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Battle is brewing over tech visas:Critics say scarce jobs should go to Americans
Boston Globe ^ | July 9, 2002 | Cindy Rodriguez

Posted on 07/09/2002 2:18:45 AM PDT by sarcasm

Edited on 04/13/2004 3:36:39 AM PDT by Jim Robinson. [history]

Yashwant Bhambhani rode the high-tech wave of the late 1990s, coming to Boston from India under a special visa for skilled workers to propel the dot-com explosion that invigorated the economies of California, Colorado, and Massachusetts.

In those days, he'd send out a resume and - presto! - get a half dozen calls back. People like Bhambhani were greeted with fanfare by members of Congress, the information technology industry - and even labor unions. The record number of high-tech guest workers was seen as an engine for the seemingly limitless growth of the New Economy.


(Excerpt) Read more at startribune.com ...


TOPICS: News/Current Events
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1 posted on 07/09/2002 2:18:45 AM PDT by sarcasm
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To: sarcasm
If someone is coming in from outside the country it's because they have an edge over you.

That's pretty arrogant.

2 posted on 07/09/2002 2:23:55 AM PDT by Glenn
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To: sarcasm
''We're living in a global economy, and there shouldn't be any barriers,''
That would be true IF the companies that hire H1-B's play by the rules. As I understand it the H1-B's have to adide by whatever the employer demands of them or they're on the next boat back to their home country as there is no one to sponsor them.
That's how employers can get away with paying sub-market wages: the people from India and such don't know about real wages over here, cost of living, etc. But its too late once they accept the job -- they're pretty much indentured servants now.
Yes there are some laws against this (employers are supposed to pay prevailing wages, and a recent court case against Infobahn that an ex-employee didn't have to pay visa costs) but I don't think this is in America's best interest. Is it the government's duty to supply cheap labor for employers?
3 posted on 07/09/2002 2:31:28 AM PDT by lelio
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To: lelio
You wrote, "That's how employers can get away with paying sub-market wages..."

On the contrary, the government sets wage minimums for visa holders, and to get approval of the H visa, the employer has to pay at least what the government requires. AND the salary amount has to be posted on an employee bulletin board for a week or so. Luckily it is a govt form that most people don't glance at. Our company is in a region regulated from Newark, NJ, although we are only about 20 miles from Allentown, PA. About 2 yrs. ago we had to pay about $20,000 more than our normal salary (which matched the Allentown federal minimum salary) because we had to use the Newark federal minimum because that is the region we happen to fall in. We recouped a little bit by specifying that the employee would pay the costs of the visa - a few thousand dollars - at least the ones they are allowed to pay, the govt prohibits the company from passing on some of the fees. This was for a skill (Ideal programming) that we always have a very hard time finding here. It is a mainframe skill and no-one wants to learn it anymore.
4 posted on 07/09/2002 3:37:31 AM PDT by Old_Grouch
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To: pa_mother
Your experience is different from ours. We had the required posting and noted the salary was 20-40K less than ours (we are in Northern VA). My broader argument against this is that the government will inevitably produce complex regulations to benefit the employers. The program creates a new class of indentured servants who can be forced to work harder and longer or else be shipped home.
5 posted on 07/09/2002 3:54:53 AM PDT by palmer
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To: sarcasm
The current ceiling expires next year and will revert to the original limit of 65,000 if no action is taken.

Around here, a lot of techies who worked in year 2000 conversions and for startups found themselves looking for jobs. Unemployment is still low, so I imagine that most found a way to work or get by.

But, these were temporary visas. And, these are intelligent and educated people. If they went to their homelands, they could bring their ideals of accomplishment and democracy with them, and do a lot more to spread our ideals world wide than having than having to fight wars will do.

Maybe the state colleges and universities are going to have to do a better job training people for these jobs, since so many seats in the private universities go to foreign students.

6 posted on 07/09/2002 4:04:48 AM PDT by grania
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To: grania
American high tech flatly does not want programmers over the age of 40, so claims about shortages are lies.

Let me qualify. I am a programmer over the age of 40. The only work I can find is legacy maintainence (maintaining software written over 20 years ago in languages schools don't teach anymore). I cannot find work in modern stuff because employers flatly do not want older programmers to do modern stuff. They want kids just out of school.
7 posted on 07/09/2002 6:03:09 AM PDT by Tokhtamish
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To: Tokhtamish
The only work I can find is legacy maintainence
Let me guess: they said "We want experience in XYZ package" And XYZ was dreamed up by some software company last year. Course the only people that are going to know it are young kids that don't know better that learning the flash in the pan stuff isn't about programming.
What's amusing is that a company that wants that type of programmer and can't see that an old school one can probably learn it quickly or recommend a better way is probably doomed, or will switch over to more traditional methods soon.
8 posted on 07/09/2002 9:39:02 AM PDT by lelio
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To: sarcasm
But some labor economists suggest it may be short-sighted to trim the H1-B visa program now. They predict there will be an upsurge in the number of biologists and scientists needed in the growing bio-tech field, especially in Boston.

Great, let us move American scientists to the service jobs.

The lobby for inport of cheaper foreign labour does not change its stand. See: Living Today: Issues of modern living
Companies throughout the industrialized world soon will face a huge shortage of skilled labor, which accentuates the acute need for effective succession planning, according to a Pennsylvania State University human resources expert. "With a massive baby boomer retirement wave close at hand, prolonged vacancies in critical positions could mean a crisis for organizations perhaps equal to that posed by corporate bankruptcies and accounting firm gaffes," says William J. Rothwell, professor of workforce education and development. In the past, organizations faced with a scarcity of skilled labor could import workers from overseas. This might become less feasible in light of the current War on Terrorism and increased restrictions on visa applications. The customary job description focuses on what people do rather than on results obtained. Competency modeling is based on people analysis and to spot the exemplary performer. "The exemplary performer may be as much as 20 times more productive than his or her average-performing counterparts in the same job category," Rothwell says. In theory, by lifting all performers up to levels closer to those of the superstar performer in each job category, an organization could get up to 20 times the output from existing staff, Rothwell says.

9 posted on 07/15/2002 3:21:49 PM PDT by A. Pole
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To: sarcasm
''We should have a free trade of skills. If someone is coming in from outside the country it's because they have an edge over you. It's not like you're giving jobs away.''

[sarcasm] Gee, that must be why India imports thousands of American workers, right?

It's time this country stopped being everyone's chump.

10 posted on 07/15/2002 3:27:21 PM PDT by Campion
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To: sarcasm
If someone is coming in from outside the country it's because they have an edge over you.

And they're either given lower wages or fewer benefits. In fact folks, "excessive" benefits is what the companies DON'T want to pay. Take health care, for example. An over 40 worker simply, on a statistical average, needs more. Younger and foreign workers need less. Also, why hire someone who's going to cost the company lots of money in 10-15-20 years due to retirement? There is CERTAINLY discrimination of older workers in the high tech fields. From an economic sense, to the companies, it makes sense. But try finding a job at 55, say. I am only 44, and have a secure job (now), but geesh, it's a concern. Too many of my older brethren are having problems.

11 posted on 07/15/2002 3:40:47 PM PDT by Alas Babylon!
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To: Alas Babylon!
An over 40 worker simply, on a statistical average, needs more. Younger and foreign workers need less.

Especially that older workers have families, children and school/college expenses.

12 posted on 07/15/2002 4:06:04 PM PDT by A. Pole
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To: Alas Babylon!; Tokhtamish
Equal to youth is the other factor being overlooked here: the multi-culti, diversity-worshipping brainwashed children educated in the 70's and 80's are now the hiring managers, and they have been taught self-hate and America-loathing, and they view any foreigner as being better, smarter, superior, to any American, particularly OLDER Americans (40+) and particularly white male Americans.

U.S. corps are paying MORE to the foreigners and expecting less just to say they have Indians or Pakis or whatever in their workgroup. It's about diversity, first, then youth. All other concerns---that foreigners can do jobs Americans can't---are red herrings, especially in the job market of today.

My experience in the corporate HQ is that 100% credence is given to ANYTHING an Indian says, to anything said by someone fresh out of MBA school. It is very un-pc to heed the words of experienced, "older" white males. Managers are AFRAID of being involved with older or white or male Americans. Managers know that they are SAFE with THEIR bosses if they simply do everything with "diverse", preferably foreign, people. The appearance counts much more than any substance in today's corporate world.

Now, my question to you and hopefully to all freepers I can find who can shed some light of knowledge and wisdom on this: a sharp, young female friend with 2 BS degrees---one in MIS---was an intern in a large corporation along with a foreign, non-citizen here on an H1B. There was one job, and that job was given to the H1B worker, and the young girl, a local person (she had THAT going agst her, besides being American), was given her walking papers. Ironically, the H1B worker is a +40, white male! But he is from another country, and this corporation worships at the feet of other cultures. ...My question is: does this woman have any recourse? Supposedly, to have the H1B the corp would have to verify that the man is doing something they could find no one else to do. That is demonstrably not the case with this equally educated and qualified AMERICAN citizen who got canned so the foreigner could have the job.

Does anyone know what her options are?

13 posted on 08/03/2002 6:07:09 PM PDT by gg188
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