A History of French "Warfare" (Surrender)

Conquer France! ^ | NA | Conquer France!

[weikel]

The thing that happened to Charlemagne is after he died everything that could have possibly happened to erase all the good he did happened. The civil war was probably to be expected I suppose Charlemagne could have prevented civil war by adopting the Ottoman custom and execute all but one of his sons but... that just wasn't gonna happen almost no one would do that. The Viking invasions and the Catholic Church suddenly (after some Pope Gregory something) getting all uppidity, deciding to horde all knowledge and claim supremacy over the secular rulers could not be anticipated.

[Tribune7]

I think it took the NVA about 3 days to overrun the country.

And they stayed there 10 years, suffered 50,000 dead, declared victory and left. It sounds familiar. OK, you can call it a win if you want.

[weikel]

If I were a Cambodian I'd worship them as gods for the rest of my life for getting rid of Pol Pot.

[weikel]

Yeah but it sounds like Vietnam's Vietnam. Ironically they get hurt doing their 1st decent thing LOL.

[Leisler]

Led by a non-elitist Corsican.

[Lucius Cornelius Sulla]

it was Charles Martel who at the Battle of Tours saved Europe from the Muslims.

True, but Martel was Charlemagne's grandfather. I think Cato was referring to Charlemagne's expedition to Spain, when some say he so weakened the Spanish Islamic state that it could not make a planned invasion of the Frankish state. That was the expedition on which Charlemagne left his captains Roland and Oliver in command of a rearguard force in the Pyrenees, which was famously wiped out, before Charlemagne could return, summoned by the horn of Roland!

[1rudeboy]

According to Barbara Tuchman's, The Guns of August, the French fought the numerically superior Germans to a standstill in the early stages of WWI, ultimately driving them back, the British Expeditionary Force didn't do squat, and the Americans were late to the party.

If your recent history is that flawed, I shudder to think about the rest of your "analysis."

[weikel]

I like Tuchman's work in a Distant Mirror but I don't believe it the French attacked early in the war into Alsace Lorraine and got their a** kicked. America bailed both the British and French out in WWI they were about to lose( in contrast to WWII where our supplies were essential but our men weren't the commies had already beaten Hitler on the Eastern Front before D-Day).

[1rudeboy]

Tuchman spends a lot of time explaining how the French General Staff bungled the Alsace campaign, but to her the key was the denial of Paris to the Germans, which the French did mostly on their own, and while seriously outnumbered.

[weikel]

Well I tend to think history would have gone better if the old Kaiserreich had won anyway.

[branicap]

Dear zapiks;where did you find this piece of "historical " manure???

Of all the people you Americans should be the last one to call French cowards!Their victories agains British vere very important for you gaining your indenpendence!

France under Napoleon had ruled militarily Europe for years.

In the WWI Germany didn`t wipe out the French?Who told you that?A four years of trench warfare with insignificant gains in teritory on both sides is a "French defeat"???You ,conviniently forgot to mention that on the Western Front both British and French were fighting Imperial Germany!

WWII??A favourite claim about French cowardice is ;France surrendered!But,so did everybody else!Germany had conquered and defeated the whole Europe,routed 450000 British in France...Britain was saved only because of their best ally;The Chanel,their natural moat!Remember,since 1941 85% of fighting was on the Eastern front against Russia.But,of course,you have saved the world,bla,bla,bla...The truth is that first contact of American troops with the Germans was a catastrofe!For you.

Indochina???Ha,ha,ha....It must be the French that were throwing into the sea all those helicopters in Saigon in 1975,right?!

[fire_eye]

Damn... I tuned into this thread hoping for some good French jokes, and there's not a one - just a bunch of stuffy history lessons. (Damn... I've ended up having to learn something instead... oh well.)

It really does appear that the French only turned into cheese-eating surrender monkeys after Napoleon got whacked. But even a Frenchman will admit that (if you get enough wine into him, at least...).

However...:

If the American Army of May 1940 had faced the German Army they would have folded in 6 days not 6 weeks like the French did.

Not on American soil, the way the French did on French soil, dude... Not in 6 days, 6 weeks, 6 months... Not in your lifetime... Not even today, with armies of Clinton-voting soccer mommies whining for "accomodation" and "understanding"...

[Born on the Storm King]

You French haters are very effeminate and love domineering, soldier-like, masculine women.

[Brian Allen]

"french wine" is a 90:10 against crap shoot. Less that ten per cent of EUrinal winemakers have ever studied chemistry and/or any science at a tertiary level.

As compared to the around 90% of Australian and New Zealand winemakers who hold advanced degrees and who actually understand and control the chemistry of what occurs in the process.

FACT: Aussies put consistently better wines in "wine casks" [Plastic bags inside cardboard boxes] than the freanch on average sell as "premium" product!

Buy Australasian wines and be satisfied 100% of the time!

[Phillip Augustus]

No. Since World War I, the French have been terrible, and even in WWII, they faced a machine that was well-nigh unstoppable, absent American and Russian involvement. During WWI, the French fought nobly, valiantly, and ultimately successfully. Sadly, the sacrifices made in that stupid, suicidal war sucked much of the spirit out of France- and out of the rest of the Continent as well.

[Phillip Augustus]

What do you have to say about this ridiculous propaganda?

[Phillip Augustus]

For a more rational and realistic view of French military history, please review the following:

http://www.lewrockwell.com/peirce/peirce055.html

[Phillip Augustus]

Bad link, try http://www.lewrockwell.com/peirce/peirce55.html

[weikel]

In WWII the French Army in 1940 had more and better tanks more planes( if you include the RAF) more men, more everything basically then the Germans. I know they've run it through some computer simulation and the computer has not been able to lose with the French. I heard the trade unions sabotaged the French railroads and stopped them from redeploying when the bulk of the German tanks came through the Ardennes( the Soviets controlled the trade unions and in 1940 were supporting the Nazis). Is there any truth to that?

[Phillip Augustus]

I had not heard that before, but can't say whether it's true or not.