of a sissy group like this?

8 posted on 01/15/2003 2:45:47 AM PST by SamAdams76
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To: kattracks
"We could have an incident with these concealed weapons people," said Jim Sollow, board chairman of Virginians Against Handgun Violence. "When people have these weapons, our concern is that they tend to do dumb things with them."

Personally, I'm more concerned that we could an incident with these people who can talk. When people have the ability to talk, my concern is that they tend to do dumb things with it.

9 posted on 01/15/2003 3:41:21 AM PST by jimtorr
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To: kattracks
Someone needs to forward this to Tony Blair so he can straighten his country out.

10 posted on 01/15/2003 3:44:45 AM PST by anobjectivist
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To: anobjectivist
I think it's a lost cause. Even their police are unarmed.
11 posted on 01/15/2003 3:57:45 AM PST by kattracks
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To: Pistolshot
I've never had a CCW permit -- where I live, on Long Island, it's close to impossible to get one -- but I've known a number of CCW holders. They struck me as being exceedingly sober about the weapons they carried, and highly unlikely to use them imprudently. They cherished their right to carry, and regarded any threat to it -- from the state or from their own misconduct -- as maximally serious.

It's people who evince a pathological fear of guns, who think of them as snakes coiled and waiting to strike the innocent, who pose a real danger. These folks can't distinguish between the animate and the inanimate, nor for that matter between aggressive violence and violence wielded in defense. Someone with that little clarity of mind probably thinks cars go out at night and cause accidents while their owners are asleep. They just about came out and accused Ronald Reagan of impregnating hordes of inner-city teenagers, didn't they?

Freedom, Wealth, and Peace,
Francis W. Porretto
Visit The Palace Of Reason:
http://palaceofreason.com

12 posted on 01/15/2003 4:00:09 AM PST by fporretto (Curmudgeon Emeritus, Palace of Reason)
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To: SamAdams76
Jim Sollow is a coward and barely a man. I've seen him debate a few times and I keep expecting him to pull out a hankey, drop it on the ground and stomp up and down on it.

Mike

13 posted on 01/15/2003 4:30:59 AM PST by BCR #226
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To: jimtorr
Apparently this guy is a 'dumb thing' and therefore an expert on such things.
14 posted on 01/15/2003 4:57:08 AM PST by anniegetyourgun
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Comment #15 Removed by Moderator

To: dd5339
gun ping!
16 posted on 01/15/2003 5:08:48 AM PST by Vic3O3
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To: kattracks
If that woman that was recently raped in a park by illegals had been armed...if Chandra Levy had been armed, there would be two less horrific crimes.

Women should arm themselves and allow no unconstitutional law to interfer with her right to self defense.
17 posted on 01/15/2003 5:18:00 AM PST by MissAmericanPie
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To: kattracks
"We could have an incident with these concealed weapons people," said Jim Sollow, board chairman of Virginians Against Handgun Violence. "When people have these weapons, our concern is that they tend to do dumb things with them."

Like protect themselves from robbery or rape.
Uh, the government as God is suppose to do that part. Can't have that sort of thing going on without government aid. Why, that's totally unsocialist!
Without "social victims", there'd be no democrat voters, and without a certain amount of violence, the anti-gunners would be obsolete! They'd have to get a real job!
Neither the Constitution nor the freedom that accompanies it are allowed in the U.S. The socialists have decided so. It's THEIR "lifestyle choice." Only THEY have the right to choose stuff. They said so!

18 posted on 01/15/2003 5:24:54 AM PST by concerned about politics (Achievement is politically incorrect.)
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19 posted on 01/15/2003 5:46:54 AM PST by Mo1 (Join the DC Chapter at the Patriots Rally III on 1/18/03)
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To: goldstategop
The national Dems should listen to him but they won't.

The funny thing is that I've seen posters over on the DUmpster attempting to point out that continued opposition to gun owners' rights is turning into slow political seppuku for the Democrats. Of course, they are quickly shouted down and/or banned.

20 posted on 01/15/2003 5:57:40 AM PST by steve-b
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