Posted on 08/26/2002 5:06:32 AM PDT by JohnHuang2
WASHINGTON - The intensifying violence in the Middle East is straining relations between black and Jewish leaders in the United States, with potentially serious consequences for the Democratic Party.
The conflict between two of the party's strongest support groups - which have a history dating to the civil rights era of working together - threatens to harm the Democrats' chances of regaining control of Congress this fall, analysts say.
Black and Jewish Democrats in Congress have been working quietly for months to try to repair the growing rift between African-Americans, who resent efforts by Israel's supporters to defeat black incumbents, and Jews, whose interest groups have in recent months helped oust two black lawmakers they considered anti-Israel.
(Excerpt) Read more at sunspot.net ...
Yep. Very obvious, very blatant, and with the FR seal of approval. Funny thing, him and a handful of others being a protected species. Not too long ago Catspaw and I pointed to one of them using Hoffman-info for his arguments down a whole thread. Guess what? That critter couldn't be banned ;).
So, what would be the purpose of having a cadre of "untouchable" Nazis running around here? Recruitment? When people get kicked to LibertyForum/Polinco from here, do they just "graduate"?
Jews do not worry about the use of their intellectual talents. What they do worry about is equality and lack of persecution.
Not only socialism promised equality in XIX century, but the increasing oppression on the part of the tzarist Russia pushed them towards the socialists at the turn of the XX century. No Jew would worry about the intellectual talents vs. the gov't dependence.
In this country, Jews have attained equality fairly recently --- after WWII. I believe we will see an increasing diversity in Jewish community in terms of voting behavior.
I was shuddering at the thought of Conyers, until I heard last year that he was going to be the victim, er recipient of redistricting, ah, democracy.
If FR does not care about morality, then it should care about the costs. Bigots on FR, an in the conservative movement in general, are costly: they alienate minorities and weaken the conservative cause in this country.
Bigotry is tolerated here not only when it is directed at the Jewish people. Witness the same agains Hispanics under the pretence of "America-first" desire to the protect the border, but alway only the Southern border.
First, tolerance towards bigotry is demonstrated, the minoririties of all kinds are made feel unwelcome, and then those same people that drive them away are angry that "Jews, Blacks, and Hispanics vote for Democrat."
If it is true that this board is against bigotry, why is it that people who constantly peddle Nazi propaganda are tolerated? Where do you draw the line, Jim? When LarryLied constantly states that it was Jews who killed Christians in Russia and that, given a chance they will do this here --- does that qualify for you to be disgusted? When he laments that Hitler's raical policies were too mild (Hitler admited into his army some number of men with distant Jewish blood) -- does that qualify under "bigotry is not tolerated on FR"?
When RCW2001 does not miss a day without posting something against Jews or Israel, going to the Arab press if necessary, but never participates in his own threads --- is this not use of FR for propaganda of personal prejudice? It is much like yelling "Fire!" in a theater: he throws a match, knowing full well that it will ignite the decent, moral majority on FR --- both Jews and Gentiles --- and then steps back. Please verify my words: of the doezens if not hundreds of threads initiated by RCW2001 and related to Israel or Jewish people, find (i) one that would say something positive, or (ii) one in which he participated himself --- just a single post after opening the thread.
Is this proper use of FR as you have envisioned? You may not think so, but by condoning this behavior and Islamist propaganda you give an apperance that you do. I have been told privately by some people --- again, both Jews and Gentiles --- that they have "returned" to FR having been previously alinated from it by this kind of bigotry. Can we afford to loose decent and thinking people? I mean, not only on FR, but in the conservative movement in general?
I must tell you that I find the situation to be much better than it was last fall, when I joined. MadIvan, whose student visa must have expired in December, has left: he, together with LarryLied, used to educate FR audience about the absence of anti-Semitism in Eastern Europe and about the alleged massacres committed by Jews against Christians. It's been a while also since I saw an article or post by Justin Raimondo, whose only posts were related to "Jewish conspiracy." Some others, who are still with us, refrain from the most blatant statements that I saw after I first jointed.
I do not know whether these people got tired of Jew-bashing or you have taken measures against them. But must we tolerate any degree of this? As I said earlier, I am not speaking about bigotry against the Jews only: Hispanics get their share as well.
It is the old Gresham's law that bad apples drive out the good. I do not think we should allow that to happen to FR.
Electing Republicans requires some level of inclusiveness (I fear I'm one of the few here who remembers who got the most votes last time around). I suspect that may be incompatable with the nature of an internet forum, which may prefer to include the content that drives many away, and confirms the image of the right wing bigot.
Different objectives. They don't need to be incompatable in my opinion, but in practice they seem to be.
Wouldn't that just be special?
Now getting back on topic--- Considering how many anti-semites will be chairing House committees next year if the Dems win control, it would sure be nice if at least 40% of the Jewish vote would be for the Republicans.
And by the way, many people rightly take offense at the implication that being "conservative" is some kind of indication of anti-semitism. Harvey Penick, the great old golf instructor from Austin said, "If you love golf, then you are my friend." You have to be a golfer to understand what he meant, or else be a conservative and feel that way about other conservatives. Race, color, or religion don't mean a thing. But how you vote damned sure does. My taxes are already high enough.
Do you mean MadRussian? He is another one who "graduated" to LibertyForum, where he can still be seen foaming about "kikes" and charming stuff like that.
Are you sure it isn't the other way around? Do you imagine Clinton (either) taking a bullet for anybody?
Very good point!
I don’t think tolerance or bigotry enter into the equation, unless you let liberal thinking define you, defensively, not saying you’re a liberal.
I have no problem with “multi-culturalism” in the sense that it denotes respect for others heritage. I don’t care if a neighbor celebrates Cinco de Mayo, but I do judge him if he despoils the Fourth of July. Speak Spanish at home, I don’t care, but he should realize his children need English to succeed in America, as he does. And I do think American culture is superior, as he must or he wouldn't be here.
I think conservatives should address the issue proactively. There is in fact a uniquely American culture, an inclusive one which people of all races and beliefs can join. But they need to join, which entails respecting, but also surrendering their former allegiances. A common language is essential to American culture, that’s not bigotry. Controlled immigration built America, it’s not bigoted to control it. Liberals break “multi-culturalism” up into a multitude of small issues, and frequently conservatives respond to the narrow argument, rather than defend an American culture which is the envy of the world.
Now getting back on topic--- Considering how many anti-semites will be chairing House committees next year if the Dems win control, it would sure be nice if at least 40% of the Jewish vote would be for the Republicans.
And by the way, many people rightly take offense at the implication that being "conservative" is some kind of indication of anti-semitism. Harvey Penick, the great old golf instructor from Austin said, "If you love golf, then you are my friend." You have to be a golfer to understand what he meant, or else be a conservative and feel that way about other conservatives. Race, color, or religion don't mean a thing. But how you vote damned sure does. My taxes are already high enough.
I agree it’s an issue, I bet not one voter in 500 knows who will be chairing those committees. And the RNC and Republican leadership doesn’t seem anxious to let voters in close districts know. Of course, IMO, they aren’t letting voters know anything about Republican issues nationally, just slogging along district by district. So I don’t think it’s an issue.
Actually, particularly younger Jewish voters would be much more in tune with Republican economic issues. 40% would be good, though there are few house races (I can’t think of one) where it would be decisive. And as I’ve noted, the Republicans don’t seem interested in “nationalizing” this election as Newt did in 94. If we lose the House with an immensely popular President, that’s why.
You should be offended by the racist/conservative analogy. The Dems use it to their advantage.
When RCW2001 does not miss a day without posting something against Jews or Israel, going to the Arab press if necessary, but never participates in his own threads --- is this not use of FR for propaganda of personal prejudice? It is much like yelling "Fire!" in a theater: he throws a match, knowing full well that it will ignite the decent, moral majority on FR --- both Jews and Gentiles --- and then steps back. Please verify my words: of the doezens if not hundreds of threads initiated by RCW2001 and related to Israel or Jewish people, find (i) one that would say something positive, or (ii) one in which he participated himself --- just a single post after opening the thread.
Thank you, Top Quark. LarryLied is notorious for his blatant anti-Jew, anti-semitic posts, yet he's still posts his anti-Jew, anti-semitic materials without impediment or censure. RCW2001's threads are, at best, portraying Jews in an unfavorable light, at worst, Jew-baiting, but yet they are tolerated.
What I need to know, JR, is where you draw the line on anti-Jew, anti-semitic material. Is it material from the National Alliance, World Church of the Creator, Vanguard News, Spotlight and Carto's newest rag? It is material that's anti-Jew and antisemitic from an unknown source? Is it material that is anti-Jew and antisemitic but with the LarryLied anti-Jew, anti-semitic exception? And why do LarryLied and RCW2001 get an exception to your stated policy that antisemitic material isn't welcome? A quick perusal of LarryLied's posts, in particular, demonstrate an substantial theme of anti-Jewish statements. It's inconsistent with the "no anti-semitic posts" position of FreeRepublic.
Given this statement of yours, Mr. Robinson, "The next time we need a nazi hunter we will call you," I will surely be less likely to hit the abuse button (if I ever do it again) when I recognize material from the known anti-semitic sources, simply because I do not want to be publically accused of being a "nazi hunter" (whatever that means) by the owner of this forum. I simply don't know if I hit the abuse button on someone who is an approved anti-semite, anti-Jew and that brand of anti-Jew, anti-semitism is okay, or if I hit the abuse button on someone who who is an anti-semite, anti-Jew and and that brand of anti-semitism, anti-Jew doesn't meet with your approval.
Because your policy on anti-Jew, anti-semitism is in some conflict, from now on, to be on the safe side, I'm just going to let the anti-Jew, anti-semitic posts stand until you notice it through some means besides me, and allow you to have the final decision as to where you draw the line. It's very unclear to me.
That place is basically for the types who resemble the banjo player in Deliverance. There are a few like that here, but they stand out like a sore thumb.
Think of it this way. Merely by not participating in the threads, he automatically elevates the dialogue.
LOL.
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