Posted on 06/20/2002 1:37:20 PM PDT by goody2shooz
Heard around 12:25 pm on Fox News Alert: the CDC, in a panel of twelve "experts", have announced that no widespread vaccinations of Americans will be conducted.
I most heartily disagree with that atitude!
Osama and his threat will pass away.. Just like all the others have. I am not afraid of Osama because he will lose and pass away.
However, the precedents we set today will still be in place long after that dirtbag is dispatched. They will not only be used by the Bush Administration.
They will be used by all the others that come after. (Hillary? Algor? Who knows? You don't and I don't either..)
I guess the best way to illustrate this is the Reichstag fire. Now, I don't know about you but I look at those people like morons for placing so much power and so much faith in their government.
History is full of this.
Now, you obviously don't have to agree with me. But can you at least see my point?
Did your doctor examine the vaccination area and confirm that you are now resistant? Because usually no scarring from a Smallpox vaccination indicates it failed to work.
There it is, they are against everyone getting the vaccine if the only people that can't get it are the Aids patients. It wouldn't be a politically correct thing to leave the Q****s the only group at risk.
I understand your concern, but I feel that you are way too confident about defeating the terrorists, and way too mistrustful of your fellow citizens.
I do understand your point, but I just don't agree. Thanks for being civil.
I'm beginning to think that things have changed a LOT from when folks last had all the vaccinations. The hep. shot I dreaded, but it wasn't bad. It's not the old GG syrup shot.
/john
No problem..
And you are my fellow citizen.. I don't distrust you.
Government officials however.. Their agenda is often their own, and doesn't necessarily reflect yours, mine or that of my neighbor who lives across the street.
And there have been lots of examples of this in the last eight (or so..) years.
John, this is quite worrying, effective Smallpox vaccination doesn't just require the shot/scratch to be given correctly it also needs a checkup a few days later.
I wonder if the Smallpox vaccine they used on you had been diluted? The government was debating this a few months ago.
I can call my civilian MD tomorrow. I saw her today, and updated my civilian records with my shot record info. She didn't ask anything about a scar, but was glad that I got the vaccination, and equally glad that I didn't get the anthrax.
/john
/john
/john
She didn't ask anything about a scar, but was glad that I got the vaccination, and equally glad that I didn't get the anthrax.
The SOP in British Smallpox vaccination was to re-vaccinate if no scar appeared after a couple of weeks. The Microbiologists at the hospital I used to work at in Cambridge used to say the best indicator of Smallpox vaccination effectiveness was a scar.
This is because the Vaccinia virus used is live and should elicit a local immune response. If there is a scar you can be confident the vaccination worked. If there isn't, it may still have worked, but you can't be sure without a confirmatory test. It could be your immune system doesn't create a powerful enough response to the specific surface antigens on the virus to leave a scar. However, everyone I know who was vaccinated against Smallpox has a scar.
Its worth asking your doctor about it, perhaps the data the old British SOP was based on has now been disproved.
/john
HM surgeons are well respected in this house, and I will verify with my MD tomorrow. Phone calls are inexpensive. But I truly do think that there is a disconnect on the old vs. the new.
I'll make sure to either come back to this thread or freep-mail you with her response.
And thanks for your concern.
/john
The aerosolized smallpox virus which caused the 1971 outbreak in the Soviet Union (go here for background info) was vaccine-resistant and highly virulent. If Saddam or al Qaeda hit us with smallpox, the strain they use may be similar to the Soviet strain. What good would it do to vaccinate everyone and then be attacked with a vaccine-resistant strain? Talk about wasted tax dollars!
Of course, the only people who died in that outbreak (3) were the ones who had not been vaccinated. They all contracted the highly lethal form -- hemorrhagic smallpox.
But still, the feds probably think our bio-dollar$ are better spent toward working fast & furiously toward a new treatment alternative. If you'll go read the link above, you can read the Senate testimony on how we now have an animal model for antibiotic treatment that looks promising.
And Dales, you were dead on about the socioeconomic implications if the vaccinations were made available on a "voluntarily" basis. What a nightmare that would be!
If anyone wants to see photos of hemorrhagic smallpox, click on the links below. I would post them here but I'm afraid I might make someone sick to their stomach if they're eating or something.
http://www.randomhouse.com/features/preston/cobraevent/smallpox4.html
http://www.randomhouse.com/features/preston/cobraevent/art/smallpox2.jpg
More info here: http://ccc.apgea.army.mil/reference_materials/textbook/HTML_Restricted/chapters/chapter_27.htm
That is a manifestation of the disease which occurs in genetically predisposed individuals and pregnant women etc, with the common Variola major strains. I haven't heard of any distinct strain of Smallpox with such a high mortality rate against vaccinees. But I have heard of vaccinated people who were infected with India 1 becoming very ill.
The Soviets were testing smallpox aerosols at their main bioweapons testing range, Vozrozhdeniye Island in the Aral Sea in 1971. Apparently, a young female biologist working on deck aboard a research ship which was passing by, was infected. She came down with smallpox later in the port town of Aralsk. A total of twelve people there became ill, the town was quarantined and 50,000 people were re-vaccinated.
The three who died, a woman and two small children, had never been vaccinated. The rest had been, and although they fell ill, they survived.
Apparently, the Soviet Smallpox strain was isolated in 1967 in India during a vaccination program by Soviet medics. The strain was so deadly to non-vaccinees the Soviets decided to use it for their bioweapons program. They also tried to genetically engineer it, so that standard Vaccinia virus would not be an effective vaccine - but failed. Hopefully, no budding al-Qaeda Molecular Biologist has succeeded where the Soviets failed!
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