Posted on 09/26/2002 7:19:14 AM PDT by scripter
Amazon.com has been accused by a nonprofit legal group of "contributing to the potential rape and molestation of children."
The online retailer's sale and promotion of the book "Understanding Loved Boys and Boylovers," by David L. Riegel, is an unfair and unethical business practice, according to a letter sent yesterday to Amazon CEO Jeffrey Bezos by the United States Justice Foundation of Escondido, Calif.
The USJF has given Amazon 30 days to pull the book or face "protracted litigation."
In Riegel's book, released in 2000 by a publisher called SafeHaven Foundation Press, he writes: "Men who sexually pursue young boys are not monsters, but sincere, concerned, loving human beings who simply have a sexual orientation that is neither understood nor accepted by most others."
SafeHaven Foundation Press's purpose, according its website, is to "publish, distribute, and retail non-fiction works on the subjects of boylove, loved boys, and boylovers. "
The book's introduction credits the Internet for bringing into "public awareness" a topic that has been "disparaged and forcibly silenced."
"Understanding Loved Boys and Boylovers" also can be bought through the bookseller Borders, which has a special arrangement with Amazon.com.
"For them to allow these nuts to come on and suggest that this is a good thing is an absolute travesty," said Richard Ackerman, litigation counsel for the United States Justice Foundation, who noted that he was a victim of molestation. "I'm not ashamed that I can speak from personal experience to say how evil this is."
'Responsible intergenerational relationships'
Riegel also runs a website "about responsible intergenerational relationships between males." He calls it a "discussion forum where the joys, sorrows, issues and questions of boylove can be brought for honest, thoughtful and respectful discussion in a positive manner."
In the book's introduction, Riegel says: "Whereas men who were loved as boys, and men who have shared their lives and themselves with one or more boys, were before almost totally isolated from one another, the Internet has made possible extended discussions among all who choose to participate."
Ackerman charges that Amazon.com, which allows readers to post their own reviews of books, has created its own "free-for-all forum whereby pedophiles can share their darkest fantasies and promotion of child-sodomy with all Amazon.com visitors, including children."
One reviewer wrote, "As a pedophile myself, I found this book to be enlightening in my quest to truly come to terms with my own sexuality."
On Amazon's site, readers can connect via e-mail with this particular reviewer, whose e-mail address begins with "minrfiend."
Another reviewer says, "As a boylover, I found this book extremely helpful. But it is not intended for the boylover community: It is meant for the general public who fear the phenomenon of pedosexuality. As such, it sets out to explain in plain language what this phenomenon is about."
"Amazon.com should not be used as a potential 'dating service' for those who would molest children," Ackerman wrote in his letter to Bezos, obtained by WND. "How, exactly, are you going to find peace of mind if one of your child-customers happens to be lured into molestation because of your site?"
Ackerman warns Amazon that it could find itself "in the position of being sued for wrongful death, negligence or other tortious conduct should a molester and child be joined up with each other as a result of your site."
"Even if you are not interested in doing what is morally right in this case, your commercial general liability insurance carrier should view the potential liability as an unacceptable financial risk," he said.
Yesterday, Amazon listed on its main page, under "Quick Picks," several of the titles it recommends to readers interested in Riegel's book. They include "Dream Boy," a story about two adolescent boys and their homosexual relationship, and "Touched," a novel about a molested boy.
Censorship?
A spokesperson for Amazon.com told WorldNetDaily that the company certainly does not endorse "Understanding Loved Boys and Boylovers."
"Simply because we sell a book does not mean we agree with the ideas it contains," said Patricia Smith.
"We believe that people have the right to choose their own reading material," she said. "Our goal is to support freedom of expression and to provide customers with the broadest selection possible so they can find, discover, and buy any title they might be seeking."
Smith noted that "that selection includes some titles which most people, including employees of Amazon.com, may find distasteful or otherwise objectionable. However, Amazon.com believes it is censorship to make a book unavailable to our customers because we believe its message to be repugnant."
The Web retailer published a brief review of Riegel's book under the company's name, by editor Christopher Hart, which stated: "Is there such a thing as a legitimate sexual relationship between an adult male and an underage boy? Most civilized people would answer emphatically 'no,' and 'Understanding Loved Boys and Boylovers' won't convince them otherwise. Defensive in tone and amateurishly produced, this monograph uses both pseudo-scholarship and anecdotes in its attempt to justify its target audience's actions and feelings."
In 1999, organized protests forced Amazon to drop from its website another book that promoted pedophilia, "Varieties of Man-Boy Love," and customers have lodged complaints about the sale of books on bestiality and incest.
The American Family Association launched a campaign against Amazon's sale of Riegel's book two years ago but got no response.
No law above the law
Riegel said in an introduction that the book, "while certainly bound to be controversial, and which espouses certain changes in various laws, is carefully maintained within the limits of current laws, there is nothing in it which could possibly concern any postal inspector, or which could create any legal liability."
However, Ackerman wrote in his letter to Bezos that Amazon could face legal action under California law, based on the premise that unethical acts can form the basis for liability for unfair business practices.
"Clearly, it is an unethical business practice for you to allow the promotion of child molestation in the manner presently available on your website," Ackerman wrote. "The potentially dangerous nature of your activities gives rise to a valid basis for seeking injunctive relief, and we fully intend on seeking such relief if you do not immediately take action to eliminate the risk to children that your site presently creates. Because protecting children is in the public interest, you may also be held liable for damages under the California Consumer Legal Remedies Act."
Free speech has parameters that would have been understood clearly by the Founding Fathers, insists Scott Lively, head of the Pro-Family Law Center in Citrus Heights, Calif.
In contrast, "today's idea of free speech really assumes there is no law above the law and that any kind of speech is acceptable regardless of the consequence to society," he told WND.
"The current approach to free speech in the United States is the French egalitarian model, that there are no standards by which we measure speech," Lively explained. "My belief is that the Founding Fathers assumed a Judeo-Christian premise in all of the founding documents, and therefore anything that is fundamentally contradictory to the nature of human beings created in the image of God" is not permitted.
Lively believes that the societal barriers against adult-child sex are eroding quickly, following on the heels of the breakdown in social consensus on subjects such as infidelity and homosexuality.
"This is not an anomaly," he said of Riegel's book. "My prediction is we are going to see legalized adult-child sex within three to five years."
He noted that in many states the age of consent has been lowered to 16 years, allowing some teachers who had sex with students to walk away free of prosecution.
"In the Title IX guidelines put out by the federal government on sexual harassment they actually have a policy asking whether or not the sex was consensual, giving discretion to the school district as to whether or not they are going to consider different policies based on whether the teen consented or didn't," Lively said. "So these are all things moving very rapidly in the direction of child sex."
A book released earlier this year that condones adult-child sex is part of a wider effort by some academics to bring pedophilia into the mainstream, according to researcher Judith Reisman.
Judith Levine's "Harmful to Minors: The Perils of Protecting Children from Sex," seeks to challenge "widespread anxieties" about pedophilia, according to a promo.
13 of 26 people found the following review helpful:
Joe Gardiner Loves this Book!, June 19, 2000 Reviewer: Joe Gardiner (see more about me) from United States As a pedophile myself I found this book to be enlightening in my quest to truly come to terms with my own sexuality... Although it doesn't glorify child molestation it does attempt to shed the positive aspects of a healthy boy/male relationship... For anyone trying to understand this phenomenon that is fairly commonplace in society this brave book argues the point as well as any other...
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18 of 33 people found the following review helpful:
A must-read, June 8, 2000 Reviewer: Michael Black from South Africa As a boylover, I found this book extremely helpful. But it is not intended for the boylover community: it is meant for the general public who fear the phenomenon of pedosexuality. As such, it sets out to explain in plain language what this phenomenon is about.
I would strongly recommend this book to the non-pedosexual public because it offers a valuable insight into a world totally foreign to them. By explaining what 'pedophiles' really are, it may help parents to understand that there may actually be benefits to such relationships.
This book does not promote wanton sex with minors. It merely asks the reader to acknowledge the inherent sexuality of children. Nor does it glorify sexual abuse: in fact, it takes a strong stand against that.
What it does is to deal with a reality that cannot be wished away. And what better way to equip yourself to deal with reality than to know the facts?
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Got you to reply!
You never know. We've seen some rather bizarre contents from websites posted here on FR, so it's my assumption the reviews are most likely not made up.
Does anybody know if the *Butterfly kisses* site was started up again, and if so, where?
The word "parameter" does not mean "limits" or "boundaries." It means "variable"--the noun, not the adjective.
Brandenburg v. Ohio - mostly, laws like that don't stand up, according to SCOTUS. It's too bad the Paladin case didn't go all the way - we might have a bit clearer of an idea of what exactly the liabilities of authors and publishers are, legally - I don't think the plaintiffs in Paladin would have been successful, ultimately. But, it didn't, so at least for now, Brandenburg is the guiding case here...
Let me tell you what I know of him personally, at least in his younger years (18-19).. He is the smartest person I have ever known. He is quite humble and generous. Geeky, yes! He is also principled (more conservative than your average kid, as I recall), and I am sure he believes that people have a right to read this stuff.
Thanks for the legal info. It does say something dismal and sorrowful about America when we can promote child rape.
You have a great FR name. And you're needed here.
Whose foot is to be the measure to which ours are all to be cut or stretched? Is a priest to be our inquisitor, or shall a layman, simple as ourselves, set up his reason as the rule for what we are to read, and what we must believe? It is an insult to our citizens to question whether they are rational beings or not, and blasphemy against religion to suppose it cannot stand the test of truth and reason. If M. de Becourt's book be false in its facts, disprove them; if false in its reasoning, refute it. But, for God's sake, let us freely hear both sides, if we choose....I thought the work would be very innocent, and one which might be confided to the reason of any man; not likely to be much read if let alone, but, if persecuted, it will be generally read. Every man in the United States will think it a duty to buy a copy, in vindication of his right to buy, and to read what he pleases.... --Thomas Jefferson
Free speech, like all our freedoms, is not absolute (as the Supreme Court has instructed us, all these many years). A strong case can be made, I believe, that to promote criminal and violent behavior against innocent children should not be allowed.
If but one boy is sexually molested by Bezos' decision to market this book (a not unlikely scenario), the harm to that boy will rest on Bezos' head. Too bad he doesn't place the welfare of children first in his moral plane. When you promote people who promote sexual violence against children, you are little better than the molestors themselves. Bezos is throwing his lot to aid and abet sexual molestors. He may as well be one.
To a degree, yes, you can - the "imminent danger" standard still rules the roost, though. It's a tough nut to crack - I think we could probably agree that criminalizing all advocacy of violence would be going too far. H.L. Mencken suggested that the way to fix the public schools was to hang the teachers and burn the buildings, but we probably wouldn't want to send him to jail for that.
On the other hand, we'd probably also agree that an "anything goes" standard is too loose, so then we have to draw a line somewhere. And like all line-drawing exercises, someone will inevitably be unhappy with the final result. And we'd almost surely part company insofar as my personal approach to such things is essentially utilitarian, and I suspect yours is not ;)
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