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To: Dimensio
Ok; I'll slow down.............

Huh? What "won't cut it" and why? How is that trying to have it both ways?

evolution is a continum; right?

Change is ALWAYS happening; right?

Really useful stuff is made from not so useful stuff; right?

Therefore, if one believes evolution to be true, there MUST be a bunch of not so useful stuff just hanging around, getting ready to me made into REALLY useful stuff.


If not, then evolution is no more real than Brownian motion and random walks can take you anywhere: Maxwell's Demon makes CHOICES, and choices indicate direction, and direction indicates a plan, and a plan is a design.
And, while SOME designs are whimsical, all designs have some kind of Intelligence behind them.
160 posted on 07/03/2002 1:03:03 PM PDT by Elsie
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To: Elsie
Change is ALWAYS happening; right?

Well, so long as DNA replicates imperfectly, yes.

Really useful stuff is made from not so useful stuff; right?

It is more accurate to say that "more useful stuff" comes about from changes in existing "stuff", but chances are the earlier "stuff" existed because it too was useful -- it just might not have been as useful as the "new stuff", or it might not be as useful anymore as a result of changes in the organism's environment.

Therefore, if one believes evolution to be true, there MUST be a bunch of not so useful stuff just hanging around, getting ready to me made into REALLY useful stuff.

No, evolution does not follow specified "design plans". New and "better" survival traits come about thorugh changes in existing traits that also provided survival advantage. Parts of an organism that serve no useful function and have never served useful function in previous generations are not only an evolutionary disadvantage, but also unlikely according to natural selection.
164 posted on 07/03/2002 1:08:43 PM PDT by Dimensio
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To: Elsie
Therefore, if one believes evolution to be true, there MUST be a bunch of not so useful stuff just hanging around, getting ready to me made into REALLY useful stuff.

No. "Evolution" KNOWS NOTHING. It is a crap shoot, determination of USEFULNESS comes when the design meets the challenges of life. The degree of which it does so is the REASON FOR WHICH the DNA gets propogated.

Great changes occur in small steps, each step must prove to be a comparative asset -- making you more likely to live. This is also not a perfect process "Bad DNA" is dependent on context of the other DNA of the creature, and DNA segments can operate in multiple context, having influence in more than one area of embryotic development or behavioral hard-wiring. Thus you can have things like sickle-cell anemia in blacks, etc.

Just because a segment of DNA produces bad effects doesnt mean it is easily eradicated by evolution -- it may require 'backing up' the design too far (thereby inherently going through less-efficient design stages).

Think of it as a landscape of possibilities where there are valleys and peaks of 'fitness' -- the creature might be better designed if he wass on peak B instead of A, but to get there he has to venture into the valley where his DNA may die out because of competition of those who remain in the status quo - or at peak design.

264 posted on 07/03/2002 3:21:33 PM PDT by mindprism.com
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