Glock vs. Beretta (9mm)

Myself | 07/29/2002 | New Horizon

[New Horizon]

FReepers,

I went and checked out 9mm handguns today. I was looking at the Glock 9mm (mid-size), but was impressed with the Beretta 9mm.

The Glock was light, felt like plastic (or carbon)...what is that material?

The Beretta instantly felt better in my hand (heavier, all metal, etc.)

I am looking for opinions as to which gun is the better of the two. Also, the reasons for your opinions. In any case, I'm looking at the 9mm as a personal protection handgun.

As always, your comments mean a lot to me. Thanks.

[No.6]

Adding another tally to the "try both and buy the one that works best for you" list.

As for caliber, as others have said, the round that hits, counts.

[Fletcher J]

Thanks for the info. A friend and I went to the MidSouth Institute in December of last year for the practical pistol course (3 days), and currently we are scheduled for the Intermediate Pistol class (3 days)in September. I've heard a lot of good things about GunSite, and would like to make it out there for a class also.

MidSouth is just South of Memphis TN, in the Tunica Mississippi area. My friend and I were very pleased with the instruction last time and felt it was a good value for training. Also, hotel rooms and meals are cheap in Tunica - we got casino hotel rooms for $19 a night, and you can eat like kings for $9-$11.

At MidSouth, Ross is the lead instructor and is a very good shooter, Blacky (ex-Navy Seal) and Doc (Radiologist and SWAT team member from Charlotte NC) were the other instructors when we were there, and they were great also.

Here is their website address if you want to check them out: www.weaponstraining.com

[Shooter 2.5]

I was trying to remember who ran the school. After going to the website I noticed John Shaw's name on the home page. I have the site bookmarked. It sounds like they have a good program. I liked the fact that they shoot a lot and they repeated that more than a couple of times. I don't want to spend my time in a classroom. When we went to the Cooper class, we had a lot of bad weather. High winds and some snow so we did spend some time in the classroom. On the other hand, swapping stories and waiting for better conditions was an experience too.
We had one person who set up a video camera on a tripod and he let it run.

[ParadigmLost]

First off, having read many of your previous posts here, I will quickly admit that you have much more experience and expertise in the field than I do.

Having met a few people who can shoot anything they are handed, accurately, I know it is possible. But, I do not have that skill.

In your experience, what have you found is the the largest determining factor in training to attain that level of gun control, and how many people truly get to that level?

I read the articles and work hard on my trigger control, and have improved greatly, but still cannot pick up a gun and be able to shoot anywhere near as well as I can with the ones I own. Is it me? Absolutely! I cant blame the gun.

Suggestions on approaches, or books to read, or practice drills, are very much appreciated.

[Shooter 2.5]

the largest determining factor in training

I don't want to complicate things but it's attitude. Let me try to explain. First off, I shoot a lot. I have two Dillons set up. One is to the left of the picture and you can see the other on my profile page. Once you condition your muscle memory with GOOD practice, everything comes together. Practice what you wish to do and it will eventually work. Muscle memory allows your to line the sights up immediately and muscle memory allows you to pull the trigger when your on target without thinking about it. How you hold the pistol[I'll stay with pistols for this] is important. On a 1911 the strong thumb rests ON TOP of the safety. In other words, the hand holding the gun has to be as high as can be to the bore and pushes forward. The same idea as an M-16 to control muzzle flip. The weak hand pushes back for a push pull. Your recoil should only be about an inch or so for a good second shot. Back to attitude. I know a guy who takes small revolvers and shoots clay birds on a dirt bank form 60 yards away and then works on the pieces. His revolvers can do that because they are well made and he knows they can do that. He has confidence in his equipment. That's one thing. Here's the other. Every once in a while when we're trying to shoot, we start to shake. It's fear. It's not being weak. Here's how to overcome that: No one cares. You're shooting because it's fun. It's not a macho thing or a dangerous thing. It's fun but no one cares what you do. You"re doing for you. Here's a fun thing. You will never be the best shot in the world but every once in a while you will make an incredible shot. You will be very pleased and you will mention it to people and they won't care. Never. Ever. Then you find out that as soon as they could, they told everyone they could about what you did. That's fun.

[Shooter 2.5]

One last thing. When you start to shoot when it's cold, hot, rainy, miserable and you're shooting when no one else wants to, You'll find out that you start to shoot better than those other people. One time I had a chance to eat at a fast food place or buy ammo. I bought the ammo and skipped lunch.

[Bella_Bru]

Good thread! I have been looking into purchasing a 9mm, but wasn't sure which to go with.

[Fletcher J]

At MidSouth, you can expect to shoot 2500-3000 rounds of pistol ammo for the 3 day class. I've already drop-shipped 3000 rounds of S&B 9MM to them, so it will be there in Sept. when I arrive. That's a lot of shooting over three days...

At the last class, I had just gotten my concealed-carry license, so I took my Glock subcompact .40 carry gun. By the time the 3 days were over, my shooting arm and hand were aching. :)

This time, I'll be going back with the Sig 226. This is the same handgun that the instructors use.

[New Horizon]

Definitely. Lots of good information. I'm going to have to re-think my choices, and check out some of the other suggestions (i.e. - Sig Sauer, etc).

[Shooter 2.5]

Have fun and we expect a full report.

[ParadigmLost]

Thanks for the response.

I shoot at least once a week. Handguns only. And I do it because I enjoy it. It is a great stress relief for me, and a good social activity. There are a group of us that go at lunch to the local indoor range. ( hot as H--- this time of year, but we go )

Because I started out as the worst shot in the group, and have improved steadily, the macho thing went away for me very early in the process. I knew that everybody was better than me. It was quickly very obvious that, "No, shooting a bullseye on every shot is NOT an innate ability of every american born male."

Thumb placement. I shoot an H&K USP Fullsize 45, a P7, and a Ruger 22. On the P7 there is no safety. But, I grip it as high as I can with the weak hand thumb in front of the strong hand thumb.

On the 45, the slide release is right where my weak hand thumb would be in the same grip. If I put my thumb there, at times the slide will not lock after the last round. If I keep my thumb elsewhere, it never happens. So I usually lock the thumbs together ( weak thumb over strong thumb ) with the strong hand thumb off of the safety. But, with my hand as high as I can get it.

On the 22, I use the "thumb in front" grip as on the P7.

60 yards is a heck of a shot to do consistently.

Yup, some days I shake, but I find that my main problem is that I will still jerk at times. Usually its when I stop concentrating, and always with a new gun. I get to that last bit before the trigger breaks, and instead of continuing to squeeze, I jerk. The shot is usually down about a foot from the aim point.

On a good day, I have everything in the black, but on most days I have a few of them, in that same spot, about a foot below the target.

I also know absolutely that my guns are much more accurate than I am. It is me that has to work to get to a level that can do them justice.

It’s just going to take time.

[Shooter 2.5]

You might try getting the trigger weighed. I don't like light triggers but it should break when you don't really expect it.
I noticed that the trigger that seems so light at home can be horrible at the range.
Ask one of the better shots if you could try their pistols. You may be shocked.

[ParadigmLost]

On another note, a friend’s Glock went ka-boom on him this last weekend. He is fine, just a cut on his finger. It could have been much worse.

The post mortem on what happened looks to be a problem with the shell he was using. Somehow either the shell did not seat properly in the barrel, or it was weak from several firings ( he reloads, a Dillon also. ). The problem was not too much powder. He always slightly under loads the shells. He also went back and checked the others in the same batch, and they were all loaded to what he expected.

The shell had a nice square hole on the side near the rim, where it sits in the unsupported portion of the Glock barrel. The magazine was blown apart, the plastic portion of the trigger was shattered and blown out, and the receiver was slightly cracked.

Glock said they are going to fix it for around $50.

[Shooter 2.5]

It looks like they stopped giving away new ones for the KBoomed ones. Still, that's not bad for $50.

[BILLYBOBB]

Get a Glock 26. The finest subcompact out there. Don't let anyone tell you that a 9mm is not enough stopping power. Put a round in their behind and I'll bet their reconsider.

[JRPerry]

I hope you went with the Beretta? Beretta or Sig Sauer. Either way you cannot go wrong. Forget about the .45 ACP being far superior to the 9mm. I do live the .45 but the .45 advocates are kind of like Muslims ... it's their way or you are an idiot in their eyes. All this nonsense about a 9mm not gettng the job done is just that - nonsense.

Here is a good link for you. :)

http://greent.com/40Page/ammo/9/9mm-advoc.htm

[asteriskct]

"the only way you can decock one of them is to remove the magazine, empty the chamber, and then drop the firing pin. Otherwise you're stuck in SA mode after the first shot."

I've been teaching the Glock since 1989, and I've never heard such a lack of understanding of the Glock in my life. If you want to "de-cock" a Glock, TAKE YOUR FINGER OFF THE TRIGGER! The striker returns to rest, and that's it. As to SA mode, the Glock is considered a double-action only weapon per BATF. The Glock is the single, most reliable handgun mankind has developed since the combination of gunpowder and projectiles. My issue Beretta, on the other hand, is the biggest piece of crap in the handgun world. When the left-ear of the locking block starts cracking, if not caught, will shear off, locking up the gun completely. If a gunfight is NOT the time to nave a three-pound paperweight! As a Federal Officer, I work for about the only agency (one of 22 combined recently, post-911, that mandate a single weapon, and the Beretta 96 is it. If we, the agency firearms instructors had anything to say about it, Glocks would be on every hip here. The legacy officers of our sister agency, now we're all one, are wearing Glocks, and we'd LOVE to see that extended to the rest of us who came to the new agency, burdered with this boat-anchor of a gun.

Hamersly

[OKSooner]

Okay, I don't know jack about Glock firearms and would have been better off not putting my foot in my mouth on the subject in July of 2002. Not the first time, probably won't be the last.

OTOH, sorry to hear about you guys being stuck with those politically-mandated Berettas...

[philetus]

I'm looking at the 9mm as a personal protection handgun.

A .40 or .45 is a much better personal protection caliber.

[bigzee]

Mr./Ms./Double Tap,
Your statement about the Glock 36 being 5 years old, you probably won’t even read this. However, being in law
enforcement for many years, the Glock 36 single stack .45
is one of the finest concealable handguns made in .45acp.
Itisalso one of the most accurate, assuming you know how to shoot.
Regarding the model .32, .357 sig, I have a 32 not 32c.
Chances are you are a female who appreciates less recoil.
That’s fine except when you have to fire from your chest and the muzzle flash burns the hell out of your face.
I think you should take another look at the G-36 .
It certainly is not a “POS” unless you are an inecperienced shooter, which it sounds like you may be, ‘DT’........