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Roswell Incident Had Victims, Program Says
AP | 11/22/02

Posted on 11/22/2002 8:42:49 PM PST by Davea

Roswell Incident Had Victims, Program Says

By RICHARD BENKE | The Associated Press 11/22/2002

ALBUQUERQUE - While he told the world that a weather balloon went down in Roswell, an Army general had in his hand a memo telling Pentagon brass of a UFO crash with "victims," according to a new television documentary.

A computer analysis of that memo, held by Brig. Gen. Roger Ramey during a July 1947 press briefing, is the "smoking gun" of the Roswell Incident, researchers say in the documentary being broadcast today on the Sci-Fi Channel.

Using a digital photo scanner to enlarge and enhance words printed on the folded piece of paper Ramey held, and using another computer program to select the most likely words, researcher David Rudiak, who has a Ph.D. in physics from UC Berkeley, found two key phrases: "the victims of the wreck" and "in the 'disc' they will ship."

With the textual study plus University of New Mexico archaeological findings from one of three alleged UFO crash sites, science fiction seeks to close the gap with fact, producers say.

A photograph taken July 8, 1947, in Fort Worth, Texas, by James Bond Johnson of the Fort Worth Star-Telegram shows Ramey clutching a communique to Washington, D.C., while he displays a deflated weather balloon just hours after other Army officers in Roswell had reported a UFO crash.

It was one of a series of inconsistent military reports about the incident, which has become part of American mythology.

"Unless national security is at stake, there is absolutely no reason to keep this information from the public," said Thomas Vitale, a Sci-Fi Channel vice president. "Whatever crashed at Roswell, let us know what the truth is."

The Air Force had responded to a 1994 call from the late U.S. Rep. Steve Schiff, R-N.M., by saying it had no information on the Roswell Incident. Schiff, an Air Force reserve judge advocate general's officer, then took his query to the General Accounting Office, the investigative arm of Congress.

In 1997, the Air Force acknowledged the weather balloon had been a false cover story, but a new story also was called into question. In a report written by Lt. William McAndrew, the Air Force suggested reports of alien bodies in the wreckage must have originated because of a crash-test program in which mannequins were dropped from balloons. The mannequins did not come close to matching 1947 descriptions of alien bodies, and the crash-test program was not introduced until 1953, Rudiak said.

Sci-Fi, guided by longtime Roswell UFO researchers Tom Carey and Don Schmitt, commissioned William Doleman, an archaeologist with UNM's Maxwell Museum of Anthropology, to excavate the alleged initial crash contact point on the ranch where the late Mack Brazel worked as foreman.

Doleman said he knows little about the Roswell Incident but agreed to excavate the site using purely scientific methods because it is "culturally significant" and because so much of what is circulated about the Roswell crash landing is based on hearsay. What was needed, Doleman said, was physical evidence.

"So this project is a very bold step by people who claim to know what happened and where it happened," Doleman said. "What makes it bold is they were willing to go out there and look for physical evidence."

Details of the excavation are being kept confidential until after today's premiere. But Doleman said he agrees "that obviously something happened in July 1947 in southeastern New Mexico." After his work there, though, he said, "I'm still uncertain" about UFOs and alien beings.

The documentary will introduce some witnesses who have not been heard from publicly before, attesting to the existence of alien bodies in the wreckage of the "flying disc," Carey said by phone from his home in Pennsylvania.

"This is where we loaded the bodies," he quotes one New Mexico witness, Robert Slusher, as saying. Slusher, among those appearing in the documentary, was part of a B-29 crew that he said loaded bodies up through the plane's bomb bay at the Roswell Army Airfield.

Three victims were supposedly recovered from the final crash site, and a team of archaeologists, coincidentally, were in the area doing research on ancient Indians at the time, Carey said. Among them was Curry Holden, an archaeologist from Texas Tech in Lubbock, whom Carey located in 1992.

"Curry Holden said he saw everything - the craft and the bodies," Carey said. Holden died a few months later.

Carey, an investigator for a private corporation, said he started looking into Roswell 12 years ago "as a hobby."

But it became more than that. And now, he said, he and Schmitt are in a race against time, as witnesses become scarcer.

©Santa Fe New Mexican 2002


TOPICS: Culture/Society
KEYWORDS: littlegreenies; roswell
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To: MHGinTN; Quix
"I've wondered on occasion if the abduction phenomenon might be an 'all in the mind' sort of thing, caused by 'other worldly' beings or even actual ET's."

If one accepts the premise that the 'spiritual world' (i.e. Satan) has indeed the power here on earth to create alternative "realities" (i.e. ETs, apparitions, mind possession) for purposes of deception as per Biblical warnings, all of these phenomena have been legitimate.

"I can imagine a technological society so advanced that they could formulate a 'wave pattern' of some as yet unknown energy phenomenon which would interact ONLY with the human mental state, even to the extent that physical manifestations of 'evidence' could arise ont he bodies of the human victims."

Both the Russians and U.S. have been experimenting with psychic power as actual weaponry for many years now, harnessing that energy to affect and "attack" the other side's minds from thousands of miles away. Some chilling stuff going on.

As Quix infers, there is much more than meets the eye going on at Roswell....

141 posted on 11/23/2002 8:43:43 AM PST by F16Fighter
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To: Quix
"I could even allow that SOME craft MIGHT be materializations of demons."

Ever been in a dream where you touched an object and felt it? It was a dream, wasn't it? ;-)

If Satan has a license to deceive here on earth these "last days", IMO, he's "downloaded" the full version, AND he's gonna pull out ALL the stops.

142 posted on 11/23/2002 8:51:10 AM PST by F16Fighter
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To: F16Fighter

143 posted on 11/23/2002 9:00:50 AM PST by Outraged At FLA
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To: BlackbirdSST
I've always thought the balloon excuse was insultingly stupid. The sort of thing Dilldo and Shrillery would think would fool the "little people," the "ignorant masses." It seems to me their sort of people must be involved in such idiotic decisions. But then, look at the response of the masses . . . "uhhhh, duh . . . OK, must be a balloon Mildred." Sheesh.
144 posted on 11/23/2002 9:27:46 AM PST by Quix
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To: dinodino
Easy for you to say.

And if YOUR close relative knew of cases where whole families had been erased off the face of the earth along with all evidence of their ever having lived . . . would YOU have the cahones to be so sacrificially bold?
145 posted on 11/23/2002 9:30:53 AM PST by Quix
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To: Johnny Shear
There's evidently 2 or 3 ways around that speed of light issue. Einstein didn't have it all figured our OR he's not been credited with some aspects still kept secret.
146 posted on 11/23/2002 9:32:23 AM PST by Quix
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To: Johnny Shear
Greenwald's BLACK VAULT is a good place to start.

http://www.bvalphaserver.com/modules.php?name=News&file=article&sid=5601&mode=thread&order=0&thold=0

And you can search out what's his face--the Communion's author--Whitney Streiber. Linda Mouton Howe has a link on his site. I guess I respect her more than WS.

One has to filter out tons of stuff as disinformation and what not. But who knows which part to filter out! I don't pretend to know that. I depend on Holy Spirit to help me avoid wasting too much time as I try to stay up with the broad scope of things . . . as well as alert me to any significant particulars that need a bit extra awareness. Somehow, I usually seem to be in the right place at the right time to hear about significant changes in the info available. In your shoes--which sites? Beyond what I've said, I don't know. I get weary of filtering so much noise out on so many of them. And who knows what is really noise and what's not. Just wading through all the same old same old can be a chore. Have read 3-very heavy, thick tomes on the subject the last month or so. Greer's DISCLOSURE seems to be one of the best. I forget the other titles. I can track them down if you're interested. More than 75% of Los Alamos is supposed to be underground and very hidden. My impression the last time I was through there was much as yours. But I felt at the time there was a lot more there than met the eye. Now I've read evidence of such. Have fun. And buckle your seat belts along the way. Times and a lot of other things are changing and many set to change beyond most people's imaginations.

147 posted on 11/23/2002 9:55:39 AM PST by Quix
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To: fightu4it
Yes, because they were all caught rather exposed with their pants down and were making rules up as they went along.

Otherwise they'd not have put the press release out about the UFO the first thing.
148 posted on 11/23/2002 9:58:38 AM PST by Quix
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To: dogbyte12
Wish it were a nuke and all the ET stuff would just go away quietly.

Not gonna happen. ET etc. is the ONLY thing that fits a good part of the data.

There's other aspects but that's interesting enough.

Then there's the world government drive; the power addicted Dilldo, Shrillery et al traitors incorporated; the greedy folk at various institutions and corporations . . . It's kind of like the congressman speaking about money. A billion here a billion there pretty soon you're talking about real money.

A billion puzzle pieces here, a billion puzzle pieces there--pretty soon, you're talking about an interesting multidimensional maze.
149 posted on 11/23/2002 10:08:02 AM PST by Quix
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To: mikegi
His risk taking days are over.

He got burned enough at the time.

And now, he's a fat, somewhat lazy guy trying to cope with his own crazy relatives, kids and grand kids. He certainly doesn't want to bring any more grief on them, either (*than his crazy lifestyle already has). He has spoken to one researcher. That's enough for him. Besides, though he worked around them and saw them routinely, he was not actually working WITH them.
150 posted on 11/23/2002 10:10:58 AM PST by Quix
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To: Johnny Shear
Get the books I cited above at Amazon or some such and read for yourself. Branton on THE DULCE WARS or some such title. It's in the other room now.
151 posted on 11/23/2002 10:12:22 AM PST by Quix
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To: F16Fighter
Agree with that. But the simplistic version most Christian writers assert is the reality just doesn't suffice to cut the mustard in my view. Fine. They explain a lot. But they don't explain nearly all, in my view.

I think there's TONS of stuff both satan AND CERTAINLY GOD have yet to reveal. And then there's "neutral" forces, entities, probably civilizations and world which/who have chosen God's way or the opposition. And how do they factor in with all the straight forward demonic stuff.

And, SOME stuff actually does have the flavor of God ordered angelic stuff. But that's certainly a minority in this broad topic area--maybe less than 1% of the data per my observations. Angels seem routinely to do a whole different sort of thing--thankfully!

But some would assert that even Christ's Acension had flavors of a ufo--given the cloud etc.

Personally, I don't think Holy Spirit and certainly not God The Father or Jesus our Lord--they don't need UFO's or anything but to speak to effect all or any part of any reality/ies.
152 posted on 11/23/2002 10:17:46 AM PST by Quix
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To: Outraged At FLA
How you make that silly connection is way beyond me. You lost me entirely.
153 posted on 11/23/2002 10:18:35 AM PST by Quix
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To: Quix
So, what do you make of the ex-president, sinkEmperor, sending Webb Hubble out to find the hidden info on UFO's?
154 posted on 11/23/2002 10:42:08 AM PST by MHGinTN
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To: MHGinTN
He's curious about many things like many of us.

He's addicted to power in the worst way and would want to figure all the angles to use THE UFO STUFF and ANYTHING ELSE to buttress his power, extend his grasp since he can't extend other things . . .

And he'd love to succeed where Carter failed at discovering and disclosing.

Obviously to me, the potential to use it to increase his KING OF THE WORLD drive would be the strongest motivation.

There also might be a slight fear of being caught with his pants down by a more powerful ET race that he didn't YET know how to manipulate into supporting his self-serving orgasms and other ventures.
155 posted on 11/23/2002 10:45:10 AM PST by Quix
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To: Quix
Spare me the drama. If you were concerned about being "erased off the face of the Earth," you wouldn't be posting here. Better watch out--the reptilian overlords could get your IP address from your post and track you and your brother down and disintegrate you with ALIEN WEAPON TECHNOLOGY!

Lunatic.
156 posted on 11/23/2002 10:48:08 AM PST by dinodino
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To: dinodino
Oh, now that was really a productive addition! NOT
157 posted on 11/23/2002 11:06:58 AM PST by MHGinTN
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To: dinodino
It's been near 30 years since he worked there.

He doesn't want nor need a lot of hassle on top of the ones he has now whether there's a low chance of it or not.

He wasn't about to make waves then.

It's too late now. What he knows at this point is probably very old hat anyway.

I don't say nor know much that's not already in the public domain. I'm sure they know who he is as well as who I am.

He's already been quoted on one program years back. That's enough.

If you are so hot to do something, you dig up new info and YOU do it.

We have enough to do running our own lives our way at present. We are not your puppets to do as you see fit.

Look in your own mirror LT.
158 posted on 11/23/2002 11:09:25 AM PST by Quix
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To: BlackbirdSST
You believe in flying saucers, and you accuse ME of "spewing diatribe"? I think I've spotted your problem.
159 posted on 11/23/2002 11:09:57 AM PST by ozzymandus
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To: ozzymandus
Are there SOME things you are NOT bias blinded about?
160 posted on 11/23/2002 11:13:38 AM PST by Quix
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