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Christmas Before Christ? The Surprising Story
United Church of God ^ | 12/200 | Jerold Aust

Posted on 12/21/2002 11:21:49 AM PST by DouglasKC

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To: crystalk
>This is a canard, tired of hearing about it.

canard (ke-närd´) noun
1. An unfounded or false, deliberately misleading story.

No, Christmas is the canard.  Compare:  A New Look at the Myth of Santa Claus versus the Reality of Jesus Christ

Like an election, there is a time for campaigning (convincing) and a time for voting.  It is past the time for convincing.  Vote in any box you choose.  Have thine own way.

Lu 19:27 But those mine enemies, which would not that I should reign over them, bring hither, and slay them before me.

2Ti 3:8  Now as Jannes and Jambres withstood Moses, so do these also resist the truth: men of corrupt minds, reprobate concerning the faith.

1Jo 3:10 In this the children of God are manifest, and the children of the devil: whosoever doeth not righteousness is not of God, neither he that loveth not his brother.

2Th 2:10 And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved. 11 And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie: 12 That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness.

Re 22:14 Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city. 15 For without are dogs, and sorcerers, and whoremongers, and murderers, and idolaters, and whosoever loveth and maketh a lie.

21 posted on 12/21/2002 3:18:13 PM PST by 2sheep
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To: DouglasKC
read later
22 posted on 12/21/2002 3:23:20 PM PST by LiteKeeper
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To: LiteKeeper
Lest we forget, this may all be a "tempest in a teapot."

2:16,17 - "Therefore no one is to act as your judge in regard to food or drink or in respect to a festival or a new moon or a Sabbath day, things which are a mere shadow of what is to come; but the substance belongs to Christ."

Galatians 4:9-11 But now that you have come to know God, or rather to be known by God, how is it that you turn back again to the weak and worthless elemental things, to which you desire to be enslaved all over again?
(10) You observe days and months and seasons and years.
(11) I fear for you, that perhaps I have labored over you in vain.

I fear that we waste far too much time arguing over things which are a "mere shadow of what is to come" and pay far too little attention to Christ, Himself

23 posted on 12/21/2002 3:36:15 PM PST by LiteKeeper
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To: 2sheep
OK, I confess. I'm an idolater. I'm a Christian that celebrates Christmas. I have a tree, decorations (including an electronic Santa) and like to go to Christmas parties.

Late at night I perform a special pagan ritual. It is commonly known as the "Jingle Bell Twist". I do this around my tree. I then bow down to my electronic Santa and mumble the infamous pagan words "Merry Christmas".

On Christmas eve, I read the sections of the Bible dealing with the birth of Christ. Of course I don't really mean anything by this; I just like to make fun of it.

On Christmas day, I attend church services early in the day. I of course don't mean it. It is just to hide the fact that I've converted to paganism. I have relatives come over (or I go over to be with them). They are "Christians" that also celebrate Christmas, so they are pagans too. We involve ourselves in pagan rituals such as talking, giving/receiving gifts, eating a wonderful pagan meal and simply enjoying eachother's pagan company. It is nice to be able to hang out with other pagans.

After the day is done, I pray to my pagan gods and do that dance around my tree again. Then it is off to bed. I need to rest up for next year's pagan extravaganza.

</sarcasm>

24 posted on 12/21/2002 3:46:08 PM PST by jwillis1010
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To: Junior
Should Christians celebrate pagan holy days and partake in pagan festivals?

Didn't someon once say that a little leven levens the whole lump?

25 posted on 12/21/2002 3:46:22 PM PST by Eagle Eye
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To: jude24
Big freakin' deal. The fact of the matter is that they are still overtly Christian.

Isn't renaming pagan celebrations similar to putting new wine into old skins? Using pagan deities and symbols with new 'Christian' names hardly replaces the old spiritual aspects of those celebrations.

You seem to advocate using 'liberty' to practice paganism.

26 posted on 12/21/2002 3:52:20 PM PST by Eagle Eye
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To: jwillis1010; Thinkin' Gal; Prodigal Daughter
Perhaps you have your own personal sea of glass awaiting you.


A Santa Claus cap lies covered with glass amid the debris in the parking
lot of the Wal-Mart store in Newton, Miss., Thursday, Dec. 19, 2002,
following a tornado. The tornado smashed into stores jammed with
holiday shoppers, injuring about 40 people, at least two critically,
authorities said. (AP Photo/Rogelio Solis)

27 posted on 12/21/2002 3:54:22 PM PST by 2sheep
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To: LiteKeeper
>pay far too little attention to Christ, Himself

If a person refuses to obey Him, they don't know Him.

1Jo 2:4 He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.

Joh 14:15 If ye love me, keep my commandments.
 

De 32:12 So the LORD alone did lead him, and there was no strange god with him.

28 posted on 12/21/2002 4:02:06 PM PST by 2sheep
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To: LiteKeeper
De 32:12 So the LORD alone did lead him, and there was no strange god with him.

Israel was led out of bondage when there were no strange god found in it, and into bondage when there were.  If a person chooses to whore around with strange gods (Idolatry), then it is an easy step to whore around with another man's wife Adultery/Fornication/Unfaithfulness which IS Idolatry.).  Any god will do, any woman will do.  Same principle.

Jesus said, Joh 4:22 Ye worship ye know not what: we know what we worship: for salvation is of the Jews.

29 posted on 12/21/2002 4:04:42 PM PST by 2sheep
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To: DouglasKC
Thanks for posting the truth. Now watch the hypocrites crawl out from the woodwork in anger.

age old story....
30 posted on 12/21/2002 4:07:32 PM PST by ALS
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To: 2sheep
I think we should just start calling you "Osama". You're no different in your intolerance of others. I would rather be bathed in a "sea of glass" then be associated with a first rate kook like yourself. As a Christian I reject your vision of Christianity. It is insulting to anyone who has a tolerant heart or a brain.

This is a long winded way of saying that "Christians" like you make me sick.

Merry F*&^%*# Christmas you self righteous twit.
31 posted on 12/21/2002 4:12:11 PM PST by jwillis1010
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To: DouglasKC
This is not anything new, ya know. It doesn't take a brain surgeon to figure out that if the world was pagan when Christianity emerged that the two must have intertwined so that civil and social moores didn't erupt with indignation over the loss of one and the ascendency of the other.

Of course Santa is not in the bible. And who knows if the Wise Men gave gifts, the Bible says they did. St. Nicholas evolved into Santa, but so what? A little fantasy is good for the soul. Childhood should not be all truth and grim.
Kids find out the tuth and life goes on, but they always look back at the wonder of Santa and Christmas in their childhoods.

Such nonsense. The hope is that they can make GOD go away, and with him all morality. Then they have an open playing field and they, the Powerful, will become the gods.

There is a quote I read once that said "One day all the gods died laughing when one old grim beard of a God said "Thou shalt have no other gods before me." It doesn't matter how they died, But they did die and Christianity will not.
32 posted on 12/21/2002 4:15:59 PM PST by wingnuts'nbolts
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To: jude24; Eagle Eye
>Christmas is from the Saturnalia. Big freakin' deal.

Freakin' and other words are models after F---ing and Frigging which are related to illicit sex, witchcraft and strange gods.  If the Holy Spirit was resident in your heart, He would be telling you to get rid of the garbage...to choose godliness and not resist truth.

Frigg (frîg) or Frigga, Norse mother goddess and the wife of WODEN. Of great importance in GERMANIC RELIGION, she was queen of the heavens, a deity of love and the household.
Your use of the above F-word is reflective of your heart condition.  It is apparent that what dwells within is not holy.

Pr 4:23 Keep thy heart with all diligence; for out of it are the issues of life.

Mt 12:34 O generation of vipers, how can ye, being evil, speak good things? for out of the abundance of the heart the mouth speaketh.

Jesus said we can tell who is true and false by inspecting fruit.  

Mt 7:17 Even so every good tree bringeth forth good fruit; but a corrupt tree bringeth forth evil fruit.
18 A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit.
19 Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire.

>The fact of the matter is that they are still overtly Christian.

Actually Christmas is overtly pagan.

33 posted on 12/21/2002 4:18:05 PM PST by 2sheep
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To: jwillis1010
Jeremiah 10
10:1
Hear ye the word which the LORD speaketh unto you, O house of Israel:
10:2
Thus saith the LORD, Learn not the way of the heathen, and be not dismayed at the signs of heaven; for the heathen are dismayed at them.
10:3
For the customs of the people are vain: for one cutteth a tree out of the forest, the work of the hands of the workman, with the axe.
10:4
They deck it with silver and with gold; they fasten it with nails and with hammers, that it move not.
10:5
They are upright as the palm tree, but speak not: they must needs be borne, because they cannot go.
34 posted on 12/21/2002 4:38:05 PM PST by ALS
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To: crystalk
Merry Christmas, and I predict that will mean something after

Merry Christmas to you. Yeah, it will be around after, too.

35 posted on 12/21/2002 4:38:28 PM PST by RightWhale
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To: Izzy Dunne
Why, exactly, does reading about how the celebration WASN'T invented by Christ or Christians "take all the joy out of things" for you ???

Consider them conquered territory. They used to be pagan days of celebration; now they're Christian days of celebration.

We have the freedom in Christ to celebrate Christmas if we choose. If you choose not to take advantage of that freedom and stay enslaved to the past, then that's your loss.

36 posted on 12/21/2002 4:40:23 PM PST by DallasMike
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To: jwillis1010; ALS; Eagle Eye; Thinkin' Gal
>I think we should just start calling you "Osama". You're no different in your intolerance of others.  I would rather be bathed in a "sea of glass" then be associated with a first rate kook like yourself. As a Christian I reject your vision of Christianity. It is insulting to anyone who has a tolerant heart or a brain.

Tolerance is part of the STRONG DELUSION which is a propaganda technique of satanic globalists (See 122 ) and which includes Ecumenism, Pluralism, Ceasefire, Centrism, Disarmament, Flatteries, Tolerance, Multiculturalism, Diversity, Compromise, Unity, Cooperation, and "Peace and Security."  They are all tools of the enemy used to defeat America, the West and Christendumb.  They are the doctrine of the antichrist and directly opposite to what the L~rd requires.  Tolerance causes one to be Lukewarm and those who yield to it will be spewed out.

 Would Your Church Allow You To Be Like Jesus? -- This link might help you determine what Jesus expected Christians to be like.

>Merry F*&^%*# Christmas you self righteous twit.

You had a choice to yield to righteousness or to yield to a demon leading you to unrighteousness.  You have made a poor choice.

Ro 6:16 Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?

It is up to you to mortify your own flesh, or you will get a demon as a helpmeet just as you evidenced above.

Col 3:5 Mortify therefore your members which are upon the earth; fornication, uncleanness, inordinate affection, evil concupiscence, and covetousness, which is idolatry: 6 For which things' sake the wrath of God cometh on the children of disobedience:

 "Judge Rightly" Is Not Some Guy’s Name

 Nicer than God

 Nice is NOT a fruit of the Spirit

 CHRISTIANS ARE TOO NICE........!!!!!!!

 When nice is a vice

 HELP MY INTOLERANCE

37 posted on 12/21/2002 4:40:31 PM PST by 2sheep
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To: 2sheep
Actually Christmas is overtly pagan.

Not in my household. See my other post for a dose of sanity.

38 posted on 12/21/2002 4:41:20 PM PST by DallasMike
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To: DallasMike; ALS; Eagle Eye
>They used to be pagan days of celebration; now they're Christian days of celebration.

Who said so?  You or G~d?  Show me where He changed, please.  Chapter and verse.

Ps 15:4 In whose eyes a vile person is contemned; but he honoureth them that fear the LORD. He that sweareth to his own hurt, and changeth not.

39 posted on 12/21/2002 4:58:02 PM PST by 2sheep
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To: RightWhale; ALS; Eagle Eye; DouglasKC; Thinkin' Gal; Prodigal Daughter; babylonian; shaggy eel; ...
>>Merry Christmas, and I predict that will mean something after

>Merry Christmas to you. Yeah, it will be around after, too.

I remembered the other day that someone had a dream or vision of the attack against America "on Christmas" so I did an internet search.  I found TWO, not just one, which said it would be on Christmas and at night.  Neither person knew what year this would occur.  Radar should be looking for more than Santa and his reindeer in the sky at night.  I don't know if that is true or not.  If it is and it doesn't happen this year, then perhaps you have another year to seek the L~rd for repentance.

40 posted on 12/21/2002 5:11:52 PM PST by 2sheep
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