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To: TomB
Nice Limbaughesque soundbite but it isn't so. There's a difference between wealthy and wealthy who are actually adding to the economy.

There are also wealthy who do stupid things like all those VC's who forgot about the need for revenues and profit during the so-called ".COM boom" of the 90's. Big help, they were!

If the wealth isn't used, isn't pro-actively invested, is badly invested, is badly managed, leads to unemployment, disrupts an industry... this might be adding to overall economic activity but isn't necessarily leading to further wealth creation or ensuring an vibrant economy. Further, you're wrong to dismiss the idea that outside influences (9/11 depressing travel, for example) can impact an economy adversely irrespective of what the wealthy alone are doing. In fact, in the airline case, if they'd done a better job (proper cockpit doors) they'd not have allowed the circumstance which hurt the economy to begin with. Realistically speaking, the government couldn't have really acted any more effectively (you either have or don't have the human intel) but the airlines sure could have.

An economy is vibrant when there's a good match between the geo-political and economic opportunities made possible by government--through tax dollars--(i.e. a war or post war economy, getting tarifs lifted, NAFTA) and private wealth's (hopefully) wise investment.

24 posted on 04/15/2002 5:57:07 AM PDT by newzjunkey
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To: newzjunkey
If the wealth isn't used, isn't pro-actively invested, is badly invested, is badly managed, leads to unemployment, disrupts an industry... this might be adding to overall economic activity but isn't necessarily leading to further wealth creation or ensuring an vibrant economy.

Are you suggesting that, as a whole, government can invest and manage wealth more wisely than private enterprise?

25 posted on 04/15/2002 6:00:17 AM PDT by NittanyLion
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To: newzjunkey
There's a difference between wealthy and wealthy who are actually adding to the economy.

That may be correct. It is also irrelevent. What the "wealthy" do with their money is their business.

It is their money.

26 posted on 04/15/2002 6:03:15 AM PDT by Skooz
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To: newzjunkey
You seem to have a distorted view of "the rich". You seem to think that they are all Kennedys who inherited their money. But the fact of the matter is that over 80% of millionaires are first generation, meaning, they made their own money, which invalidates your entire argument.

An excerpt from the book, The Millionaire Next Door:

PORTRAIT Of A MILLIONAIRE

Who is the prototypical American millionaire? What would he tell you about himself?(*)

    * I am a fifty-seven-year-old male, married with three children. About 70 percent of us earn 80 percent or more of our household's income.

    * About one in five of us is retired. About two-thirds of us who are working are self-employed. Interestingly, self-employed people make up less than 20 percent of the workers in America but account for two-thirds of the millionaires. Also, three out of four of us who are self-employed consider ourselves to be entrepreneurs. Most of the others are self-employed professionals, such as doctors and accountants.

    * Many of the types of businesses we are in could be classified as dullnormal. We are welding contractors, auctioneers, rice farmers, owners of mobile-home parks, pest controllers, coin and stamp dealers, and paving contractors.

    * About half of our wives do not work outside the home. The number-one occupation for those wives who do work is teacher.

    * Our household's total annual realized (taxable) income is $131,000 (median, or 50th percentile), while our average income is $247,000. Note that those of us who have incomes in the $500,000 to $999,999 category (8 percent) and the $1 million or more category (5 percent) skew the average upward.

    * We have an average household net worth of $3.7 million. Of course, some of our cohorts have accumulated much more. Nearly 6 percent have a net worth of over $10 million. Again, these people skew our average upward. The typical (median, or 50th percentile) millionaire household has a net worth of $1.6 million.

    * On average, our total annual realized income is less than 7 percent of our wealth. In other words, we live on less than 7 percent of our wealth.

    * Most of us (97 percent) are homeowners. We live in homes currently valued at an average of $320,000. About half of us have occupied the same home for more than twenty years. Thus, we have enjoyed significant increases in the value of our homes.

    * Most of us have never felt at a disadvantage because we did not receive any inheritance. About 80 percent of us are first-generation affluent.

    * We live well below our means. We wear inexpensive suits and drive American-made cars. Only a minority of us drive the current-model-year automobile. Only a minority ever lease our motor vehicles.

    * Most of our wives are planners and meticulous budgeters. In fact, only 18 percent of us disagreed with the statement "Charity begins at home." Most of us will tell you that our wives are a lot more conservative with money than we are.

    * We have a "go-to-hell fund." In other words, we have accumulated enough wealth to live without working for ten or more years. Thus, those of us with a net worth of $1.6 million could live comfortably for more than twelve years. Actually, we could live longer than that, since we save at least 15 percent of our earned income.

    * We have more than six and one-half times the level of wealth of our nonmillionaire neighbors, but, in our neighborhood, these nonmillionaires outnumber us better than three to one. Could it be that they have chosen to trade wealth for acquiring high-status material possessions?

    * As a group, we are fairly well educated. Only about one in five are not college graduates. Many of us hold advanced degrees. Eighteen percent have master's degrees, 8 percent law degrees, 6 percent medical degrees, and 6 percent Ph.D.s.

    * Only 17 percent of us or our spouses ever attended a private elementary or private high school. But 55 percent of our children are currently attending or have attended private schools.

    * As a group, we believe that education is extremely important for ourselves, our children, and our grandchildren. We spend heavily for the educations of our offspring.

    * About two-thirds of us work between forty-five and fifty-five hours per week.

    * We are fastidious investors. On average, we invest nearly 20 percent of our household realized income each year. Most of us invest at least 15 percent. Seventy-nine percent of us have at least one account with a brokerage company. But we make our own investment decisions.

    * We hold nearly 20 percent of our household's wealth in transaction securities such as publicly traded stocks and mutual funds. But we rarely sell our equity investments. We hold even more in our pension plans. On average, 21 percent of our household's wealth is in our private businesses.

    * As a group, we feel that our daughters are financially handicapped in comparison to our sons. Men seem to make much more money even within the same occupational categories. That is why most of us would not hesitate to share some of our wealth with our daughters. Our sons, and men in general, have the deck of economic cards stacked in their favor. They should not need subsidies from their parents.

    * What would be the ideal occupations for our sons and daughters? There are about 3.5 millionaire households like ours. Our numbers are growing much faster than the general population. Our kids should consider providing affluent people with some valuable service. Overall, our most trusted financial advisors are our accountants. Our attorneys are also very important. So we recommend accounting and law to our children. Tax advisors and estate-planning experts will be in big demand over the next fifteen years.

    * I am a tightwad. That's one of the main reasons I completed a long questionnaire for a crispy $1 bill. Why else would I spend two or three hours being personally interviewed by these authors? They paid me $100, $200, or $250. Oh, they made me another offer--to donate in my name the money I earned for my interview to my favorite charity. But I told them, "I am my favorite charity."


28 posted on 04/15/2002 6:07:13 AM PDT by TomB
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To: newzjunkey
What right does Person A have to appropriate Person B's money? If you can explain how that is moral, you stand a chance of changing my mind.

Is there any chance of getting this question answered?

34 posted on 04/15/2002 6:17:49 AM PDT by NittanyLion
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To: newzjunkey
In fact, in the airline case, if they'd done a better job (proper cockpit doors) they'd not have allowed the circumstance which hurt the economy to begin with. Realistically speaking, the government couldn't have really acted any more effectively (you either have or don't have the human intel) but the airlines sure could have.

Somehow I missed this little gem. Unfortunately, the cockpit doors could have been as big as a bank vault's, and it wouldn't have mattered. The airline industry, in conjuntion with the FAA, had a policy in place prior to 9-11 to negotiate and acquiesce to the demands of hijackers. Strengthened cockpit doors would not have helped because they were opened voluntarily.

42 posted on 04/15/2002 6:55:43 AM PDT by TomB
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To: newzjunkey
Would it be Ok if a man made a million dollars and then took it all as cash, and put a flame to it?
58 posted on 04/15/2002 8:14:34 AM PDT by Protagoras
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To: newzjunkey
"There's a difference between wealthy and wealthy who are actually adding to the economy."

Wealthy who are not adding to the economy? Rubbish.

Name one.

78 posted on 04/15/2002 9:17:17 AM PDT by Tauzero
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