More we know about Kmart raid, the worse it gets

Houston Chronicle ^ | August 25, 2002 | Editorial Board

[Dog Gone]

A contingent of op-ed and letter writers to the Chronicle has taken the position that arresting 278 young people during a raid on a shopping center and restaurant parking lot last weekend was entirely justified because of the annoying late-night loitering and drag racing that had become typical at that spot. But the problem with the raid is not that police officers tried to arrest lawbreakers in and around the 24- hour Kmart Super Center parking in the 8400 block of Westheimer. It is with the contemptuous attitude police showed toward the citizenry by not bothering to sort out the good from the bad.

The people who so enthusiastically applaud law enforcement for shoddy police work more than likely would be singing a different tune if they or one of their children had been unjustly swept up in the botched raid and they found themselves spending all of a weekend day working through the city's criminal justice bureaucracy and coughing up large sums to retrieve their car from the pound.

More nettlesome than the irritation of being arrested for no cause, possible long-term consequences of a needlessly acquired criminal record and the potential for significant lawsuits that will have to be defended and settled with public funds, is the fact that the officer who led the Kmart debacle, Houston police Capt. Mark Aguirre, apparently has operated unchecked for years in this free-style arrest mode.

Police Chief C.O. Bradford says he has ordered an inquiry into the parking lot arrests. And Mayor Lee Brown has referred the matter to his Office of Inspector General. But Brown otherwise has been strangely quiet for a mayor who so heavily touted his extensive law enforcement experience during his three election campaigns.

The Chronicle does not condone behavior that is unlawful, or even just annoying, including drag racing, underage drinking, drug use, disturbingly loud music playing or anything else a bunch of kids hanging out late at night in a parking lot might be up to. But neither does the paper support police- state tactics that show an alarming disregard for the right of law-abiding citizens to to go about free from fear of sudden arrest.

[sweetliberty]

" I don't feel safe on the freeways with all those other cars. They should all be arrested. It would make for a nice commute"

Yeah, and I don't feel so safe when I have to go to the store after dark because I have to drive through an area of Mexican illegals, so I think they should all be arrested if they're hanging around outside at night so I can go to the store in peace. Oops; silly me. I forgot. We can't arrest illegals. Never mind.

[sweetliberty]

"When the FReepers with less knowledge of this fiasco go back and read the older links,"most" seem to have a pretty drastic attitude change."

That is true. In fact, I don't think I have seen another topic on which so many minds were changed as they came to greater knowledge of the facts. But there are some who like to be contrary for its own sake. They rarely have anything of real value to add the discussion.

[Dog Gone]

Interesting that you'd say that. That's official policy of the Houston Police Department.

Avoiding immigration questions is not merely routine practice at HPD, it's official policy. Houston officers are not allowed to arrest people on suspicion of being in the country illegally or even question them about their visa status.

But now that long-standing policy is being challenged out of Washington, where Attorney General John Ashcroft has called on police departments around the nation to help the federal government track down illegal immigrants.

Some departments have agreed to have their officers undergo special training so that they can begin enforcing federal immigration laws. Others, including Houston, have so far resisted the federal call for help.

"The Houston Police Department does not engage in, nor assist in, checking on a person's citizenship status," Houston Police Chief C.O. Bradford said at a recent news conference in which he rejected Ashcroft's idea. "We don't do that because if you're working in Houston, if you're a productive (resident), if you're not breaking the laws, then you're welcome to Houston."

Houston Chronicle, May 15, 2002

[sweetliberty]

Ferrous Cranus

Ferrous Cranus is utterly impervious to reason, persuasion and new ideas, and when engaged in battle he will not yield an inch in his position regardless of its hopelessness. Though his thrusts are decisively repulsed, his arguments crushed in every detail and his defenses demolished beyond repair he will remount the same attack again and again with only the slightest variation in tactics. Sometimes out of pure frustration Philosopher will try to explain to him the failed logistics of his situation, or Therapist will attempt to penetrate the psychological origins of his obduracy, but, ever unfathomable, Ferrous Cranus cannot be moved.

[Free Trapper]

DG must have the patience of a rock to take the time repeatedly to point folk in the right direction. :)

[sweetliberty]

PARKING TICKET!

I went to the store the other day, I was only in there for about 5 minutes and when I came out there was a damn motorcycle cop writing a parking ticket.
So I went up to him and said, 'Come on buddy, how about giving a guy a break?'

He ignored me and continued writing the ticket. So I called him a pencil necked nazi.

He glared at me and started writing another ticket for
having bald tires!! So I called him a horse sh*t.

He finished the second ticket and put it on the car with the first. Then he started writing a third ticket!!

This went on for about 20 minutes, the more I abused him, the more tickets he wrote. I didn't give a damn. My car was parked around the corner...

[Dog Gone]

Thanks, but sometimes I think I'm as dumb as rock for even trying with some people. ;-)

[Dog Gone]

LOL!

[HiTech RedNeck]

There was no drag-racing going on. That's apparently why the officer-in-command decided to arrest everyone.

In fact (this is rich) I am given to understand that it would not have been possible to drag race on Westheimer at that time; the street was half torn up with construction work. So Aguirre was disappointed that no drag racers were found there to arrest? No feces Sherlock!

[Doctor Stochastic]

When you let law enforcement work...

What do you mean let LE work? Is arresting someone for buying from Kmart OK with you? Is arresting someone for eating at Sonic OK with your? Are you a paid shill for WalMart or BurgerKing?

[Doctor Stochastic]

Do you find someone else eating at Sonic illegal or annoying? Are you working for Carl's Junior?

[sweetliberty]

"if you're not breaking the laws, then you're welcome to Houston"

HELLO!!!!! Do I detect just a little hypocrisy on the part of the Houston PD here? Illegals are, by definition, lawbreakers, but don't get me started.

[HiTech RedNeck]

I heard that some of the kids, when they saw what was getting ready to happen, ducked into KMart & made a quick purchase & were arrested when they went back to their cars.

Possibly; however without some probable cause to believe those kids had actually been previously "trespassing" in the lot, this action was illegal.

[Dog Gone]

I was hoping somebody would notice the irony. The Houston police won't arrest ILLEGAL aliens, but they had no qualms about their latest operation.

[BADROTOFINGER]

I had forgotten about that thread with the link to all of those screen name species. Do you think you could find it and bump me? I havent the foggiest idea where to look for it...JFK

[sweetliberty]

Here ya go. It is hilarious. There is also a link to the source.

What Kind of Forum Poster Are You?

[HiTech RedNeck]

After reading your post here to Norton, I cannot help but find you quite ignorant of the facts.

Have some.

Well that letter seems to have been written by someone who is blithely unconcerned about the overkill. And, that if Westheimer were under construction, who is blithely unconcerned that catching drag racers there would have been impossible that night because there would have been no drag racers.

[justlurking]

Do you think you could find it and bump me? I havent the foggiest idea where to look for it...

Go directly to the source:

http://www.winternet.com/~mikelr/flame1.html

[BADROTOFINGER]

Awesome! Thanks!...:-)...JFK

[steve-b]

conservatives have ceased looking at law enforcement as applying to everyone

Norton believes that law enforcement applies to everyone.

The rest of us believe that law enforcement applies to people who are caught breaking the law.