Nuclear Nightmares

The New York Times Magazine ^ | 05/26/2002 | BILL KELLER

[luckystarmom]

This is such an uplifting story. Not.

[snippy_about_it]

bump for later read

[backhoe]

Cross-linking:

Nuclear, Biological, & Chemical Warfare- Survival Skills, Pt. II

Nuclear News you *can* use--

[gcruse]

Flyover country = survival country

[aristotleman]

Reading this makes me wonder why I quit smoking.

[Brett66]

Glad I don't live in any coastal cities.

[gcruse]

I'm thinking of taking up radiation, myself.

[SSN558]

It takes more than fissionable material to make a bomb capable of reaching critical mass. In fact it takes a team of very cabaple scientists and engineers to make it happen, not to mention lots of $$$$$$. The best the terrorists can hope to achieve is a dirty bomb, with no nuclear yield.

Security forces are soon to be equipted with Cyber 3 radiation detectors that will find with ease the smallest amount of radioactive material. You can't hide this stuff without tons of concrete and lead. More scare talk from the control freaks that want only to eliminate freedom. They never can stoop low enough.

[spetznaz]

This is stuff that is scary but needs to be delved into more than is done now. There is obviously a huge potential risk of a major strike against mainland USA, and strategies need to be implemented that will either staunch most of these attacks or stop them altogether, preferably stopping them all. Logistic methods need to be improved, and proactive tactics need to be carried out against both the terrorist groups, and those who aid them.

The reason i added 'those who help them' is because to me it seems those in places of power seem to only go after the 'mules' and leave the real kingpins in place. For example we have all heard of Hezbollah and Hamas, and how we are trying to get them. Yet did you know there have been several meetings where the masterminds and strategists behind these groups get together, yet do so with impunity. Yet it is obvious that if we leave the clever people to plot, and just kill and capture the mules, then our fight is for naught because the world is rife with people willing to strap semtex or even carry a kiloton device.

And then there are groups like the Saudis who funnel funds in the droves to these groups. Yet, due to the fact around a third of US oil comes from the Saudis, and also due to the royal House of Saud being involved in a myriad of areas pertinent to US interest, including the military (eg did you know that in the Carlyle group which is involved in US military development there are members of the house of Saud, as well as members of the binLadin family, who are relatives of the more known bin Laden).

Then there is the issue of Pakistan, which to me seems a much greater threat than even Iraq since they already have a nuclear arsenal, and the country is always under threat from Islamic radicals. Musharaff took power through a coup de tat, and there is the possibility that one day his successor will usurp his power in the same manner. Iraq on the other hand is ruled by a dictator, and the 'advantage' in this is that Saddam rules with an iron hand. This means that in Iraq there are no islmaic radicals since Saddam would not risk any uprisings of any kind. That is why Iraq, although having many sunni muslims, is in essence a type of atheist nation. And when Saddam dies his sons will take over, and there are reports they are even worse than he is.

This means that although the regime is bad for Iraqi people, it actually is beneficial for the rest of the world since it is stable. A bad dictatorship it is, but it is predictable and stable. Pakistan on the other hand is ephemeral, and like the sword of damocles there is always a threat hanging on its leadership. Most of the people there hate the west, and the groups willing to destroy the US are virtually legion. And most of these young Pakistanis are getting a technologically based education that rivals that of the west, yet at the same time are exposed to the worst hate rhetoric and religious zeal from the madrasas. This means that when they are young they go to the religious madrasas where they learn the US is evil.... then when they reach their teens they are in 'western type' schools where they learn math computers etc. This means that in the next decade there will be a horde of very well educated lunatics, as opposed to what we are used to today.... ignorant simply lunatics. And a clever enemy is far worse than a non-educated one.

Thus it is essential for pre-emptive decisions to be made by the congress on how to handle the real threats instead of just going after the mules, and figureheads. I was actually very glad when the US went after Usama bin Laden since for once real action was taken against someone who was a real threat. And also because someone who was responsible for thousands of deaths around the world was finally held accountable and direct action taken against him (unlike what Clinton did when he just launched a couple of missiles after the '98 embassy bombings).

Actually those embassy bombings in Africa were personal for me since i am originally from Kenya and was born and raised there. And it incensed me that UBL was willing to destroy lives just to drive some assinine point of his home. And nothing would bring me greater pleasure than to see UBL brought to justice.

Anyway the US needs to take serious steps to ensure that atrocities like the one commited on 9-11 do not happen again, because if they do not and just continue letting things continue as they are it is only a matter of time before something bigger happens. And no one wants that.

[DeaconBenjamin]

Unless someone decides to hit Indianapolis on Monday.

[spetznaz]

I was watching something on C-Span 2 last week where this guy was telling a congressional hearing about the risk of terrorists getting a hold of a kiloton level device from the Mafiya (Russian Mafia). Thus there is a possibilty that exists of these kooks getting a hold of such material, and UBL's group had actually gotten something from the Mafiya, however it turned out that the mob had hoodwinked them and sold them a dud. However are we willing to be complacent and hope the next time it is also a fake?

However i do agree the greatest threat is probably a radiological dispersal device, not an actual nuke. However such a device would have far reaching ramifications that touched everything from the economy to social decorum. Imagine for example what would happen tot he US economy if one of those devices exploded in WallStreet?

Anyway i also share your views that many freedoms are threatened. And i believe that the moment what makes America America is taken away then the terrorists win, and there is a risk that some over-zealous congress meet might implement laws that curtail freedoms. And that is wrong because it would destroy the spirit of America, which is partly composed of the great freedom inherent in this nation. The US without rights and freedom is no longer the US, just the semblance.

Thus what needs to happen is a union between getting these crazies before they act, and the continual dedication to the great freedoms and rights in this country. Having safety without liberty; and having liberty without safety are both the same. Flawed! What is needed is safety with liberty.

Without safety the liberties of the US are at risk since the lives of Americans is at risk. However without liberty life in the US would be like life in most other nations in the world...... repressed suppressed and oppressed! And if you look at it all over the globe people die for freedom, people suffer for it,and risk all for it. People like Lech Walessa in 80's Poland, people like Mandella during the times of Apartheid S.Africa, people like Ghandi in colonial India. People of all creeds and colors, fighting to have a semblance of what the United States of America has. And as someone who was born and raised outside your borders i can tell you this, loose your freedom and you will discover why so many envy and hold you in praise (and why others hate you).... due to your great and mighty freedoms. And it shocks me when some act like these freedoms are for naught, and thus can be 'switched' on and off.

America is liberty.

[gcruse]

Yeah, that's true. 9/11 really changed everything.

[happygrl]

BUMP to read later

[maxwellp]

I went to the doctor recently for a check-up. The doctor was pushing all sorts of tests at me (never mind that I feel fine and have no symptoms of anything). I said "Doctor, I really feel that we are going to have some sort of a nuclear war, so tests right now mean nothing to me". He thought about it for a minute or so and finally said "I agree." After 9/11 I'm waiting for the other shoe to fall. If I sound fatalistic, I really am not. It's just that I don't think America, aside from our actions in Afghanistan, is acting in a strong and decisive manner. I haven't heard about illegals from Mid-Eastern countries being deported en masse. Our borders are still wide-open. No one has been tried before a Military Tribunal. And various countries with dictators who are crazy (as in mentally unstable) are busy doing God knows what. When America takes strong action against terrorists then I'll have some tests done.

[TADSLOS]

I guarantee you that NBC Must See TV would still be on the air somewhere and being watched by the living clueless ...

[boris]

The U.S. obligingly announced that it has no domestic means of producing smallpox vaccine, so it placed large orders for smallpox vaccine with a British company. I believe the name is Acambis. They probably gave the street address, so the terrorists can find it more efficiently.

Were I Osama Bin Laden, I would arrange for Acambis to vanish from the face of the Earth. No need to actually spread smallpox; the destruction of the source of the vaccine would have the desired terror effect.

--Boris

[My Identity]

Film Footage of Actual Blasts
From a PBS site:

Operation Cue (500kb) Beginning in 1953 the Federal Civil Defense Adminstration, working with the Atomic Energy Commission, set up an atomic test program to investigate the effects of nuclear weapons on typical American homes and their furnishings.	Layer Cake Design (500kb) In Andrei Sakharov's Layer Cake design, several layers of light and heavy elements were alternated. High explosives surrounding the Layer Cake would be used to implode and ignite the atomic bomb at the center of the device. The atomic explosion would then set off a fusion reaction in the deuterium.	Operation Castle (300kb) Operation Castle, a series of thermonuclear tests, was conducted in the Marshall Islands in the spring of 1954. The Bravo detonation yielded the equivalent of 15 megatons of TNT.
Operation Castle (100kb) Operation Castle yielded more fallout than any of the other U.S. thermonuclear tests, contaminating military personnel and civilians on nearby islands.	Camp Desert Rock (900kb) At Camp Desert Rock in Nevada, the U.S. military began using smaller atomic blasts to learn how to fight a nuclear war. On April 22, 1952 approximately 2,000 Army personnel conducted maneuvers beneath the mushroom cloud of the Charlie nuclear detonation. The 31-kiloton explosion was one of the largest ever conducted in Nevada to that date. This government film claimed that with a few basic precautions, U.S. troops could fight and survive an atomic attack.	Operation Cue (300kb) Each home was equipped with refrigerators, typical appliances, the kinds of food one would eat, from baby food to adult food, and were exposed to the blast.

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You need Apple's Quicktime 3.0 to be able to see the video.

[M. T. Cicero II]

Not true! In 1967 (?), the DOD and NRC hired 3 just-graduated physics students (masters) to design a working device based on public information. They succeded after approx. 300 man-hours. The report is still classified. Actually, after reading some of the available information, I think that a quick and sloppy device could be maufactured by a couple of techs and engineers (and a machinist) with access to military cannons, explosives, and cannons. The "gun" type device is just not that hard to manufacture.

[Autodidactic]

Bump to read later.....

Remember people, "Islam is a religion of Peace"

/sarcasm>