Posted on 04/01/2002 7:31:34 AM PST by ElisabethInCincy
Please show me just one place in the Bible where the entire Hebrew race and the Israelites are refered to as Jews. You're bluffing, and I'm calling!
Sure you are.
If you had read the next sentence in my post before blurting out a response, you would have had the answer.
So I'll repeat it for you;
In the Gospels "Jews" is the usual term used for Israelites and descendants of Abraham.
To clarify that for you...according the New Testament, Jews, Israelites and the Hebrew race mean the same thing.
So once again, here is a conversation with Jesus where the term Jews is used for the descendants of Abraham; John 8:52 Then said the Jews unto him, Now we know that thou hast a devil. Abraham is dead, and the prophets; and thou sayest, If a man keep my saying, he shall never taste of death.
John 8:53
Art thou greater than our father Abraham, which is dead? and the prophets are dead: whom makest thou thyself? John 8:56
Your father Abraham rejoiced to see my day: and he saw it, and was glad. John 8:57
Then said the Jews unto him, Thou art not yet fifty years old, and hast thou seen Abraham?
Romans 3:1
What advantage then hath the Jew? or what profit is there of circumcision?
They have done well for themselves as a country economically and militarily.
They have an right, under international law to protect their homeland from armed subjugation.
The entity that created their country now has forsaken Israel, not on moral grounds, but on purely third world political block voting.
The bottom line is the Israel is the little guy standing up for themselves. Americans love the underdog.
Your bluffing again, Jorge. Show me just ONE place in the New Testament where Jews, Israelites and the Hebrew race mean the same thing. No bluffing is allowed.
That is the most adolescent attempt to make a correlation I've seen in years.
Well it's Jesus, the disciples and the NT writers who are making the correlation not me.
I'm just quoting what they say.
They clearly use the term "Jews" to mean the Israelites, the Hebrew race and the descendants of Abraham.
You either believe them or you don't.
I for one believe them.
Are you trying to pass yourself off as a Biblical scholar with that sense of logic? Please, Go ahead and actually READ my profile and learn that.
Right. And maybe by the time I finish your silly reading assignment, I won't remember that you had no real answers to my challenges. LOL.
And I never claimed to be a Biblical scholar, nor do I need to be to refute your flimsy arguments.
All it took was 5 minutes of research to find scriptures proving the Bible refers to Isrealites, Hebrews and the children of Abraham, all as Jews.
I notice you haven't even attempted to address those scriptures.
Your bluffing again, Jorge. Show me just ONE place in the New Testament where Jews, Israelites and the Hebrew race mean the same thing. No bluffing is allowed.
I've posted several passages, MORE THAN ONCE for all to see.
Yet you refuse acknowledge, let alone address them.
You just keep parroting "bluffing! bluffing!" over and over again. lol
Polly want a cracker?
>"Because the Jews are the chosen people of my God"
I stated in effect, no, it is Israelites who are the Chosen People of God, and while Jews are Israelites, not all Israelites are Jews. But all Israelites are still the "chosen people" and have the same promises.
Then I referred you to my Profile, which you clearly have not read, and which you have made no attempt to refute. Does that fairly state where we are?
"Because the Jews are the chosen people of my God"
Actually no, that was another poster.
I stated in effect, no, it is Israelites who are the Chosen People of God, and while Jews are Israelites, not all Israelites are Jews. But all Israelites are still the "chosen people" and have the same promises.
No, the statement I was responding to simply said (paraphrased)* where does it say that*?
So I posted all those scriptures where God refers to them as His choosen people.
You then claimed that because the term Jew was not used in the passages that therefore it didn't mean the Jews, but the Israelites.
I then quoted New Testament scriptures in which the Hebrew race, the Israelites and descendants of Abraham are all refered to a Jews.
And stated that I believe the New Testament.
Then I referred you to my Profile, which you clearly have not read, and which you have made no attempt to refute.
Why should I read (let alone refute) your "Profile"?
I'm addressing what you said in your post, on this message board. Not your Profile.
I'm not interested in debating some reading assignment you decide to hand out.
How silly. Why don't you go and read the entire New Testament until you find the scriptures that support my point...and then "refute" them for me.
Does that fairly state where we are?
Yes. LOL
Not Ames! Jonathon Pollard!!!! While Pollard was bad, and I hope that he does spend the rest of his life in prison, what he did doesn't hold a candle to what Ames did!
Mark
read and learn, misinformation will continue to be a part of your life, and you will never progress beyond self-serving myths and supersitions.
John 8:52
Then said the Jews unto him, Now we know that thou hast a devil. Abraham is dead, and the prophets; and thou sayest, If a man keep my saying, he shall never taste of death.
John 8:53
Art thou greater than our father Abraham, which is dead? and the prophets are dead: whom makest thou thyself?
John 8:56
Your father Abraham rejoiced to see my day: and he saw it, and was glad.
John 8:57
Then said the Jews unto him, Thou art not yet fifty years old, and hast thou seen Abraham?
Romans 3:1
What advantage then hath the Jew? or what profit is there of circumcision? 
Hmmm. That's very interesting. Matthew 1 of course gives the lineage of Jesus via his Mothers line. But since you do not accept God as his Father then you do not accept that lineage from David.
I had the impression that contemporary "Jewishness" was defined as following the maternal line. Gotta think about that one. -ggg- I've been down this road before but am coming up blank. What am I missing here?
I grew up with a very close friend who was Jewish. We were buddies and nothing else mattered. They made he desert bloom and have always acted with a certain "nobles oblige" that the Ayrubs could never attain.
I think the simple answer to this question is that most (sadly not all!) of the people on this forum are people of REASON, and of INTEGRITY, and of PRINCIPLES. Any person who possesses these characteristics cannot but support Israel, just as they cannot but support the United States.
In other words, the reason most here support Israel is because most here are NOT neo-Marxist/Socialist/Communist/Leftist worms who engage in moral equivilency, revisionist history, and/or utopian wishful thinking!
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