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Paintballers have stand off with Police SWAT in Coconut Creek, FL.
Florida Shooters Network ^ | 1/5/03 | Ryan

Posted on 01/05/2003 1:07:14 PM PST by Sledge

The following was posted on the Florida Shooters Network BBS this afternoon. What Ryan is hoping for is to inundate the e-mail of Mayor of Coconut Creek with e-mails expressing outrage over this blatant abuse of police power, ignoring private rights, and generally being jerks in dealing with a bunch of kids playing paintball on a vacant wooded lot.

Thank you for your help. I know that no one can "inundate" like Freepers.

--------------------------------------------------------

For those you who don't know. I operate out of Broward County operating a licensed corporation selling Paintball Supplies and Law-Enforcement Gear to the general public and private industries.

Well today wasn't a good day for my customers who play paintball inside the city of Coconut Creek.

Yesturday I was told by Officer Chris Colehorst to leave the property I had permission by the property owner to use to have kids and adults play on.

Officer Colehorst had a very bad attitude and wouldn't listen to any reasoning what so ever from us or the property owner...

Mind you my customers have been playing on this property for weeks since everyone was thrown off the old field up the street.

I called the property owner out on Saturday. He came and explained the situation to the officers. You think the officers would listen huh. NNNNNNNNNNOOOOOOOO...

So today all the paintballers went back to the old field except I where the same single officer who confronted us yesturday told them to leave.

Well try telling 40 pissed off already people that. MIAMI RIOTS MEAN ANYTHING HERE.

SO guess what... They told the one same officer to go screw off.

Guess who shows up at 11:30 am this morning.... after they told officer Colehorst to screw off.

WOW Coconut Creek SWAT shows up to enforce paintballers............ WOW something is strange here fellas... In this country of ours.... You dangerous evil paintballers must die from MP5 SMG fire.

I couldn't believe the phone calls I just got over the cell phone / NEXTEL direct connect....

Christ oh mighty for paintball. WTF guys...

I have a meeting with the Mayor of Coconut Creek Mayor Jim Walden Monday afternoon at 2:00 to discuss this situation. I have letters from parents and kids discussing there grief over the police stand off's over paintball. This stuff is just getting stupid by the year.

Coconut Creek SWAT to round up paintballers, WTF is going on...

I wasn't out there today but these kids have been playing out there in the old field since 1997. Now their's a problem with police after 5 years of playing.

I made a deal with a land owner up the street from the old field to clean up his property in exchange for the kids to use it as there new field. We did that three weeks ago.

Yesturday the NAZI Authorities threw us off the new field causing more problems. Tomorrow I need to speak with the thrid reich mayor and get his approval to the use the property we have permission to use for a field the kids can play on.

Contact Info is here for anyone who cares.

Coconut Creek Police Dept. 954-973-6700

Officer Cherry Judd

Officer Chris Corehorst

Seargent Waymire (Delta Unit Northern District)...

Oh officer Coreherst had the balls to call me this morning on my business mobile number and asked me on his personal cell phone if I was in the old field. CAN YOU SAY POLICE ENTRAPMENT. I own his ass now...

Thank god I have caller I.D. I have officer Coreherst personal cell number. The @#%$ cop with an attitude.

I'm sure to file a complaint Monday with the Mayor's office with other parents about this officer who seems to enjoy his job to much with the general public.

I was told this officer has been on the force for 7 months only...... Hmmmmm he is still on his probationary period... What a shame... This officer was really a dick to the property owner to the parents and I out in the new field. No reason to have that attitude towards parents or kids. He will be written up no doubt.

Funny how his attitude changed when I told him my attorney's number and the Mayor's Office number. Power is nothing with-out control.

The cops have no clue what they are doing. Right now no laws exist to enforce because there aren't any. There are no ordinances or laws broken. Nor has anyone been hurt. Everyone cleans up there own trash and keeps the areas clean.

You would think that when a property owner gives you permission to use his property the way it was intended to be used for you can use it. NOT ACCORDING TO THE THIRD REICH POLICE. When does the police have jurisdiction over an individuals property and how he or she operates on it. WTF

You get thrown off the old field a vacant field lot granted the kids did not have permission to use. OK no problem...

THE NEW FIELD........

I busted my ass on this land owners property cleaning it up for three weeks to have permission to use it so the kids can play on it and still be accosted by the cops. I can't figure this dilema out. You can't win, unless, unless you have NUCLEAR WEAPONS

I plan on doing a presentation in front of Mayor Hitler tomorrow. I also have letters from parents and individual players who are waiting for an answer from the top brass... Yeh like this matters.

The only thing political gestpos understand is $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ of course. So I will see how this angle comes out. Catch my drift/

If I can't make this happen. I need a venture capitalist fast to build a legal tax paying field because these kids aren't gonna leave town any time soon.

I get over 200 customers a weekend buying merchandise from my shop. Huge gross revenue. I rent out equipment and service markers that need to be repaired.

The Police have just made it difficult for these kids...

Why can't the cops just be friends. Just like mike

I offered the cops to play but the Chief Adolph Hitler threatend the individual officers already from playing. Conduct of unbecomming of an officer crap.

I own my own business and have all the time on my side but very little patience dealing with a-holes

If you would like to assist in a minor role with this situation. Please call the City Hall of Coconut Creek 954-973-6770

Ask for Mayor Jim Walden

E-mail for him is at jwaldman@creekgov.net

SWAT TEAM -vs- Paintballers that is to funny but scary.

I can be reached at 954 - 575 - 5039 directly.


TOPICS: Activism/Chapters; Crime/Corruption; US: Florida
KEYWORDS: banglist
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To: Ryanhk21owner
Have the property owner fax a copy of the written agreement to the paintball club allowing them use of his property to 1. the Chief of Police, and 2. his attorney.
121 posted on 01/06/2003 11:14:15 AM PST by Liberal Classic
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To: freeeee
"Translation: The peasants must not be insolent to their masters."

Actually, the translation is: Act like a child, get treated like a child.

Grow up.

122 posted on 01/06/2003 11:25:28 AM PST by Hatteras
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To: Hatteras
Act like a child

Petitioning the government for a redress of grievances is childish??

Call me crazy, but I thought the proper, responsible response to a grievence is to politely and firmly make your concerns known to the proper authorities. How silly of me.

Since this is so absurd, please by all means enlighten us. Just how do "grownups" handle such things?

Grow up

Translation: Roll over.

123 posted on 01/06/2003 11:32:42 AM PST by freeeee
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To: DAnconia55
Why do you defend the indefensible so often? The cops are wrong, and are acting like goons. They have no right to make these people leave private property at all.

The author of this screed says, among other things, that "WOW Coconut Creek SWAT shows up to enforce paintballers............ WOW something is strange here fellas... In this country of ours.... You dangerous evil paintballers must die from MP5 SMG fire. "

Of course, nobody died from MP5 SMG fire. There was no MP5 SMG fire whatsoever, and it was probably never going to happen. AppyPappy was correct in pointing out the ridiculousness of equating this incident with the nazis.

The hyperbolic tone of the message itself leads me to believe that there's a lot more to this story than "Ryan" is telling us, and that it's a bit more favorable to the cops than he'd have us believe.

Cops can misbehave, sure. They may well have done so here. But "Ryan" is not telling us the entire story -- which makes me think he and his pals bear some of the responsibility for this situation getting out of hand.

124 posted on 01/06/2003 11:34:59 AM PST by r9etb
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To: freeeee
"Call me crazy, but I thought the proper, responsible response to a grievence is to politely and firmly make your concerns known to the proper authorities. How silly of me."

Are you sure you're on the right page? My reply was in response to the call to inundate the police department's e-mail box with spam from people all over the country who have no idea (based on this posting on a Paintballer's website) what the heck the writer is trying to say. His breathless diatribe amounts to nothing more than an attempt to stir up an emotional outburst that would result in a crashed server in police headquarters.

My simple advice was to step back, take a deep breath and approach this a little more even keeled.

...and firmly make your concerns known to the proper authorities."

I define "proper authorities" as the police department heads and their attorneys, the property owner and his attorneys, your attorneys if you choose, perhaps town council members and maybe even the mayor and a local news channel. I do not define "proper authorities" as any 14 year old paintballer from all over the internet with enough time on their hands to spam the police department's server. Perhaps in your world you do, I would disagree.

125 posted on 01/06/2003 12:02:11 PM PST by Hatteras
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To: jerrymdss
Its everyone business and respnsibility in these United States to encourage people to exercise use of common sense you moron.

IMHO .... you're the moron

126 posted on 01/06/2003 12:06:08 PM PST by clamper1797
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To: Hatteras
My reply was in response to the call to inundate the police department's e-mail box with spam from people all over the country who have no idea (based on this posting on a Paintballer's website) what the heck the writer is trying to say.

It has been my observation that widespread outrage from the community (and even more so, the entire country) will light a fire under a public servant's @ss, where previously they may have been less "receptive".

His breathless diatribe amounts to nothing more than an attempt to stir up an emotional outburst that would result in a crashed server in police headquarters.

If even half the things he claims are true, there is a great big problem. I agree this needs further looking into, and we shouldn't take his claims (or anyone else's) at face value.

Sure, his complaint is poorly written, but consider how upset he is. Sometimes people aren't very eloquent when they're pissed. That doesn't change the facts of the matter.

I define "proper authorities" as the police department heads and their attorneys, the property owner and his attorneys, your attorneys if you choose, perhaps town council members and maybe even the mayor and a local news channel.

Complaints are made to proper authorities. I don't believe one needs be an 'authority' to lodge a complaint.

127 posted on 01/06/2003 12:17:08 PM PST by freeeee
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To: Sledge
Surprised? ...Not!!

Here in Houston, HPD arrested over 300 K-Mart "shoppers".

All charges were eventually dismissed and civil lawsuits will cost Houston many millions.

128 posted on 01/06/2003 12:22:35 PM PST by TexasCajun
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To: Hatteras
Inundating a police department with e-mail will be looked upon as extremely childish behavior and will do more damage to his cause than good.

Oh, I don't know. Police departments live in abject fear of bad publicity. Another option might be to alert the local media. Is there a TV station nearby that would cover the fracas?

129 posted on 01/06/2003 12:28:26 PM PST by Oberon
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To: Sledge
If my experience with the local paintball community is any guide, the paintballers may have annoyed one too many adjacent property owners, and gotten the police chief on their case as a result.
130 posted on 01/06/2003 12:33:51 PM PST by Poohbah
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To: AppyPappy
I guess you don't believe Presidents either.

Generally, no.

Especially certain ones with bent anatomies.

131 posted on 01/06/2003 6:08:25 PM PST by DAnconia55
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To: Teacher317
You should have seen the game I played in a few years back, "Outlaw Bikers" vs USMC (They claimed they were Force Recon but acted more like cooks and mechanics). What a hoot!
132 posted on 01/06/2003 6:08:44 PM PST by Chuckster
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To: AppyPappy
"If I remember, private tapes are not admissable because they can be edited."

Just a helpful hint though.... the tape is perfectly legal for your own use such as... making an exact transcript for yourself and a witness to sign and submit to the court. A transcript produced in this manner IS very admissible in most states and very useful.

Cheers,
Lloyd

133 posted on 01/06/2003 6:27:15 PM PST by Lloyd227
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To: All
I apologize for the delay freepers.

As far as I understand it now by direct word of mouth. The Coconut Creek Police Administration does not want the paintballers around anymore and will enforce the city ordinance about discharging airguns with-in the city limits to the fullest extent of the oridance as possible no matter what property the kids are on.

This is the understanding Captain Devine second in command made very clear to me on the phone.

What evers means he will enforce the ordinance which I totally understand he can legally do. No Problem.

I met with Mayor Jim Waldman. Nice gentlman who wants to remedy this situation but wants to remain neutral. The Mayor referred me towards the Police Administration building where I spoke with Captain Devine. No such luck speaking with the captain. He doesn't want us around. He will enforce the city code as long as it stands. He referred us to City Hall again to meet with the City Commissioners. I spoke with the Commission secretary to schedule a meeting to be had at City Hall. I was told I will only be given 3 minutes to state my case in front of the city commission in which I believe nothing will get done.

I called the Mayor Jim Waldman back and left a message for him to call me back. He never called back.

Please understand there is alot of out-rage with how Law-Enforcement officials are handling this situation. I believe I have been more than professional in the beginning trying to remedy this on going problem.

The kids and the parents are assisting with this matter along side civil attorney's. Attorney's are well aware what is going on and recommended the City Commission route as a channel.

I contacted the ACLU in case any incidences occur between paintballers and Law-Enforcement again. I want to make sure no officials step out of bounds with this group.

I want the e-mails coming and flowing. I need the City Commission to be well aware of the situation. I want them to be well aware they are being watched along side the Police Department. I don't believe it is childish as long as the e-mails are appropriate in nature. I still need your support in this matter from all of you whether you agree or disagree on this issue.

This is what makes America great. The power of the people will preveil.

As far as the paintball fields go they do border busy businesses, neighborhoods and roadways. The fields are designed to eliminate accidental shootings beyond the property boundaries. I have visited both fields on the weekends. The new paintball field is much safer for the kids to play on than the old field.

The new issue is the city ordinance barring the discharge of firearms, airguns, or deadly missiles with-in city limits. $50.00 fine per offense apparently was the threat.

I can't control late at night if people are going around and vandalising other people's property. I can't stop that.
Grafitti has been a problem in the city but it's not done by the paintballers who play during the day.

My goal in this situation is to reach a positive solution between the Police Department and the City of Coconut Creek.
I'm not with Alice in Wonderland. This seems it will never happen.

A public city owned paintball field would be great but it will never happen. Most local kids cannot travel far away where I set up another field for them to play on.

I will try my best with the City Commission. I will not give up at this point. I believe most of us know the out come already.

Again I apologize for previous rants. Hopefully you understand the situation.

Thanks to everyone who have assisted with this matter.

Let Freedom Ring >>>>>>>>>>>>>


134 posted on 01/07/2003 9:40:32 AM PST by Ryanhk21owner
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To: Ryanhk21owner
please keep us updated
135 posted on 01/08/2003 6:19:50 AM PST by CONSERVE
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To: Ryanhk21owner
So, after all this discussion, it turns out that the city had a valid ordinance in place and you guys were in violation?

(Others, please feel free to chime in here) I got the impression from this thread and the original complaint from you, the store owner, that the officer was trying to do something which was not covered by an existing law. Apparently he was in the right in asking you to not play paintball, but you have given the impression that you were some sort of victim.

If there is an existing law on the books, then you must change the law, not refuse to comply with the officer who is enforcing it.

136 posted on 01/08/2003 8:21:11 AM PST by webstersII
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To: Ryanhk21owner
The only way your City council is going to pay any attention to you is if you flood the chambers with unhappy parents.

The politicos only understand the power of the vote. Their attitude about your life and livelyhood is "screw you," your nothing but an annoyance.
137 posted on 01/08/2003 8:37:49 AM PST by Rebelbase
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To: All
Seems like the P.D. has put a game plan together them selves to make my presence un-welcome in their town.

I was called tonight by one of my customers who came in contact with an ALPHA shift officer.

The officer engaged in conversation with one of my customers which wasn't smart on his part and stated Creek Police has issued a B.O.L.O. for me. Why I haven't a clue but I guess it was in retaliation from the great work you guys have done thus far.

The A.C.L.U. has contacted me back. They have responded to my request for assistence. The States Attorney's office is well aware of what is going on right now. I'm making sure all my T's are crossed and I's dotted before anything more happens.

You are correct about the city ordinance. The ordinance has never been enforced in the past five years since the fields appeared for paintballers. No one knew they even existed until last week.

The screws are being tighten down. Fear and intimidation is the old bag of tricks they want to play. No problem.

I can finally say that I'm lawyered up at this point in time. There is no need to escalate the situation further. I'm in the process of doing what council has asked me to do.

I will maintain my business and conduct commerce as instructed by the guidence of council.

I would like to say thank-you to those folks out there that have assisted in this manner professionally.

I will stay in touch.
138 posted on 01/08/2003 9:10:09 PM PST by Ryanhk21owner
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To: Sledge
I will be writing a letter to this nazi mayor today.

Keep playing, you have my support.

dell
139 posted on 02/05/2003 8:33:49 AM PST by cajun315
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To: Ryanhk21owner
I have been a paintball player for 10 years. Where I live, the fields are out in the rural areas as most cities, like yours, do not allow the discharge of a PB gun in city limits. Generally we have to drive 30-60 minutes to get to the locations.

All the fields are large enough to make sure stray shots do not go into surrounding private properties or roads. The field operators and property owners are properly licensed, the fields are properly zoned for that kind of use and all are insured to cover injuries or mishaps. No one is harassed by the local authorites or police. In fact, there are many police and fire teams that play. Everyone observes the rules, nobody gets hurt and everyone has a good time.

From what I've read, and I may be wrong because the facts are a little hazy, it appears that local kids had been playing on a field, admittedly for some time, that they didn't have permission to use. That field was inside city limits where they have an ordinance against discharging air guns.

The city curtailed the PB activities on that field, so you moved to another field owned by a friend, but still within city limits and subject to those laws. The cops showed up to stop play, so the kids moved back to the old field that they had already been asked not to use. The cops showed up the second time in riot gear to enforce the local ordinance. Is this pretty much it?

Here are my observations. The old field was neither zoned for that type of use and there was a city ordinance prohibiting PB in city limits, nor did you have permission to use it. Since the city didn't bother you for five years, I'm assuming someone recently made a complaint. As the one good cop said, as long as they someone doesn't complain, they probably would leave you alone. Once the complaint was made, the city had an obligation to enforce the law, if purely for liability reasons.

Although you had permission from the landowner to use the second field, it was not properly zoned either, and, in my experience 10 acres is rather small to insure stray shots do not find their way to other property, cars or pedestrians who may travelling on adjacent roads. Unless there is more evidence, the police had the right to ask you to leave.

At this point, the kids go back to old field they had already been asked to not use. The cops can only think they have a bunch of rebels who are defying their requests. So a bunch show up in riot gear to remove them. Personally, I don't blame them. PB's can travel over 300 feet/sec and easily put out an eye, pop an eardrum, knock out a tooth or break a nose. If I was cop, going to remove a bunch of kids with air guns who have violated requests to desist, I would also put on riot gear. It would not be unreasonable to believe some of those kids might pop off a few shots at my head as I approach.

Are you organizing and running these paintball events on these fields? Do you or whoever is doing it have the proper training and liability insurance in case one of the kids takes one in the eye? Is there anyone insuring that proper safety equipment is being used at all times and that safety procedures are in place and being practiced? Are these kids being properly supervised by adults?

No offense, but what this looks like to me is a business owner trying to protect his interests. You may not operate the fields but your living is made off of selling guns, helmets and paintballs to these kids. I don't have a problem with you doing that, but don't come in here calling people nazis and hysterically claiming that your fundemental civil rights are being violated because local officials are enforcing the laws.

My suggestion is instead of acting like an hysterical boob, you forget about that city and get together with county officials and politely inquire as to what you need to do to set up a properly licensed, insured and functioning paintball field somewhere down the road. Your claim that these kids can't play if they can't walk to the field is ludicrous. Their parents appear to be involved enough to scream at city officials, but they won't drive them to the fields to play? Did any of these parents make sure the field was being operated by professionals who are interested in their kids safety as well as making a buck or two?

Here is the comment that sealed it for me...

I need a venture capitalist fast to build a legal tax paying field..."

So, the fields you were using were neither legal nor paying the appropriate taxes. It seems to me you might be trying to take advantage of the good people on this Forum. I would not recommend anyone respond to this "FReeping" request until more is known about it and the motives of the people involved.

140 posted on 02/05/2003 9:35:50 AM PST by Bob J (Join the Free Republic Network! www.freerepublic.net)
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