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To: GOPcapitalist
If you do ever get curious, you might consider comparing the cost of building and maintaining an expressway (including interest and lost property tax revenue), versus the revenue it creates through gas taxes based on vehicle miles travelled on the road.

I did so recently for a study on Houston roads. Freeways beat rail in every case. Whereas almost all of the freeway costs are regained in the totals raised through gas taxes, vehicle licensing, and toll roads where applicable, rail falls far short in the ammount regained by user fares. Highway beat rail in practically every single case hands down. If you'd like, I'll pull the stats for you on our line.

I find this hard to believe. First of all, a new freeway does not produce vehilce registration revenue. Nor do new FREEways produce toll revenue. How many vehicles per day are going down each mile of freeway? 100,000? 200,000?

Each 100,000 vehicles per roadway mile @ 20 mpg average @$0.40 tax per gallon is just $2000 per day in revenue, or $730,000 per year. At a 20 year roadway life, that produces a total $14.6 million dollars of gas tax revenue. Urban and suburban freeways are today going for costs of $50-$100 million per mile exclusive of major interchanges, bridges, etc. (rural and exurban freeways are less, but have far less traffic too, so less gas tax revenue). To this must be added the annual maintenance and police costs for the road (grass cutting, pothole repair, restripping, plowing, salting, appurtenance repair, signage updates, etc.), the lost property taxes, which must now be made up by other taxpayers (@ $1,000,000 per acre valuation and a millage of say 20 per thousand, and perhaps a minimum of 20 acres of land per mile, that's $400,000 per annum in lost taxes), and the interest costs on amortizing the bonds used to finance the construction (@4%, that's $2,000,000 per year for a $50,000,000 per mile freeway). A proper analysis would also include the opportunity cost of paying that annual amortization. Assuming $1 million per year for maintenance and police, we've got annual revenue of around $750,000 to 1.5 million vs. costs of $3.4 million or $5.4 million with opportunity costs.

The gas tax works out to aroun $0.02 per mile. Self financing toll roads like the turnpikes in some states charge about $0.05-$0.10 per mile for cars and much more for trucks for shorter distance passages. These roads do not include the complex interchanges most freeways do have at major intersections. These interchanges can cost $250 million each and more, while major bridges can easily cost billions, as will the new Wilson bridge on the Capital Beltway across the Potomac. This suggests a self-financing expressway system would cost drivers a minimum of 150% more than what they presently experience for lineal distance, with extra charges for bridges and major interchanges.

The freeway system is built upon the backs of people who do not drive on it - the people on the local roads and toll highways, and property tax payers in general. In this sense, it is little different than the mass transit systems you are decrying.

Urban personal transportation has never been a paying proposition. The first subways and trolleys were generally not successfull financial enterprises, which is why the City's were involved from the beginning. Similarly, the private sector simply did not come forth with modern roadways to improve our mobility in developed areas (unlike rural roads, which were built as private toll roads) because the capital costs are so enormous.

150 years of experience have shown that there are just two sectors of the transportation industry that private capital is willing to take on - freight railroading and pipelines. Everything else is socialized, and is going to remain that way. That said, the question is really how is public money best raised and spent on this endeavor?

13 posted on 01/01/2003 8:26:07 PM PST by Hermann the Cherusker
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To: Dog Gone
Gee, the Houston Comical has yet another in a series of articles touting 18th century trains over 21st century cars...
14 posted on 01/01/2003 8:33:34 PM PST by Southack
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To: Hermann the Cherusker
Thank you for posting the facts. Providing transportation infrastructure is a wholly proper and constitutional responsibility of government. The myth of the "self-financing freeway" is really kind of ridiculous when one realizes that railroads (unlike trucking companies) own and maintain their own infrastructure -- and still turn a healthy profit!

The government has no more business running a railroad than it does running a motor freight line. But providing planning, capital, and maintenance for rail infrastructure is no more "socialistic" than providing the same for road infrastructure. Without government support (including funding), all forms of mass transport -- road, rail, water, and air -- would be unable to operate.

America needs high-speed intercity freight and passenger rail -- the sooner, the better. Projects like Gov. Perry's Trans-Texas Corridor system are the first step in the right direction.

15 posted on 01/01/2003 9:22:20 PM PST by B-Chan
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To: Hermann the Cherusker
I find this hard to believe. First of all, a new freeway does not produce vehilce registration revenue.

That's not necessarily so. New freeways can and do help the construction of new subdivisions, which in turn draw new residents who, as a result of a move, may be inclined to purchase a new automobile to suit their mobility needs. That aside, the vehicular registration alone, whether it increases or remains constant, provides a solid revenue-generating device that applies to users of roadways, which in turn generates a large ammount of regained roadway funding.

Nor do new FREEways produce toll revenue.

Again, that is not necessarily so. What are to be freeways are often constructed by issuing municipal revenue bonds to be repaid by user fees in the early years of their existence. To collect those fees they put in toll booths, which operate until the bond is paid off, and then the road enters into operation as a freeway. In the end you're left with a self-financed freeway construction project.

How many vehicles per day are going down each mile of freeway? 100,000? 200,000? Each 100,000 vehicles per roadway mile @ 20 mpg average @$0.40 tax per gallon is just $2000 per day in revenue, or $730,000 per year. At a 20 year roadway life, that produces a total $14.6 million dollars of gas tax revenue.

Now that's an interesting little financial game you're playing. Too bad it doesn't add up in reality. Why don't you try looking at the real numbers, as in the actual gas revenues collected and actual expenditures on freeway construction?

Here are the 2000 figures. Total revenues raised by taxes, licensing, and user fees totalled $101.5 billion. Maintenance and administration cost $59 billion while about $65 billion was spent as new construction capital. That leaves you with about $22 billion in net shortfalls, or less than a cent losses per passenger mile travelled on highways. By comparison, $1.8 billion was spent on light rail in the same year with revenue returns of only $200 million on that. That translates into $1.23 in losses for every passenger mile travelled on rail.

To this must be added the annual maintenance and police costs for the road (grass cutting, pothole repair, restripping, plowing, salting, appurtenance repair, signage updates, etc.)

Yeah, and by 2000's figures, annual administative costs were barely half the regained revenue from taxes, licensing, and user fees. Absent new construction, there would have been a $40 billion surplus.

the lost property taxes

This is just a guess on my part, but I would venture to say that the loss in property taxes caused when a new roadway takes up a small strip of right of way or frontage area are negligable when compared to the gain in revenue from the property value increases along that new roadway. Freeways make new land easily accessable, which leads to development. When land is developed, evaluations go up and the property tax base increases.

Assuming $1 million per year for maintenance and police, we've got annual revenue of around $750,000 to 1.5 million vs. costs of $3.4 million or $5.4 million with opportunity costs.

That's a lot of assuming on your part, but as I just demonstrated, there's a big difference between your assumptions and the figures as they actually happened in 2000.

These roads do not include the complex interchanges most freeways do have at major intersections.

Really? Cause the toll road network in my city has some of the most developed interchanges of any road in our highway network. And it operates on budget without difficulty. Once again, you assume a lot of stuff that simply doesn't happen in reality.

The freeway system is built upon the backs of people who do not drive on it

Nonsense. Most drivers in an urban area use a freeway at some time or another on a frequent basis, even if not daily. While it is true that there are some costs associated with road construction, they are minimal in comparison to the alternative. In 2000 it was less than a cent in net costs per passenger mile travelled on freeways. Compare that to light rail, which is truly a system built upon the backs of people who do not ride it - our taxes paid $1.23 per passenger mile of rail use in 2000 for a portion of the population that is so small it can be considered negligable in transportation measures.

Urban personal transportation has never been a paying proposition.

Much to the contrary. Between the 1880's and 1915 many cities across the nation had financially successful private transit companies with city franchises. Ours in Houston operated on budget for most of this period, save some business dispute-induced shortfalls in some years. From about 1915 to the 1930's they continued operating streetcars on a budget that was either met or fell slightly short. In the 30's and 40's finances on rail dropped, so they switched to busses which continued as a financially viable enterprise until about 1970.

The first subways and trolleys were generally not successfull financial enterprises

Again, that was not the case at all in Houston. Save business dispute shortfalls, the first big financial hits did not occur until 1915 when taxi cabs became a competitor. The city responded by regulating the taxis into non-existence, and rail continued on or near budget for another 15 years. Try again.

which is why the City's were involved from the beginning.

Houston got rail in 1874. Aside from the city giving the rail company a franchise to build on its streets, no real government assistance came until 1915, over 40 years later. Try again.

That said, the question is really how is public money best raised and spent on this endeavor?

Fair enough of a question. And as I have noted, highways are statistically preferable to rail in practically every case. My additional position is that this could be improved upon by permitting private and quasi-public highway projects when and where it is viable (i.e. toll roads, auction of certain right of ways for private fee-based roadways etc.)

17 posted on 01/01/2003 11:34:13 PM PST by GOPcapitalist
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