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To: Red Jones
First off, to me it was an aside, not that big a deal, something worth noting and moving on. If other people insist on tilting at windmills that's not my problem.

But your attempt at an explaination doesn't make sense either. It's a matter of scope, the alleged applications in question are for 3120 programmer/analysts working in America but not born here. According to the info FL found the company has 300 engineers (which since they do software as well as hardware is probably a group that includes but is not restricted to the programer analysts) in their entire opperation, in America and otherwise, born in America and otherwise. By any form of logical analysis that second group should be the larger of the two, and definitely not 1/10 the first. The only way it makes sense is if they've laid off at least 90% of their enginneering force inbetween when the filing was made and now. Or something is being heavily misinterpretted.

I've seen the stats, I'm not impressed. So there's 1 million H1Bs in the country, and we have what 150 maybe 180 million working Americans. Just not impressed. Now I've admitted that in certain states, which are mostly places I'd never live any way, it IS a problem. Just not nationally, and not the run around and panic crisis so many people insist it is.

Also note that the VAST majority of the H1Bs AREN'T in software or tech. They're all over the place, scattered throughout the job market.
222 posted on 11/05/2002 12:40:29 PM PST by discostu
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To: discostu
First off, to me it was an aside, not that big a deal, something worth noting and moving on. If other people insist on tilting at windmills that's not my problem.

In your misguided attempt to discredit this subject, you've actually brought attention to possible criminal activity. You should be proud of yourself. I find it amusing at least...

But your attempt at an explaination doesn't make sense either. It's a matter of scope, the alleged applications in question are for 3120 programmer/analysts working in America but not born here. According to the info FL found the company has 300 engineers (which since they do software as well as hardware is probably a group that includes but is not restricted to the programer analysts) in their entire opperation, in America and otherwise, born in America and otherwise.

And that would never have seen the light of day if the records weren't available to the public. The sheer fact that they claimed they needed 30 "programmer/analysists" at each of their many sales offices should raise a few eyebrows. But it is ENTIRELY possible that they thought nobody would notice, and obviously up to now nobody has...

By any form of logical analysis that second group should be the larger of the two, and definitely not 1/10 the first. The only way it makes sense is if they've laid off at least 90% of their enginneering force inbetween when the filing was made and now. Or something is being heavily misinterpretted.

That or there is some serious fraud going on. It DOES occur, and the GAO has said that it does. NO enforcement actions are ever taken though, so why SHOULDN'T companies lie on their applications?

I've seen the stats, I'm not impressed. So there's 1 million H1Bs in the country, and we have what 150 maybe 180 million working Americans.

And the H1-B workers in the computer industry occupations outnumber other occupations 15 to 1.

Also note that the VAST majority of the H1Bs AREN'T in software or tech. They're all over the place, scattered throughout the job market.

That is grossly inaccurate and untrue. It appears to me at least that you have an agenda here. If you are simply misguided and uninformed, why don't you take a look at the following link. Perhaps it'll enlighten you.

Debunking the Myth of a Desperate Software Labor Shortage

225 posted on 11/05/2002 1:23:14 PM PST by FormerLurker
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