Libertarians Advocate Drug Legalization: Recipe For Escalating Societal Decay

GOPUSA.COM ^ | May.16,2002 | Carol Devine-Molin

[Mark Bahner]

Ron Paul is a libertarian, you fool. He uses the Republican Party to get elected. And he's no conservative.

Heh, heh, heh! Looks like YOU'RE the fool! (Again. Better get used to it!)

In the Conservative Index, posted by The New American Magazine...which "rightwing2" assures me is the DEFINITIVE rating system for conservatives, Ron Paul virtually always finishes near the top.

Ron Paul...the prototypical conservative

From that post:

TOP "TEN" CONSERVATIVE LIST based on 2001 Conservative Index scores published in The New American magazine:

US House

1. Rep. Tancredo (R-CO) 95%

2. Rep. Paul (R-TX) (former Libertarian) 92%

3. Rep. Schaefer (R-CO) 90%

4. Rep. Hostettler (R-IN) 88%

5. Rep. Royce (R-CA) 84%

6. Rep. Rohrbacher (R-CA) 83%

7. Rep. Sensenbrenner (R-WI) 81%

8. Rep. Duncan (R-TN) 79%

9. Rep. Barr (R-GA) Rep. Goode (R-VA) (former Democrat) Rep. Pombo (R-CA) all tied for 9th place with a 78% conservative rating.

US Senate

1. Sen. John Kyl (R-AZ) 74%

2. Sen. Jesse Helms (R-NC) 72%

3. Sen. Robert Smith (R-NH), Sen. James Inhofe & Sen Voinovich (R-OH) 70%

4. Sen. Strom Thurmond 69% (former Democrat)

5. Sen Phil Gramm (R-TX), Sen. Campbell (R-CO) (both former Democrats) & Sen. Frank Murkowski at 67%

6. Sen. Jeff Sessions (R-AL), Sen. Pat Roberts (R-KS), Sen. Mitch McConnell (R-KY) & Sen. Bob Bennett (R-UT) at 65%

Read it and Freep! You apparently don't know your conservatives! That comes from you not recognizing that virtually NO Republicans are interested in the goal that you SAY you are striving for...returning the government to the size it was prior to the New Deal. (You certainly won't get there with the federal War on Drugs, by the way. As was pointed out, federal laws against marijuana are NEW DEAL laws. So I guess FDR is your fave, after all.)

[headsonpikes]

"I don't respond to sicko-wacko crazies."

My error is that I do.

[christine]

well said!! ;)

[Mark Bahner]

The Libertarian Party is void of any rational, logical or substantive ideas.

Then I guess Thomas Jefferson and James Madison were "void of any rational, logical, or substantive ideas." Because they were FARRRR closer to being Libertarians than Republicans! (In fact, the founders revolted against a government that was far less intrusive than the current federal government that Republicans are running.)

[palo verde]

Hi Mark
I don't think the statistic of votes for Harry Browne in last election is relevant
anyone with eyes to see realized if we didn't get Bush in there, clinton would have continued to rule behind puppet Al Gore
I am Libertarian, but in last election I moved heaven and earth to get George Bush elected
I believed the safety of our Republic depended on it
If Bush had gone after the clinton corruption when he took Office, I would have continued backing him and GOP all the way
but GOP made different choice
so I am going after what I really want
we gave away all our power to government, I want us to take it back
Love, Palo

[Reagan Man]

The New American Magazine is an extremist right wing publication, that gets it support from thelikes of the John Birch Society... political malcontents, kooks and nutjobs. JBS is another extremist rihgtwing organization and has no influence in American politics. I'm sure all 375K libertarians in America, just love the New American Magazine.

Ron Paul didn't dare run as a conservative, because he isn't a conservative. Paul is a libertarian, who chose to run in a district that has 60% Democratic Party voters. Ron Paul, a good old fashioned liberal-libertarian. Hehehehehehehe

How many Libertarian's are in the House. One In the Senate. Zero In Governorships, zippo

[tpaine]

Very well, anyone can play your - "I don't respond to sicko-wacko crazies" game. -- But you simply muzzle yourself. -- Which in your case, is a bonus.

[Thumper1960]

More free? I think your imagining that's the way it was. Ingesting drugs doesn't mean your more free. America wasn't more free 80 years ago. Women were just given the right to vote and minority voting, especially in the old south, was looked upon in an unfavorable manner. There were a whole lotta poor people living in America, both black and white, and the average America lived to the ripe old age of 50-55. Come on! I don't think you realize, just how good you have it today. You're living in the greatest nation in world history.

Actually, I do know. But then, folks were much more individualistic. Folks were more community oriented. We didn't have confiscatory tax rates that enslave the wage earner to the whims of Congress-critters who seek votes by theft and redistribution. We had fewer laws that restricted speech and religion. WE could build as we pleased upon our own land without government interference. There are a host of ways that people were freer. Don't deny that.

[Reagan Man]

Here in Colorado, we pride ourselves on individualism and we are very community oriented. But I will agree with you that 80 years ago, taxes on the average American, were almost non-existent and the government was far less intrusive into the lives of the American people.

We had fewer laws that restricted speech and religion.

I don't agree with you at all.

WE could build as we pleased upon our own land without government interference.

Okay. There are too many regulations on building today.

There are a host of ways that people were freer. Don't deny that.

I don't deny that the scope and size of the federal governemnt hasn't grown out of control since 1922. But I don't believe our basic individual freedoms, having been undercut, as some folks do.

[Ken H]

The point of this forum is to restore this country to a constitutional republic as the Founders intended.

The mission statement of Free Republic by Jim Robinson is about halfway down the linked page, under What is our mission?

Any thoughts on this, especially the parts about the Federal government acting unconstitutionally?

[rightwing2]

The New American Magazine is an extremist right wing publication, that gets it support from thelikes of the John Birch Society... political malcontents, kooks and nutjobs. JBS is another extremist rihgtwing organization and has no influence in American politics. I'm sure all 375K libertarians in America, just love the New American Magazine. Ron Paul didn't dare run as a conservative, because he isn't a conservative. Paul is a libertarian, who chose to run in a district that has 60% Democratic Party voters. Ron Paul, a good old fashioned liberal-libertarian. Hehehehehehehe How many Libertarian's are in the House. One In the Senate. Zero In Governorships, zippo

Shows how little you know about politics. Ron Paul is a Congressman not a Senator! You are even more wrong about his political leanings. Conservative hero Ron Paul has consistently been the most conservative member of Congressman from 1996-2000 and was only ousted from that position in 2001 by conservative hero, Rep. Tancredo. Ron Paul is in actuality a pro-life paleo-libertarian which is very far from being a liberal-libertarian and very far from being a neocon RINO like you since he consistently supports the same conservative principles and policies, which you consistently oppose. Funny how you have joined your far-left comrades in the liberal media and your Socialist brothers in France, Holland, and Britain in condemning traditional conservatives who put their country first as part of some virtually non-existent "extreme right wing". Thanks for exposing your true pinko/RINO colors to us all with that stupid comment. And yes, there is a Libertarian Governor. His name is Jesse Ventura. He is a bona-fide liberal libertarian and perhaps the biggest disgrace for a Governor in the country. To put in more simplistic terms which you can understands, the lesson to be learned here is pro-life paleolibertarians=GOOD. Pro-abortion liberallibertarians and pinko neocon RINOs=BAD!

[Reagan Man]

The point of this forum is to restore this country to a constitutional republic as the Founders intended.

Agreed. But why are you addressing me about this? Frankly, I don't like your the tone of your message or the inferences you're making. But I'm willing to listen to your explanation. Continue.

[A CA Guy]

Ken, the founders could not read the future and they knew things change.

I agree it is not the cleanest method, but the lawmakers choose reinterpretation over time so the Constitution wasn't eventually considered just an old piece of history.

They could have just constantly created ammendments as needed. Sounds like you would have preferred that way of going. Some day that may happen.

Regarding drugs, the Libertarians need to drop that issue.
I know the addicted can never give the drugs up, they are weak, lacking self control and don't care who suffers in their selfishness.
The Libertarians need to drop that and other forms of anarchy if they want to be listened to without many feeling it requires tin-foiled hats.
Until they do that, they will just be the crazy cousin kept locked away in the closet.

[palo verde]

thanks Ken
I just went to your link and read it
the mission of FreeRepublic is very interesting
and I am totally in accord with it
Love, Palo

[palo verde]

I had never even heard of the Libertarians till I turned on access tv here in Tucson
and heard them call for stopping the war on drugs
it was so spectacularly sensible (and they were so courageous to call for it)
(I didn't think anyone dared)
that they made an instant convert out of me
Now that I know what they stand for
I am in awe and gratitude that they exist
I guess not all citizens see things the same way
it's a free country, I'll vote for them, you may prefer other candidates and Parties
Love, Palo

[Ken H]

I'll rephrase.

The Free Republic mission statement says that the Federal government is acting outside its constitutional authority in areas such as crime, education, environment, and education.

Your position, as I interpret it, is that you believe the Federal government is indeed acting constitutionally in these areas.

Is that an accurate interpretation?

[Reagan Man]

Shows how little you know about politics. Ron Paul is a Congressman not a Senator!

I never said Ron Paul was in the Seante, mister smart-aleck. He is Representative from Texas. Putting words in my mouth, doesn't make them true.

You are even more wrong about his political leanings. Conservative hero Ron Paul has consistently been the most conservative member of Congressman from 1996-2000 and was only ousted from that position in 2001 by conservative hero, Rep. Tancredo.

Not according to the American Conservative Union and the rating system it employs. While Ron Paul does have a lifetime rating of 85 with the ACU, his 2000 mark was only 75 and in 2001 he was at 70. Looks like Paul is moving away from conservatism, headed in the wrong direction.

Ron Paul may have some conservative leanings, on fiscal issues, but politically, he is your basic libertarian. If he doesn't support the Libertarian Party agenda and he is pro-life, then he should denounce the LP, immediately. And explain, how he gets elected in a district with a 60% Democrtic Party registartion. You ain't fooling no one. And Jesse Ventura is a political independent, not a practicing libertarian. While Ventura supports abortion rights, he also favors strict enforcement of America's national drug control policy.

As to your personal attacks aimed at me, they're noted, for the record, dummy.

[Reagan Man]

Is that an accurate interpretation?

No. On education and environment the federal government has overstepped its bounds. The education dept should be abolished. I'm a strong law and order conservative and believe, if you do the crime, you do the time. Period.

Any other specific questions?

[Libertarian_4_eva]

I'm glad that drugs are illegal. If they weren't, people would probably use them.

What drugs are you on? America imports hundreds of tons of drugs from all over the world every single month(*). Right now the midwest is exploding with hard drug use yet it is illegal. Making drugs legal is not my biggest issue or one that I think is very important however to say that because something is illegal people will not do it is insane.

(*) = Most pot and meth are created and grown here in the united states yet hundreds of tons still get sent here every month.