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Why Neo-Conservatives Are not Real Conservatives
self

Posted on 09/26/2002 2:36:29 PM PDT by jstone78

I have always tried to figure out how real conservatives differ from neo-conservatives. I have listed a few points, with which you should feel free to agree or disagree with, and if you like, you can mention other ways in which you feel real conservatives and neocons differ.

1. Real conservatives (whether Old Rightists or New Rightists) are motivated by high moral principles and deep conviction, that the role of government in people's lives should be minimized, and people should be allowed to run their own lives. But Neo-conservatives are actually liberals and Marxists who pretend to be conservatives, and are motivated by nothing more than opportunism and hypocrisy, and have no moral principles worthy of mention.

2. Heros of real conservatives include individuals such as Gen. Douglass McArthur, Gen. George S. Patton, former Sen. Robert Taft, Robert E. Lee, Barry Goldwater, Ronald Reagan, George W. Bush, and Alan Keyes. Heros of the neo-cons include Harry Truman, FDR, Woodrow Wilson, Leon Trotsky, Nelson Rockefeller, Henry "Scoop" Jackson, and Sen. John McCain.

3. Real conservatives always put the interests of America first, ahead of other nations. They also believe that institutions not elected by American voters, have no right to make decisions affecting the lives of Americans. But neo-conservatives support globalization, mass immigration, the WTO, the United Nations, and most other forms of globalism.

4. Real Conservatives often win elections on fundamental moral and constitutional issues like defending the lives of the unborn, the restoration of school prayer, the right of ordinary citizens in a democracy to defend themselves through protection of Second Ammendment rights, and the rebuilding of the Christian foundation that made America a great nation. Neo-cons win elections on materialistic issues like government entitlements, tax privileges for some, and whining about the dangers of the "religious right" and other "extremists" in an attempt to discredit real conservatives.

5. Real conservatives oppose New Deal policies which resulted in big government. Neo-Conservatives support the New Deal.

6. Real conservatives oppose political correctness and victimology. But neo-conservatives are the greatest promoters of victim politics in America, as a result of finger-pointing habits they developed when they were still marxists and liberals. Neo-cons are fond of slandering their enemies using liberal buzz words such as "sexist", "racist", "anti-semitic", "homophobe", "isolationist", "bigot", "nativist", "xenophobe", etc.

In 1981, neo-conservative attack dogs ganged up and destroyed a prominent Southern conservative, the late M. E. Bradford. Bradford, a highly distinguished scholar, had been nominated by Ronald Reagan to be chair of the NEH, and smears by vicious and hateful neo-conservatives forced Ronald Reagan to withdraw the nomination. Many other real conservative scholars and columnists have had their reputations destroyed by hateful and vindictive neo-conservatives. Ironically, one common smear used by neo-cons, the "anti-semitic" smear, disregards the fact that many defenders of the old right are Jewish. Men like the late Murray Rothbard, Howard Phillips, and Paul Gottfried are strong defenders of old fashioned conservatism.

7. Liberals and Marxists hate old fashioned conservatives, whether in America or Europe, because they see real conservatives as a huge obstacle to the imposition of their socialist one-world agenda. Have you all noticed how European conservatives who oppose the European Union and the EU's liberal immigration policy are treated by the media? On the other hand, Liberals, Socialists, and Marxists, love neo-conservatives, whom they see as allies. Maybe the "ex-liberal" and "ex-Marxist" labels that neo-conservatives are often given, are nothing more than a sham (i.e. the "ex" part).

8. There is broad intellectual diversity among real conservatives, and they express their disagreements without being disagreeable. Some are Old Rightists, while others are New Rightists. Some are paleo-libertarians who are very anti-statist, while others are less hostile to the state. Some support Israel, while others do not. Some support free trade, while others are protectionist. Some want the IRS abolished entirely, while others favor reform of the IRS. But almost all oppose New Deal policies, and are strict constructionists in the various ways they interpret the US Constitution. Neo-cons on the other hand, do not tolerate dissent in their ranks, and all match in lockstep. The dictatorial nature of neo-conservatism can be traced to the authoritarian style of one old neo-con hero, Leon Trotsky.


TOPICS: Constitution/Conservatism; Culture/Society; Foreign Affairs; Your Opinion/Questions
KEYWORDS: conservatives; goppeeingcontest; neoconservatives
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To: freeeee
What does this "5" thing mean?

It means someone is trying to tell you you are a 5th columnist. Seriously. It is some people's idea of a sense of humor around here.

61 posted on 09/26/2002 3:44:42 PM PDT by southern rock
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To: marron
Ok, I'm risking a shelacking here, but hey, I'm among friends, I hope...

We got into trouble when we lost control of "liberal". As in, John Locke liberal.

No need for a shellacking; you're completely correct. It is not "liberal" to enforce speech codes on college campuses. Neither is it "conservative" to favor a top-down overhaul of the current federal tax code.

The problem with debates about ideological labels is that they always collapse into semantic arguments rather than substantive ones. And right-wingers like us are more concerned about substance; we leave semantic debates to the lefties!

62 posted on 09/26/2002 3:44:54 PM PDT by inkling
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Comment #63 Removed by Moderator

To: swarthyguy
ROFLMAO!
64 posted on 09/26/2002 3:47:03 PM PDT by Howlin
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To: headsonpikes
"loserdopian"

ROTFLOL

65 posted on 09/26/2002 3:47:41 PM PDT by VaBthang4
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To: marron
Bill Buckley is no libertarian.

But he is a pot head!

66 posted on 09/26/2002 3:47:54 PM PDT by Reagan Man
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Comment #67 Removed by Moderator

To: VaBthang4
So we'll put you in the undecided column, I guess. ;^)

On a scale of 1-10, I guess this merits a '5'.
68 posted on 09/26/2002 3:54:39 PM PDT by headsonpikes
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To: jstone78
Heros of the neo-cons include Harry Truman, FDR, Woodrow Wilson, Leon Trotsky, Nelson Rockefeller, Henry "Scoop" Jackson, and Sen. John McCain.

Boy are you deluded. Not one of these people are either "heros" or even remotely liked by neo-cons. A good source for neo-con political thought is Bill Buckley and his National Review. If you can show me one op-ed from this mag that praises any one of the people above, I'd be very surprised. McCain was excoriated by neo-cons during the 2000 GOP primaries. Trotsky was a freakin' communist, for cryin' out loud!

69 posted on 09/26/2002 4:00:05 PM PDT by Mr. Mojo
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To: freeeee
3. Would you approve of a law that forced Congress to cite a specifically enumerated constitutional power before it can pass a law? Also, apply this to every law already on the books.

I am not sure if George W Bush, your candidate of choice in #2, can pass this step.

70 posted on 09/26/2002 4:00:12 PM PDT by Satadru
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Comment #71 Removed by Moderator

To: Tropoljac
Many neo-cons, including the godfather Irving Kristol, were Trotskyite radicals.

Even if you're right, the operative word is were. Ronald Reagan was once a Democrat, so what's your point?

72 posted on 09/26/2002 4:06:22 PM PDT by Mr. Mojo
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To: Reagan Man
Neoconservatism is the intellectual current I was influenced by and the great writings I read over the years persuaded me conservatism was a respectable and intellectual defensible philosophy for an aspiring intellectual to adopt. A decision I've never regretted. Today, we're conservatives period and these debates about who is and who isn't a "real" conservative just divide us and distract our attention from the enemy and the real danger: liberals. Before they were opposed to dealing with the Soviet Union as the "Evil Empire" and now they're opposed to dealing with Iraq as one of constituent members of the Axis of Evil. All conservatives, regardless of who they are, believe in two things: America is a force for good and America is on the right side of history. Tell me any liberal who believes in those two axioms - certainly not Algore this past Tuesday who seemed to spend more time apologizing for us than defending what I firmly believe is the greatest country on Earth.
73 posted on 09/26/2002 4:06:52 PM PDT by goldstategop
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To: freeeee
2. There is a hypothetical election with no Democratic or third party candidates. The person who wins the Republican nomination wins the election. The candidates for nomination are Ron Paul and George Bush. Who do you vote for?

Well, if those are the only two choices, I guess I'll have to live with Paul, although he is a little too far left for me. I've never heard him advocate public ritual mutilation for liberals, or the death penalty for the politically correct.

74 posted on 09/26/2002 4:06:59 PM PDT by Still Thinking
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To: Tropoljac
I disagree to the extent that the Kristol "were" should be in the present tense "are".
75 posted on 09/26/2002 4:08:21 PM PDT by meenie
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Comment #76 Removed by Moderator

To: jstone78
Heros of the neo-cons include Harry Truman, FDR, Woodrow Wilson, Leon Trotsky, Nelson Rockefeller, Henry "Scoop" Jackson, and Sen. John McCain.

You're kidding, right?

77 posted on 09/26/2002 4:09:47 PM PDT by Petronski
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To: meenie
So you believe Kristol to be a communist?
78 posted on 09/26/2002 4:10:28 PM PDT by Mr. Mojo
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To: goldstategop
>>>Today, we're conservatives period and these debates about who is and who isn't a "real" conservative just divide us and distract our attention from the enemy and the real danger: liberals.

Well said!

But libertarians aren't conservative

79 posted on 09/26/2002 4:10:36 PM PDT by Reagan Man
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To: jstone78
I am sick and tired of litmus test politics. I come by my own opinions honestly, without desire to "fit in". If you don't like what I say -- you don't fell it is adequatly "conservative", give me the boot. Just don't expect me to accept the label smear tactic, that smacks too much of PC and the tactics of the left (ie: right wing conspiracy, racist, homophobe, etc.). If you are the type that refuses to listen to anything some one says because you disagree on one issue, we won't get along.
80 posted on 09/26/2002 4:11:12 PM PDT by JimSEA
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