Posted on 04/29/2002 6:58:13 PM PDT by a_Turk
The Vatican has signed an unprecedented agreement with the Government of Turkey to promote religious dialogue between Christians and Muslims.
The agreement, signed at the Vatican last Friday, was made public only today and was initialled by Cardinal Francis Arinze, the Head of the Papal Council for Inter-religious Dialogue and by Mehmet Yilmaz, the Head of Turkey's Religious Affairs office.
It breaks new ground in the Vatican's current attempts to reach out towards the Islamic world.
It is the first time the Vatican has signed such an agreement with the government of a predominantly Muslim country as apart from with a religious institution.
Connections 'difficult'
The Vatican already has established links with one of the most prestigious universities in the Muslim world, the al-Azhar mosque in Cairo.
However the Pope's advisers on inter-religious dialogue have always found it difficult to establish new connections with the Muslim world which has no central authority and no equivalent to the Pope and his hierarchy of cardinals and bishops.
Therefore, a senior Vatican official explained that as there is no great difference within the Muslim world between religious and governmental authorities, the official partner in this case is a department of the Turkish Government.
The Vatican's agreement with Turkey promotes liberty of religion, of belief and of conscience and aims to eliminate prejudices.
Somehow the Vatican and the Turks being friendly does not strike me as a good thing.I understand. You'd rather the world remained divided.
Words are sometimes painfull.Did I hurt your feelings? I did not direct my original reply to you. Should I be ashamed of myself for not giving your religion or country enough attention?
Well,believe it or not, I dont really care what you or anyone else believes regarding the nature of God.You may worship and revere a port-a-let if you choose,and it still would be none of my business, as long as what you believe does not cause others (including me and mine) harm. We have a quaint custom in the USA called freedom of religion.
Glad to hear you, personally, dont advocate my death, since I wont convert to your belief system.Big of you.
Since Muslim chants of "Death to America" are ringing out loudly, and the voice(s) of reason in the Islamic world are very much muted,perhaps you can ponder awhile on the power of words.
While you do that,I will prepare myself for the inevitable reaction.
She can not understand that anyone who loves God,would threaten to hurt anyone else."God would not like that, and he must get very mad at bad people who hurt other people".
To her, God is.PERIOD.
No doubts, no politics, no comprehension of suicide bombers,the UN, or population controlling dictactors, no envy of those who have more than she.A desire to share what she has with those who have less than she.A clear,untarnished view of right and wrong. A normal child.
What is your child like?
I'm not sure you've conveyed what you intended to in that question. Care to clarify? Thanks in advance.
No doubt about it. There is a never-ending supply of those who don't seem to get the message.
The Orthodox pray for the unity of all men at every Liturgy.
Make every Muslim in the world hate Americans as much as they hate Jews? Is that the goal?Whoaaa, whoaa, back up a minute. I know plenty Muslims who don't hate Jews, and also don't hate you. It ain't like you've been led to believe.
They already do.
What is your child like?My children know all about Christianity, Judaism, and Islam, and understands that it is not up to us as individuals to change God's will. That will includes that some be Christian and others be Muslim, and yet others be something else. And they understand God's wish and hope that we, His children love and support one another through what is already a difficult journey.
I'm not sure you've conveyed what you intended to in that question. Care to clarify? Thanks in advance.You feel to have the right to pass judgement on me, because you think of me, a Muslim, as one of the murdering heathen who have passed judgement on you..
unity we can do withoutI can't agree. Anyway, the Turkish Republic doesn't "suffer" the presence of Catholics, in fact we're pretty happy together. The Orthodox, having been agitated by the leadership hopeful Russian Czars have a harder time feeling happy. But the time will come..
No. Not really.
I made my earlier post as my own commentary response to the actions of certain officials of the church. I disagree with those actions for the reasons I have indicated. My comment was made without much concern either way what religion you are personally.
because you think of me, a Muslim, as one of the murdering heathen who have passed judgement on you.
Again, not really. I do take issue with the muslim religion's doctrines and teachings. I am in agreement with Belloc in characterizing them as a heretical perversion of the judeo-christian tradition.
I take this position because mohammedism is based around several assertions that are loosely based upon the Judeo-Christian doctrines that predated them by centuries. At the same time though, the mohammedan assertions contain significant errors in their own attempted restatements of the earlier Judeo-Christian doctrines, hence their characterization as a heresy.
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You misunderstand me... I don't HOPE he will be the next Pope, I just strongly BELIEVE he will be the next Pope.
I agree completely with your assesment of him. I believe he will do everything he can to unite the Roman Catholic Church with Islam as one religion, under his (or a future Pope's) control.
With 2 billion adherants, that church would weild enormous secular, geo-political power.
In addition, my neighbor (a very devout Christian) lived in Turkey for 3 years as a teenager (his father was a career military officer, stationed near Izmir at the time). My neighbor cannot say enough good things about Turkey or the Turks, and he still cooks his rice with pine nuts.
Finally, a son of an elder in my church has committed his life to spreading the gospel to Turkey. He loves Turkey and the Turks, has lived there for most of his adult life, and talks highly about them.
I say this because I think that my experiences are common—Americans who have actual knowledge or immediate second-hand knowledge of Turkey or Turks understand that the Turks as a whole are great people (every country has its share of idiots).
And what is this nonsense about a complete justification of the Crusades. Heck, even one with slight knowledge of the history of the Crusades knows about the Fourth Crusade.
Actually, dialogue with Turkish and more generally Turkic Islam is probably the most promising path to take. There is a whole band of ethnically Turkish Islam across central Asia, and on the whole it is far more open, moderate, and spiritually rather than politically oriented than any contemporary Arab Islam. Your quotes all come from Arab Wahhabists or Khomenei-ized Shia. But the majority of Muslims are neither Arab nor Persian, and their Islam is often very different.
And many of them hate the Wahhabist Arabs with a passion. I mean, how would you like it if some fringe fundamentalist Christian sect came to your town and starting dynamiting your cemeteries and teaching your children to despise your whole way of life?
I wish it was a band of lunatics.I was shockingly introduced to Islamic "culture" in basic training at Lackland AFB in the 70s.The Muslim world view impacted me as an USAF military member negatively, on three,specific, personally important occasions.I "got over it" in the interest of my sworn duty to my country.I was culturally trained to tollerance,as are most citizens of the USA.
I was NOT trained to revere ignorance nor stupidity.I will not allow ignorant segments of humanity to attempt to destroy my society.
I have paid my "dues" to my country. I am now free to concentrate on my "dues" to my family.Threats to "America" I take very, very personally.Damage to "America" is done to me, personally.
I have never been known for my compassion.My integrity is rarely questioned.Life is what I live.I do not consider it a game.I am not a "player". I WILL fight for my life, my child and my country.Hatred is a vice I have fought against my entire life.I now must accept it as a threat to my continued existance.It comes from Islam.
I will not bring a knife to a gunfight.I am but one insignificant hair on the sleeping lion who has been rudely awakened.God help us all.
While I disagree that Europe is indispensable to Christianity, I submit that Christianity is indispensable to Europe, and, of course, America. Without the Faith, Europe is dead.
And he's right about the Mohammedeans as well, for that matter.
How on earth can these two religions be synthesized without compromising basic tenets of Christianity?
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