U.S. Social Security May Reach To Mexico

http://www.washingtonpost.com/ ^ | 12/19/2002 | Jonathan Weisman

[BallandPowder]

Pushed by the Mexican government, the Bush administration is working on a Social Security accord that would put tens of thousands of Mexicans onto the Social Security roster and send hundreds of millions of dollars in benefits south of the border.

White House and Mexican government officials say discussions on an agreement to align the Social Security systems of the two countries are informal and preliminary. But excerpts from an internal Social Security Administration memo obtained this month say the agreement "is expected to move forward at an accelerated pace," with the support of both governments, and could be in force by next October.

[Republic of Texas]

I voted for Bush 3 times. But he is wrong here, and we need to make him aware of it. There is no reason he can't be challenged by a strong candidate in the next primary. That being said, if Gore were President, we wouldn't be talking about this, it would already be done.

[Protagoras]

The costs will be more than offset by the benefits to the US as well as helping Mexico develop a comprehensive tax base list.

ROTFLMAO

Why not abolish the unconstitutional "Social Security" wealth transfer scheme and benefit American citizens instead?

[justshe]

Thank you for your reasoned response (/sarcasm).

Thank you for your name-calling ("new republican").

Thank you for letting us know you consider President Bush to be like radioactive poison (ref: your Chernobyl/Russia comments).

Thank you for telling me what my views are....based on NO facts...only YOUR assumptions ("...you like that don't you. The "new republicans" usually have not met a liberal program they don't just love. ")

Further discussion with you on such an emotional level is useless and a waste of FR's bandwidth.

I wish you well.

[MissAmericanPie]

Just copy the "U.S. Social Security may extend to Mexico" thread and pass it around to interested parties.

[isthisnickcool]

it has already happened...millions of mexicans and po boxes along the border and receive monthly SS checks...billions of SS dollars flow south each month...

That's BESIDES other state and federal benefits that are flowing south. And a lot of that money is being obtained by fraud!

But hey, it's easy for Congress to spend our money without any accountability or concern for the future. It's what they do. Why should they care if anyone has a problem with that? They are fat as fat can be. And their retirements are 100% guaranteed by us. They can't lose.

Forget about this folks. The big issue is when Trent Lott will apologize again. Don't pay attention to finances. Congress doesn't. /a bit of sarcasm off

[MissAmericanPie]

Sorry make that "U.S. Social Security may reach to Mexico" thread.

[justshe]

***" The GOP aide said Mexican officials would also like benefits to be adjusted upward for a legal Mexican worker who worked in the United States for some time illegally and paid into the Social Security system using a false Social Security number. "

Oops. Looks like the truth leaked out in the very last paragraph. That's inconvenient."***

Read it again....there is NOTHING in that statement that says that the administration is going to GRANT what the Mexican official wants. Vincente hasn't been real successful in getting what he wants.

I won't comment on your "that's inconvenient" because it it irrelevant. Chretien could say tomorrow that he wants the same...and just because it is reported by a GOP AIDE......does NOT cast it in cement as some type of truth or surety.

[Enemy Of The State]

"the Bush administration is working on a Social Security accord that would put tens of thousands of Mexicans onto the Social Security roster and send hundreds of millions of dollars in benefits south of the border. "

What is it with Bush and his love for our southern invaders? Bush will never receive another vote from me.

[Protagoras]

That being said, if Gore were President, we wouldn't be talking about this, it would already be done.

The Dems have proposed this particular scheme? Please cite that.

The Dems aren't the only ones who propose nonsense, accusing them of all things evil only lessens the credibility.

Having said that, no Bush bots will vote against almost anyone with an "R" behind their name. No matter what they do.

[BallandPowder]

Powder..patch..Ball FIRE!

What is it with Bush and his love for our southern invaders? Bush will never receive another vote from me

President Bush has turned down Presidente Fox on several issues, and according to the article the Mexicans are the ones pushing this (of course) since there was a GOP staffer quoted in the article (speaking negatively) about their efforts, I'd hold that thought before allowing Lieberman, Gore, Kerry or Clinton to win the executive office. Activism can stop this. That was my reason for posting, NOT to bash the President.

[BlackbirdSST]

Of course, given the new GOP there is very little room for conservatives in it, eventually, all conservatives will leave the GOP, the sooner the better as far as I'm concerned. Twenty year's after it happens, they'll still be scratching their head's trying to figure out what went wrong! Blackbird.

[MissAmericanPie]

Yeah, the facts about Bush are pretty indefensible, I'm sure it's easier to sull like a "new liberal republican" and have your "feelings" offended and tell someone else to "get real" when it is you that is a hollow shell who has nothing to add to a debate on the merits of the evidence.

If this is your best shot, don't come to a battle of wits with a turnip between your ears and think your offended gracious, "I wish you well", gets you off the hook in any way.

[justshe]

Look.....all I am saying is......don't ASSUME that all that is wanted is going to be granted. There are issues that ARE more pressing than some ASSUMED deal being brokered. I do NOT see the administration making adjustments for real deposits made by phantom workers to phantom recipients. But because some media source says it is so....we form our circle and get our panties in yet another wad. So many of these 'wads' turn out to be nothing. And yet, we expend considerable energy and angst AGAIN AND AGAIN AND AGAIN based on rumors, biased reporting, and unnamed sources. And most times, it is wasted energy as these are only trial balloons meant to inflame us.

[Republic of Texas]

If you look at the history of how we defend our southern border, it's only a matter of time before we give them everything they want. Publicizing this beforehand at least gives us a chance to fight it.

[aShepard]

The pact would be the latest, but by far the largest, of a series of treaties designed to ensure that people from one country working in another aren't taxed by both nations' social security systems

That's total BullSh!t.

When you legally work in the US, you are SS taxed on your US (only) wages. Then if you work in Mexico, you're taxed only on the Mexican wages.

Where's the double taxation??????

[The Duke]

I am truly sorry to see my concerns about the Bush administration validated. This is one of those areas in which I had really hoped that my instincts were wrong.

[Republic of Texas]

No the Dems haven't proposed it, they aren't in power for one, and why should they? The Republicans are doing it for them. I know it's pithy to assume that Bush bots do this and that, but not always accurate. I'm going to vote the same way I always do. I'll vote for the most Conservative candidate in the Primary, and in the General election, whoever that might be.

[WorkingClassFilth]

In a perfect world this would be true.

However, these people are here illegally and operating on forged documents. In adddition, they are taking up tax dollars in education, welfare and medical costs in many, many cases without input. As far as I'm concerned, if someone is working illegally with forged documents their SS deductions are an operating cost of their illegal business activities.

The first measure ought to be to seal the border and stop the flow of illegals. If this isn't firmly on the agenda, then we'll sink in the muck of the secondary issues.

[Ben Ficklin]

You have no comprehension of revenue losses to the US govt brcause of illegal labor:

First, those that working with fake papers are paying their 1/2 share of SS and the employer is his 1/2 share. These illegals are avoiding the income tax by inflating their number of dependents.

Second, there is a very large number of illegals who are avoiding both SS and income tax by working off the books. This is called the "underground economy" and is extensive and growing. You should not consider this to be limited to an illegal cashing his check at the cash checking store. The employers involved in this are avoiding SS and are also avoiding paying income tax on income that they have earned off of illegal labor. The IRS has prosecuted some of these cases and they are sophisticated and complex. It is a large amount of money and near impossible to catch.

Mexico has made progress on reforms and selling off of their "crowning heights" and reducing tariffs but until they develop a personal income tax as a source of revenue, they are limited on what they can do to "modernize". You can be assured that any mexican that enters the US system will also be entering the Mexican system. Any Mexican that applies for and recieves a "Consular ID" is also being entered into a Mexican data base so that he can eventually be taxed.