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To: Sir Gawain
I hate Arafat and the Islamic terror. I also support Israel, and think it is more democratic and civilized than all the Arab countries combined. However, I have some observation that I would like you to reflect on:

1) Israel built settlements in the mist of savages and expected these nut cases to accept it. Every single American President, UN, and all the European leaders think it is illegal, and MUST be dismantled.

2)For decades, the Israelis disregarded the views of the entire world, and continued to build more settlements, thus rubbing more salt into these nut cases wounds. Does that make sense? Do you think any Israeli government should be allowed to be above the laws?

3) Is disregarding UN & US & European leaders wishes and orders, not to mention simple common sense is helping Israel public relation or reputation.

4)The terrorists have absolutely no ground to justify their killer approach to their grievance. However, as a start, the militant Israelis and their foaming at the mouth American supporters must realize that force is causing more hate in the Palestinians youth, and encouraging Islamists to take advantage of the situation. The entire region is about to be engulfed in HOLY WAR?

5)Sharon is the wrong leader for Israel at this point. He must allow Perez to take control and start peace talk with the raghead,(since Israel and the US are too chicken to kill Arafat). Remember most of the deadly violence of late did not exist before Sharon took office?

Again, I don’t want to keep apologizing or explaining my support for Israel in fear of the hate response that I typically get by pointing out the obvious to the blinds. If you create a new generation of kids who hate you, you will have decades of hate before the new generation can trust you!

10 posted on 04/09/2002 8:25:50 AM PDT by philosofy123
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To: philosofy123
Do you think any Israeli government should be allowed to be above the laws?

UN resolutions are not laws.
In fact, any "law" passed by the UN is an illegal law and should not be obeyed.

11 posted on 04/09/2002 8:28:58 AM PDT by ppaul
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To: philosofy123
1) Israel built settlements in the mist of savages and expected these nut cases to accept it. Every single American President, UN, and all the European leaders think it is illegal, and MUST be dismantled.

These settlements are on Israeli land, paid for in full by Israeli blood, around cities that belonged to Jews before there were Muslims. If anybody is illegally occupying territory they shouldn't be on, it's the conglomeration of Muslims from all over Arabia who have not one ounce of claim to that territory. The Arabs went to war and they lost. Israel IS the territories.

13 posted on 04/09/2002 8:40:09 AM PDT by Nix 2
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To: philosofy123
Do you think any Israeli government should be allowed to be above the laws?

What laws?

14 posted on 04/09/2002 8:40:47 AM PDT by lepton
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To: philosofy123
Remember most of the deadly violence of late did not exist before Sharon took office?

Uh, no, I don't "remember" any such thing, because it isn't true. Sharon, in fact, was elected as a reaction to palestinian terrorism that predates his administration.

There's more, much more, to disagree with in your post, but I should get back to work.

16 posted on 04/09/2002 8:50:23 AM PDT by borkrules
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To: philosofy123
3) Is disregarding UN & US & European leaders wishes and orders, not to mention simple common sense is helping Israel public relation or reputation.

That isn't their first battle. Surviving is. People can WALK across Israel proper in two hours. A DMZ is wider than Israel. For Israel to be safe, IT needs a buffer area, regardless of everything else. Israel's primary offense is in existing. Now, as to the "disregarding wishes" why not apply the same to the Arabs?

4)The terrorists have absolutely no ground to justify their killer approach to their grievance. However, as a start, the militant Israelis and their foaming at the mouth American supporters must realize that force is causing more hate in the Palestinians youth, and encouraging Islamists to take advantage of the situation. The entire region is about to be engulfed in HOLY WAR?

More, hardly. You are aware that the attacks on Israel have been going on for quite some time, and only got WORSE when Israel acquiesced and offered them nearly all of their demands? Why did the the French have a murderous revolution when the century before had been the largest growth in general wealth and freedom in the nation's history? It's the taste of victory by virulent hatred - not the violence - that causes the anger. Your argument is like blaming knowing the police will arrest you for shooting at the neighbor's kids.

5)Sharon is the wrong leader for Israel at this point. He must allow Perez to take control and start peace talk with the raghead,(since Israel and the US are too chicken to kill Arafat). Remember most of the deadly violence of late did not exist before Sharon took office?

Think again. The latest round of violence began when the Palestinians were offered nearly all of what they asked - and Arafat rejected it.

18 posted on 04/09/2002 8:52:27 AM PDT by lepton
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To: philosofy123
History lesson -- The prime minister could use a primer on the Middle East

Couterarguments to similar arguments to yours.

30 posted on 04/09/2002 10:17:04 AM PDT by lepton
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To: philosofy123
" If you create a new generation of kids who hate you, you will have decades of hate before the new generation can trust you!"

Of course the Israelis aren't creating a new generation of hate-filled Palestinians. The responsibility lies at the feet of mullahs, clerics, dictators, their respective propoganda organs and parents who teach their children the glories of martyrdom.

Palestinians have historically been better-treated in Israel than they have in the Arab nations in the region. Never underestimate ingratitude. It can blossom into murder.

43 posted on 04/09/2002 12:08:24 PM PDT by Chunga
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To: philosofy123
Oderint, dum metuant!
49 posted on 04/09/2002 12:24:18 PM PDT by yianni
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To: philosofy123
"1) Israel built settlements in the mist of savages and expected these nut cases to accept it. Every single American President, UN, and all the European leaders think it is illegal, and MUST be dismantled."

Settlement of the occupied terriotories began after the 1967 war. Since that time, the only US president who considered the settlements illegal was Jimmy Carter. Neither Johnson nor Nixon opposed them and, in fact, favored using them as bargaining chips in a negotiated peace process. Even UN resolution 242, authored principally by Arthur Goldberg, adopted this concept. During both the Reagan administrations, official State Department policy was that the settlements were perfectly lawful. Even Clinton's proposals for the 2000 Barak/Arafat peace talks included provisions for continuing Israeli settlements beyong the "Green Line."

As usual, you don't know what you are talking about.

69 posted on 04/09/2002 1:21:53 PM PDT by Bonaparte
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To: philosofy123
"1) Israel built settlements in the mist of savages and expected these nut cases to accept it. Every single American President, UN, and all the European leaders think it is illegal, and MUST be dismantled. "

So according to your logic, we should give Texas, Arizona, New Mexico and California back to Mexico. And since we were not "fair" Russia should get Alaska back. And the Indians (Native Americans for those of you in Rio Linda or West Palm Beach) should get all of the Louisiana Purchase, Florida, and Canada back. Hmmm, guess that gets us back to the original 13 colonies which we won from the British, and since our founding fathers used violence to get that territory, we should give those back to the Brits. You're right, the hell with it. Conquering nations should give back all of their territory back after each war.

And while we're at it, that means that Palestine should be given back to the Roman Empire, er Italy. This kind of retarded logic is what created political correctness and supports the dialectic of the communist mind. Might I suggest that this board get over it's anti-Semitic rants, and remember we are at war also. Without Israel in our corner, we will lose. Because the EU, as usual, is sitting on it's hands (sans England), waiting on us to do the dirty work.
97 posted on 04/09/2002 8:34:42 PM PDT by Nuke'm Glowing
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To: philosofy123
philosofy123: I love da Jooos, but...
105 posted on 04/10/2002 5:31:06 AM PDT by metesky
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