Officer killed during terror raid

"Didn't stop you from showing that you have no relation to your screen name."

That made no sense, whatsoever. I take it that your screen name is in reference to little boys?

These events don't surpise me. Of the 60 million people in the UK, one million are muslims, 44% of whom believe that attacks by al-Qu'ida are justified.

(religion of peace)

No-one seems prepared to stand against fundamentalist Islam in this country. If you do, you're immediately branded 'racist' or 'culturally insensitive'. There's a bleak future for this country.

Police here in this country have been disarmed to the point that when heavily armed bank robbers open fire on them in L.A. a couple of yrs. ago the police actually had to be armed by a gun shop nearby in order to match the firepower of the creeps.

In Chicago the cops' firepower has been so diminished that they routinely carry their own guns to augment their firepower. None of this means cops are perfect or shouldn't be criticised when they do wrong but at least wait until the facts are known and established by non-kook sources.

Every incident where a cop opens fire is met by a chorus of criticism from the Cop Hater Choir here at FR before the facts are established. It is as reflexive as that of Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson. Are these leftists posing as conservatives? It is false that "routine" matters are handled in a military fashion by local police.

My post was right on the money whether you like it or not.

Are you incarcerated, billy?

I'm afraid I could on drive it around on the ground.

hell on wheels, shonuf.

I see a few have shown up to demonstrate that weak minds are not discriminated against here at FR. Wouldn't want trouble with the ADA now would we.

"Why aren't the FR division of Cop Haters, Inc. here cheering the death of this stormtrooper? "

Well... I'm probably one of those you refer to, at least I flatter myself with accepting your invitation to flame.

I have made it a consistent habit to point out the bad cops anytime I see them displayed in the news posting here and to attempt to shut down the "support LEOs no matter what" crowd. So, I'll assume that when someone with a screen name of "just shutup and take it" refers to "Cop Haters, Inc." that he is probably referring to my ilk.

That said, I have NEVER, EVER, at any time advocated or celebrated the death or injury of any law enforcement officer. PERIOD.

Why on earth would anyone celebrate the death of this officer in the U.K. except that they be of some twisted mentality?

There are valid reasons for protesting abuse of power and some cops at some points in time do, in fact, abuse their power...... badly. That's what I have continuously raised a voice against.

I have an active refusal to worship any man simply because he wears a badge. If that makes me a "cop hater" in your eyes so be it. But don't ever assume that I would condone or advocate the death or injury of a public servant attempting to enforce the laws of public safety we have hired them to enforce.

Got it?

Merely because you can't understand it doesn't mean it "made no sense, whatsoever."

Because most of deeply support the police. We are not timid about criticizing the police when they get stupid though. I pray for this officer. The officer has been described as being in "critical" condition from a stab to the arm. That raises a whole host of questions about the injury.

The Cop Haters are like those on another thread calling for the police who were involved in the dog incident to be sentenced to at least 20 yrs. in prison before they have had a trial or all the evidence is submitted. And those who immediately began whining and moaning last yr. when a killer was killed after killing a cop when his mom's house caught fire accidently. They tried desparately to prove that the cop had been killed by other cops not the nutcase who opened fire upon them.

They seem to hate all authority and immediately assume a cop is in the wrong whenever he pulls his gun. Like Jesse and Al and the rest of the Looney Left they believe there is no such thing as a Good cop. If you belong to these catagories then I was addressing you. If not no. I have never supported cops who abuse their authority or disgrace their badges but am not ready to crucify them should they make a mistake.

My screen name is ironic designed to provoke response rather than stifle it.

Legitimate criticism of anyone or anything is fine. I am just a bit puzzled to find a group of people here who are not easily distinguished from the followers of the professional cop haters like Jesse and Al. Half-truths, misinformation and lack of information seem to be their stock in trade.

"It is false that "routine" matters are handled in a military fashion by local police"

No, it is NOT false. It may look false from your side of the badge, but I've had a cop reach down and unsnap their holster because I spoke some words that may have displayed a lack of respect for his assumed authority, not because I presented any form of physical threat. There are so many incidents in the news where a SWAT team was called out to meet some local domestic disturbance that I don't even need to go into it here. You know of the cases I refer to and so does everyone else.

I know it is a wild exaggeration to claim routine matters are handled in a military fashion. I am not a cop but it should be clear to anyone that the police live on a razor's edge of danger and know that if they are killed there will be an immidiate organization of groups created to praise the killer and free him. No matter how much evidence is there of the killer's guilt the "usual suspects" show up to defend the murderer.

Perhaps if you had listened to your mother when she taught you about respect and courtesy you would not have had such an encounter as you described.

I think a good hard thrust with a knife of reasonable quality would penetrate body armor that doesn't use a ceramic plate.

Tuesday, 14 January, 2003, 21:57 GMT, BBC

Officer killed during terrorism raid

A police officer has died and four others have been injured during a counter terrorism operation in Manchester. The 40-year-old plain clothed detective constable was treated at the scene on Tuesday night for stab wounds but died later in hospital.

The operation was linked to the discovery of the deadly poison ricin in a north London flat last week and to the Metropolitan Police anti-terrorism operation, police have confirmed.

Another officer is reported to have been knifed in the arm and is being treated at North Manchester General Hospital where his condition has been described as "critical".

The injuries happened as Greater Manchester Police officers and immigration officials raided premises in Crumpsall, north Manchester, on Tuesday at 1750 GMT to detain a man under counter terrorism legislation.

Prime Minister Tony Blair and Home Secretary David Blunkett have condemned the killing.

'No protective clothing'

Greater Manchester Police's Assistant Chief Constable Alan Green told reporters the officers had been attacked by a large kitchen knife after they entered a property in Crumpsall Lane to detain one man.

Some of the police officers were not wearing protective clothing, he said.

The three men who were arrested were thought to be of North African origin, said police.

Mr Green paid tribute to the officer who died and has not yet been named.

"We have lost a colleague and many people have lost a friend".

Mr Blair said: "It is an appalling tragedy and wicked in the extreme."

Mr Blunkett added: "My thoughts are with all of those injured and my deepest condolences go out to the families of the officer who was killed".

'Struggle'

Witnesses at the scene said a struggle broke out during the arrests and described the three men being taken from flat.

Five officers involved were two detective constables, one detective inspector, one uniformed sergeant and one uniformed police constable.

The junction of Crumpsall Lane and Middleton Road has been closed to traffic.

Shortly after 2000 GMT, officers wearing chemical suits entered the property.

Police said the three-storey Victorian semi, where the arrests took place, is split into several separate apartments.

Residents said the suburban street is normally a quiet area.

One resident said: "It's shocking something like this has happened."

50+ posts and no one has drawn the connection between the knife attack and the fact that injection is one of the best means of introducing Ricin poison. Could the blade have been poisoned, perhaps anticipating a walk around London, and close at hand when the cops came?

LTS

Police in Britain, France, Germany, etc, are now being forced to enter many neighborhoods that they have left alone for years. Hopefully it's not too late.

Police here in this country have been disarmed to the point that when heavily armed bank robbers open fire on them in L.A. a couple of yrs. ago the police actually had to be armed by a gun shop nearby in order to match the firepower of the creeps.

You had me fooled at first, as I thought you lived in the UK when you said that "police in this country have been disarmed". Let me fill you in on something. Police departments around the country been given military assault weapons such as M-16 rifles (at little or no cost to them) and MP-5 sub-machine guns for tactical use. Almost every police department these days has a SWAT unit, and the days of an officer serving a warrant with a knock on the door are gone in most regions of the country. Innocent citizens have been terrorised by these "no-knock raids" where masked men with automatic weapons target any occupant of the dwelling after smashing down the door, violently throwing them to the floor, and occasionally maiming or killing a "target" when their finger slips. Many of these "targets" that have been shot are innocent individuals, where either the police had the wrong address, or the "tip" that they were given was erroneous.

The LA robbery that you refer to was in February of 1997, well after they had a SWAT team in existance. In fact, the LA police have had a SWAT team since 1967. Why they sent underequipped officers in patrol cars to counter the threat is beyond me.

In Chicago the cops' firepower has been so diminished that they routinely carry their own guns to augment their firepower. None of this means cops are perfect or shouldn't be criticised when they do wrong but at least wait until the facts are known and established by non-kook sources.

In Chicago, officers are required to purchase their own service weapon, and they have the choice of carrying any type of pistol they wish. So it's not that they are forced to use a wimpy gun as a duty weapon and need to augment it with their own, it's that they are required to buy their own duty weapon. But, I do know that they have a SWAT team (they call it a Hostage-Barricade-Terrorism (HBT) team) that I'm sure is armed to the gills with military hardware. They also have a tactical or gang crimes unit, which is also certainly well armed.

As far as the climate in Chicago concerning guns, well, even the police aren't allowed to privately own AR-15s and other politically incorrect weapons.

Daley radical gun control program targets private collections of Chicago policemen

Every incident where a cop opens fire is met by a chorus of criticism from the Cop Hater Choir here at FR before the facts are established. It is as reflexive as that of Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson.

I wouldn't know about that, but I have seen some instances that were over the line, such as the incident where a FBI swat team fired a round from a M-16 carbine into the face of an innocent young eagle scout who was with his girlfriend coming home from the mall. There, they high-fived each other and laughed as the kid was bleeding on the ground while his girlfriend was begging them to call an ambulance. Last I heard, no action was taken against any of the agents involved.

Are these leftists posing as conservatives? It is false that "routine" matters are handled in a military fashion by local police.

I'd say many routine matters are handled as military operations. Case in point is the "felony stop" seen in the video where the dog is shot. There is no need to point shotguns at people once they are on their knees and handcuffed. It could just of easily been a case of one of these innocent vacationers having their heads blown off instead of just their pooch. Covering incapacitated prisoners with weapons pointed at them is a military tactic, not one of a civilian police force.

To disagree with these abuses doesn't make one a leftist, unless of course in order to be a "conservative" one must favor a totalatarian police state. In my opinion, speaking out against these abuses makes one a concerned citizen who is performing his or her duty as an American.

LINKS OF INTEREST:

THIS IS LONDON.com: "POLICEMAN KILLED IN TERROR SWEEP" (ARTICLE SNIPPET: "A police officer was stabbed to death and four others were injured during the arrest of three terrorist suspects. The operation was linked to last week's discovery of the deadly poison ricin in London. The officer died as three suspects were arrested at a flat in Crumpsall, north Manchester. Greater Manchester Assistant Chief Constable Alan Green said the 40-year-old plain clothes constable died of stab wounds at North Manchester General Hospital after receiving emergency treatment at the scene.") (January 14, 2003)

BBC NEWS: "SIX QUESTIONED IN RICIN INVESTIGATION" (ARTICLE SNIPPET: "Anti terrorist police investigating the discovery of ricin at a flat in London have arrested six people in Dorset. The five men and a woman are being questioned at police stations in the Bournemouth area after being arrested there on Sunday. It follows a joint operation between the Special Operations Unit of the Metropolitan Police and Dorset Police. Last week the deadly poison ricin was discovered at a flat in Wood Green, London.") (011303)

BBC NEWS: "FOUR ON CHEMICAL TERROR CHARGES" (ARTICLE SNIPPETS: "Four men have been charged with producing chemical weapons following the discovery of the deadly poison ricin in a north London flat. The men, described as North Africans, were among seven arrested after anti-terrorist police raided the Wood Green flat and allegedly found a small amount of the substance. Mouloud Feddag, Sidali Feddag, Samir Feddag and Mustapha Taleb, 33, were charged under section 57 of the Terrorism Act with "possession of articles of value to a terrorist". They were also charged under the Chemical Weapons Act 1996 with "being concerned in the development or production of chemical weapons"....A fifth man, Nasreddine Fekhadji, was charged with two offences under the Forgery and Counterfeiting Act."..."A sixth man has been arrested for alleged possession of drugs and immigration matters, and is expected to be bailed to return pending further enquiries. A seventh man has been released into the custody of the Immigration Service, Scotland Yard confirmed.") (January 12, 2003)

THIS IS LONDON.com (THE EVENING STANDARD): "POISON GANG SOUGHT ASYLUM"

SEATTLE POST-INTELLIGENCER - Search Term: "RICIN"

SEATTLE TIMES - Search Term: "RICIN"

WISCONSIN.gov - DEPARTMENT OF HEALTH and FAMILY SERVICES Disease Fact Sheet Series: "RICIN POISONING" (Updated May 8, 2002)

DefenseLINK.mil: "DoD IS PREPARED TO PROTECT AGAINST BIOLOGICAL THREATS" (NOTE: This is not a classified document.) (January 9, 2003)

U.S. STATE DEPARTMENT: "FACT SHEET Chemical-Biological Update" (December 2002)