[twas]

As long as the "solution" to falling birth rates in western countries is increasing immigration, there appears to be little hope for survival.

Eat, drink, and be merry, for tomorrow we will be overrun.

[2banana]

Many Italian men, she said, live with their mothers into their 30's. When they marry, they are not prepared to help out at home in ways that take pressure off women, especially if those women want to have children.

It is hard to imagine that a long time ago, these people's ancestors ruled the world for hundreds and hundreds of years. The best hope for Italy is:

1. A Catholic revival
2. Make it easy for people of Italian decent to move back
3. End the socialist gravy train

[thinking]

But the trend hit Western Europe earlier, and has had more time to produce hand-wringing and soul-searching. Apart from welcoming more immigrants, "no one knows precisely what to do".

If I may be so bold….I know what to do……women have babies, that is the answer. Nothing new about this, it is called procreation. Governments have to reduce the tax load on families, by granting greater tax relief for married men with families….

[Cacique]

bump

[Bill Davis FR]

and the birth rate for islam countries is 8.5....muslims to conquer world through numbers...

[First Amendment]

I have a question that I bet no one can answer: since Europe is losing its population (and I read the same thing is happening in Japan), US would be losing population except for immigration, and Africa and Asia have millions of AIDS cases with more on the way,
****WHERE THE HECK IS THE OVER-POPULATION everyone always bleats about?? That's one of the reasons liberals trot out for abortion, and a host of other stuff. I've been wondering about this for a long time....?

[Fiddlstix]

Bump

[quebecois]

One could write a whole book about this article...but I'll just make a few short points:

1) What is it that these childless people are counting on to care for them in their old age? It is the govt, and indirectly, the taxpayers. What if the govt goes bankrupt? What if there are no longer enough taxpayers to finance them in anything like the style to which they've become accustomed? In reality, these people are each making a calculation that they can squander their lives on themselves and materialistic pursuits, and that they can throw the responisibilities of caring for them in their old age off onto society and onto those people (whom they probably view as "suckers") who take the time and effort in their lives to raise children.

2) Notice how these discussions are always draped in the ideology of liberalism. As if everything would be fine in a world without children if we could only find some other way to finance our welfare state.

3) I'm afraid that it will take a severe economic crisis (which many of these old, childless people probably will not survive.....life is tough on the street at 80 with no kids and no socialism) accompanied by a resurrection of traditional western values to turn this thing around. Western people are too steeped in this culture of narcissism and materialism to be extracted in any other way but by cold, ugly reality. Excepting this, we will be displaced by other cultures who harbor values more conducive to survival and procreation.

4) I was at a Christmas party yesterday with 6 other couples aged 35-45....all highly educated professionals. Other than my two kids, one couple had one child and the other 4 couples had none. Twelve adults and only three kids....not a good sign for the future.

[HumanaeVitae]

"In no West European country did the rate reach 2.1 — the marker that, demographers say, means an exact replenishment of the population. By contrast, the United States had a 2.0 rate, which demographers attribute to *greater immigration*."

Those Hispanics may save us yet...

P.S., Moderator, I think we can only publish excerpts of NYT articles...I know WaPO articles need to be redacted. FYI, thanks

[PoorMuttly]

It's the BIRTH rate, not the Fertility rate. They are fertile, just not using it. I have a friend who lost her only 9 year old son to a bicycle accident, and her husband has had a vasectomy...they have a remaining daughter. Two is not enough. Her husband outsmarted himself, and the boy's grandfather gave away his Marine Corps sword.

[Life of Brian]

No children?! Who will pay our debts?!!! Who will maintain our temples and palaces?!! The leech has two daughters, "Give! Give! they cry!"

Proverbs: When the wicked rise to power, people go into hiding; but when the wicked perish, the righteous thrive. He who oppresses the poor to increase his wealth and he who gives gifts to the rich-both come to poverty. A large population is a kings glory, but without subjects a prince is ruined.

[stuartcr]

With modern times in the west, comes the need for both parents to work full-time. I believe it's mostly economic. Governments giving incentives isn't the answer because with these incentives, comes increased taxes, forcing both parents to go to work. Unless the western world wants to go backwards, and become more like the third world countries, this is the way it is.

[Godel]

This makes me want to cry. Are we so selfish a culture that we commit cultural suicide rather than have a second or third child?

[aristeides]

What about all the illegal immigrants to this country from Latin America? Couldn't we send a lot of them to Europe? They are at least Christian and speak a European, Christian language.

[PLK]

fertility rates have plummeted over the last decades,

This is misleading terminology. I doubt that "fertility" rates have dropped, the Italians are probably just as "fertile" as they have ever been. It's the birth rate that has actually dropped as more people in developed countries practice birth control and abortion to prevent and eliminate pregnancies caused by their "fertile" state of being. The opposite of "fertile" is "sterile."

[Aric2000]

When the governments answers continue to be throw money at it, there is going to be MAJOR problems.

Quit taking so much of your producers money for these programs, and they may actually have MORE children on their own. Why? because they will have more money to raise them.

Why didn't they think of that? Because they don't!!

[Coleus]

Abortion and Contraception are contributing factors as well as an anti-family, anti-church, self-centered mindset. I blame the UN and liberals.

[Stavka2]

Contraception and abortion are more readily available. Divorce is more common. Moreover, decades of prosperity have altered people's assumptions and expectations. Older people once poised to look after grandchildren now pursue other activities and travel more. As for would-be parents, their attachments to leisure time, conveniences and indulgences do not easily accommodate multiple children — or sometimes, for that matter, any children at all.

And there folks is the jist of the problem, a post Christian W. Europe. Funny, in Russia, with the economy recovering, the birth rate has started to go up and the abortion rate to drop. While the churchs are bursting at the seams.

[ninenot]

Lemmeeesee, heah,

We need more TV's, more SUV's, more kitchen appliances, more software and hardware. Can't possibly afford children.

Those of you who are still asking "what's the problem with the Japanese economy" might take a look at their birthrate (not that it's the ONLY problem) and find that THERE ARE NO CHILDREN IN JAPAN. So all the middle-agers are saving for retirement, not spending on kids; and the 'not spending on kids' means that there's damn little demand, even though there's lotsa cash-in-the-banks.

The REAL crunch, as in Italy, will arrive when all those old folks expect Gummint help to stay alive in nursing homes. Who can pay THOSE taxes if there are no younger earners?

THIS is the problem that PJBuchanan has not addressed. While he carries on about "immigration problems" (meaning there are too many immigrants,) he has not yet proposed exactly how the Gummint will provide the promised SOcial Security/Medicaid bennies with NO TAXPAYERS REMAINING...