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Changing the 2nd Amendment
Seattle Post Intelligencer ^ | May 9, 2002 | Seattle Post Intelligencer Editorial Board

Posted on 05/09/2002 7:02:38 AM PDT by ethical

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To: Hunble;All;bang_list
Here's the "Letters To The Editor Communist" link...

Pinging the bang_list again, for the mailto link...

editpage@seattlepu.com

41 posted on 05/09/2002 7:45:59 AM PDT by in the Arena
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To: in the Arena
Thanks for the e-mail link.
42 posted on 05/09/2002 7:48:16 AM PDT by Hunble
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To: Pern
The Second Amendment contains only a single comma.

--Boris

43 posted on 05/09/2002 7:48:44 AM PDT by boris
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To: Hunble
I will NOT call 9-11 to beg the police to protect my family when they are in danger. However, I will notify the police where they may gather up the body parts, if finally show up.

I'll call 911, but only as a backup. Hopefully my trusty .45 ACP and/or shotgun will have made short work of any intruders.

44 posted on 05/09/2002 7:49:46 AM PDT by ladtx
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To: ethical
"some reasonable relationship to the preservation of efficiency of a well regulated militia."

"The militia of the United States consists of all able-bodied males at least 17 years of age..." Title 10, Section 311 of the U.S. Code.
"A militia, when properly formed, are in fact the people themselves...and include all men capable of bearing arms." Richard Henry Lee
"The militia is the dread of tyrants and the guard of freemen." Gov. R. Lucas, former Major General of the Ohio Militia, 1832
Until now, through Republican and Democratic administrations alike, the Justice Department has been in virtual lockstep with the high court's position on the Second Amendment, as last stated in the 1939 decision, United States v. Miller.
"The Constitution shall never be construed to authorize Congress to prevent the people of the United States, who are peaceable citizens, from keeping their own arms." Samuel Adams

So how was "the high court" able to do so if even Congress isn't supposed to be able to do it? Oh, how I could go on...

45 posted on 05/09/2002 7:50:16 AM PDT by philman_36
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To: rellimpank
--obviously, they have never even read Miller in its entirety-

If I recall correctly, I believe that the Supreme Court ruled in Miller that the private ownership of the gun in question (a sawed-off shotgun) was not protected by the 2nd amendment because it was not considered to be suited for use by a militia. I haven't read it cover to cover yet, but I seem to remember that part of the decision. If that is the case, then wouldn't the ban on so-called assault weapons would not be allowed under Miller?

46 posted on 05/09/2002 7:50:53 AM PDT by Orangedog
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To: newgeezer
"Gun laws" mainly protect gun-toting criminals from any fear of resistance.
"Laws that forbid the carrying of arms...disarm only those who are neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes. Such laws make things worse for the assaulted and better for the assailants; they serve rather to encourage than to prevent homicides, for an unarmed man may be attacked with greater confidence than an armed man." Thomas Jefferson
Old knowledge oft ignored.
47 posted on 05/09/2002 7:53:49 AM PDT by philman_36
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To: in the Arena
This is a sore issue with me.

Three times on my horse ranch in New Mexico, my wife and I had to hold criminals at gun point. Since we were so isolated, 45 minutes later, the police finally arrived and arrested them.

I guess we could have listened to these idiots, but instead of those criminals being in jail today, the police could have placing my wife and I into body bags.

My wife and I made the wise choice!

48 posted on 05/09/2002 7:54:01 AM PDT by Hunble
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To: ladtx
"the right of the people" pertains to every citizen.

If you look at how militia is defined in the original version U.S. Constitution as well as in the Kansas Constitution, it is to be made up of EVERY able bodied man between the age of twenty-one to forty years of age. The Kansas Constitution actually makes a provision that the State will supply each man with a "military style" rifle to carry out said duties.
49 posted on 05/09/2002 7:54:36 AM PDT by AdA$tra
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To: the gillman@blacklagoon.com
"I'm worried that this move by the administration is designed to prevent a clear and final ruling, placating the conservatives temporaily, yet allowing the gbmnt to change "policy" again at its pleasure."

I will believe that the Administration has good motives IF and WHEN they begin rolling back previous gun laws restricting types of firearms and even magazines.

50 posted on 05/09/2002 7:57:11 AM PDT by Don Myers
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To: ethical
The title of this editorial, "Changing the 2nd Amendment," is particularly apt, but not in the way the editorialist intends. The practice of judicial activism, of which the 2nd amendment's history is an excellent example, demonstrates the peril of confusing judicial power with legislative power.

The cited U.S. versus Miller interpretation of the second amendment is as clear a case of judicial activism (i.e. the judiciary assuming legislative powers) as exists.

By the rules of English grammar the phrase, "A well regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free state..." is not a qualifying clause. Yet by the judicial interpretation cited in this editorial, the right to keep and bear arms only applies so far as it was necessary to maintain a well regulated militia. The judiciary took it upon itself, not to interpret this amendment, but to effectively rewrite it, making "a well regulated militia," contrary to the grammatical rules of the English language, a qualifying clause.

The wording of this amendment does not support this interpretation, regardless of the desire of any judge or justice. Allowing the judiciary this sort of latitude in their decisions is to allow them legislative power. It violates the Constitution's fundamental principle of separation of powers.

51 posted on 05/09/2002 7:57:16 AM PDT by Snuffington
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To: chesty_puller
Do you think they want to weaken the First Admendment too???

Theirs is the type of thinking that think the first ammendment only applies to the mainstream press (or the govt controlled media - but I repeat myself).

52 posted on 05/09/2002 7:58:07 AM PDT by joeyman
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To: Mr. Bungle
after numerous decades of settled thinking

This is one method of attack on the control types thinking I never see. If it has been settled for their 'numerous decades' they are admitting that it has been changed from what it originally meant. So it boils down to six decades of violating the right the admendment is there to protect.

53 posted on 05/09/2002 8:03:49 AM PDT by StriperSniper
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To: HELLRAISER II
"They'll play hell taking the Good Ol'Boy's guns down here in the South, "

I seriously doubt that. There are only 4.3 million members of the NRA. 300,000 in the GOA and maybe a half million in all of the other gun groups combined. For me to think even for a milli-second that some Good Old Boy from any part of the country is suddenly going to get off the couch and take an interest in the Second Amendment is laughable. If the 80 million gun owners would have taken an interest before this, we wouldn't be in this mess.

54 posted on 05/09/2002 8:04:29 AM PDT by Shooter 2.5
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To: AdA$tra
If you look at how militia is defined in the original version U.S. Constitution as well as in the Kansas Constitution, it is to be made up of EVERY able bodied man between the age of twenty-one to forty years of age. The Kansas Constitution actually makes a provision that the State will supply each man with a "military style" rifle to carry out said duties.

I agree that militia does apply to every able-bodied man. However, I believe in the framers time that is just what it meant every "man". It's good that it included the term "the right of the people", this way it also includes women.

55 posted on 05/09/2002 8:05:26 AM PDT by ladtx
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To: Snuffington
In the U.S. versus Miller interpretation , the court ruled that Miller was in violation because his sawed-off shutgun was not a military weapon.

If anything, this interpretation was validation that every citizen is a member of the militia. Our duties as members of the militia is to keep military weapons for the protection of a free state. Other weapons are not protected.

Is this why many States are trying to ban military weapons and only allow those with no other purpose other than for hunting or target practice?

Next step is to declare all non-military weapons in violation of the US vs Miller verdict.

For this reason, my wife and I only own military style weapons.

56 posted on 05/09/2002 8:06:17 AM PDT by Hunble
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To: ethical
The amendments contained in The Bill of Rights were written to protect the rights of the people, that is EXCEPT the 2nd amendment -- That one, curiously enough, was written to protect the rights of the Militia...Duh?
57 posted on 05/09/2002 8:07:49 AM PDT by vortigern
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To: ethical
F...ing morons deserve to live in FSU where whole constitution was filled with "collective rights" including collective freedom of speach right, collective right is no right.
58 posted on 05/09/2002 8:07:54 AM PDT by alex
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To: Hunble
I'm glad you and your wife made that choice.

Your neighbors should thank you also.

People that delegate responsibility of their safety and well being to others are fooling themselves and risking their lives.

59 posted on 05/09/2002 8:09:12 AM PDT by in the Arena
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To: borkrules
It might also interest idiot liberals to consider that each and every time the words "the people" is used in the other articles of the Bill of Rights, it is used to describe an individual right.

Not to mention that if the drafters of the 2nd amendment had intended it to only be a right to the individual states, they would have written "...the right of the states to keep and bare arms shall not be infringed." In the 10th amendment there clearly is a distinction between the states and the people, specifically: "The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people.. The two terms are not interchangeable. When the constitution says "the people" it does NOT mean "the states."

60 posted on 05/09/2002 8:10:02 AM PDT by Orangedog
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