NO SIGNS OF ENGINE FAILURE!

FOX News

[X-Servative]

At the NTSB press conference, they just stated that both engines appear to be intact and that there are no signs of engine failure, according to George Black, NTSB Boardmember.

[JMJ333]

Did you listen to Glenn Beck today? He played a tape of Oliver North testifying in front of a democratic congress back in 1987, that Osama Bin Laden had one goal and that was to take down the United States Government and that he should be eliminated. The democrats laughed and ridiculed him [no surprise there]. Ollie called this one...

[fourdeuce82d]

Now that it appears that there will be no easy explanation for this crash they'll keep low until the next terrorist attack.

Nope. Not laying low at all. Wrong again.

At which time they'll once again take upon themselves to tell us all how stupid and hysterical we are

Hell, I'll tell you all how stupid and hysterical you are right now- like this: You are very stupid and hysterical. Your stupidity & hysteria has nothing to do with whether or not this was a terrorist attack, or whether you think it was a terrorist attack- rather, it is made manifest by the reasons the TFB (Tin-Foil-Brigade) give for their conclusion, , and the temper tantrums you throw when your are told the facts aren't in yet.

while they make their silly and assinine jokes. It's like some of them are paid by the gov't to push the party line.

Nope- just irritated by hysteria and sloppy thinking. For example, one of your ilk suggested this was terrorism because "Planes don't crash into Queens!" (exclamation point in the original) That is hysterical, and stupid.

[MindBender26]

> When the tail falls off it disrupts the electronic controls of the plane and the pilot must accelerate speed in order to gain control. He may have done that which caused the engine to torque and break away, or the engine may have also been tampered with in some way causing it to break away when the plane was rattling. Where did you get this conglamoration of technical words. Sorry, but this is aeronautical BS.

Tail is a "Buck Rogers. Space Cadet" word.

The "tail," the aft control serfaces of aircraft and attaching stabelizers are two different items, each of two main parts. If Vertical Stableizer is lost, it takes rudder with it. This results in some loss of directional control, but A/C can be flown and controlled to safe landing by use of ailerons and asymetrical thrust in engines. Not fun but can easilly be done.) The video you see from Coast Guard of them lifting piece of A/C with "AA" on it is vertical stabelizer.

If horizontal stableizer is lost and/or attached elevators are shed, all control is lost, because of the needed effect of horiz stab in all realms of flight.

Comments about electronic controls and "accelerate speed" are complete BS. Nothing personal, but there are a hundred reasons why A/C could crash. None of them are as described in your post.

Yes AB300 is fly-by-wire. So are most commercial A/C, and all military A/C in production.

[Sparky760]

Gremlins perhaps?

All kidding aside, I can't help but keep thinking of those poor people and the horrific fright they had to have felt in thier last moments. God bless them all.

[EggsAckley]

So the question is: has every Arab airport worker been hauled in today

Better yet, why weren't they hauled in YESTERDAY!

[Dan Day]

Thank you, very well said. I was going to post something similar myself, but you've done it better than I could.

I'm getting pretty tired of being called a "sheeple" who will "swallow any lie the government tells", just because I:

1. Refuse to immediately agree that it *must* be terrorism at work before any real evidence is available, and

2. Point out that several kinds of accidents could cause a crash like this (not all accidents are created equal, many result in bizarre outcomes -- e.g. the Hawaii flight where the whole top of the plane came off).

3. Point out flaws in some of the wilder "SABOTAGE!!" theories that have been breathlessly put forth here.

[5by5]

If the tail fell off the high speed upset could cause the engines to seperate. In piston aircraft, losing a prop blade can cause the engine to fall off because of the severe inbalance. The pitch up from the loss of the engine can then cause the wings or the tail to break.

My point is that catastrophic failure in one area can lead to more structural failures elsewhere. So it's not necessarily an unlikely coincidence that the tail and the engine all fell off at the same time but rather cause and effect.

[eno_]

Bzzzt. Thank you for playing, but you are the weakest link. The theorists here on FR have been more right than, for example, George Pitaki, who made a fool of himself saying the pilot "dumped fuel" when not only did he not know this to be the case, it turned out to have been impossible.

Governors, the FBI, and other officials are lying to our faces. Posters come on here and start belittling people for coming to their own conclusions. Who says Egpyt Air 900 was "thrust reversers" now that it is known tha Al Quaida terrorists invaded cockpits and purposely crashed planes? How soon will it become known that TWA 800 was shot down? And now that it is known both engines of this plane came down intact, who among the "lets calm down it was mechanical" crowd is man enough to admit they were wrong?

[Bush2000]

Oh, great. the TWA stinger missile guy is back again? LOL.

[NixNatAVanG InDaBurgh]

That's right. Silly you. And they would have continued if they could have given any...any plausibility to the way they first outlined it.
Guess what. Fox just reported there WAS a warning from North Africa, but our powers that be did not consider it plausible. Oh yeah. Silly, silly you.
Since I seem to be the focus of all the anti-tinfoil BS, I'd like to ask why you guys just can't admit you were wrong without attacking those of us who were right to question the very questionable pablum?

[Mr. Jeeves]

Well, if the vertical stabilizer WAS tampered with, it should be easy to prove, since it came down intact and with half of each sheared off bolt presumably still in place.

[Dan Day]

Hell, I'll tell you all how stupid and hysterical you are right now- like this: You are very stupid and hysterical. Your stupidity & hysteria has nothing to do with whether or not this was a terrorist attack, or whether you think it was a terrorist attack- rather, it is made manifest by the reasons the TFB (Tin-Foil-Brigade) give for their conclusion, , and the temper tantrums you throw when your are told the facts aren't in yet.

...and the snotty attacks they make on the folks who dare point out that mechanical failures can cause all sorts of funny-looking crashes, so that must still be considered a possibility until more evidence is in.

Contrary to the accusations of the tinfoil-hat brigage, I have yet to see a single Freeper say, "it was clearly an accident, no chance of sabotage, end of story". On the flip side, I've seen *dozens* of Freepers firmly conclude that it was sabotage, period, anyone who disagrees must be an idiot sheeple, blah blah blah.

[EggsAckley]

As for me, I think I'll wait for the final report

If you're willing to wait for the final report,
then why hang around here criticizing people who want to discuss it?

[altayann]

You're being too paranoid. Government officials are people, and sometimes people like to hear only what they want to hear.

And trust me, nobody really wants to hear that this wasn't an accident. And it wouldn't be the first time someone in the Bush administration tried reassuring the nation before all the facts were in.

Birds, mechanical failure, anthrax from a stream: it's all the same, really.

[cmsgop]

FROM AIRLINERS.NET

Username: xxxxxx Posted 2001-11-12 21:25:06 and read 2934 times.

I was one of the agents working flt587 today..and as soon as i heard the news my heart dropped to my feet.

I was just taking my break at about 915am when we got a call into the office telling us 587 went down...only a few minutes after we worked the flight..

My hands are still shaking as I type and am home now. to thnk that all those people we boarded and said farewell to are now gone.....I can still remember a mother travelling with her twin boys...another pregnant lady with a small child....a family of six going to a wedding....all those smilling faces so happy to travel and see their loved ones......I cant understand why.....I was on board that aircraft this morning little did I know the ill ending it would soon encounter..I even spoke to one flight atten. who told me she didn't feel well and that she thought about calling in sick, but later decided that she needed the hours.......

Her smiling face still lingers in my mind.... before I got off the a/c when I went to see if we were ready to board I was chatting with the rest of the crew and joking about not having enough soda or something like that.....

I can still see them chatting and giggling in the galley...my god why all this grief again.........this time it hit me right in the face..........why god.........why

I Took Out The Name of the Poster. You Can Check if you want to

[Rokke]

That is my personal theory. Note: I emphasis theory, and will wait patiently for the NTSB report which will immediately be dismissed as LIES by the entire tinfoil crowd regardless of what it says.

[Dan Day]

Well, if the vertical stabilizer WAS tampered with, it should be easy to prove, since it came down intact and with half of each sheared off bolt presumably still in place.

Sure. That's why I'm waiting for more evidence to be gathered. I'll gladly conclude that it was sabotage if any evidence of sabotage actually arises.

But until then, it only makes sense to say, "this was a strange crash, but strange doesn't automatically equal 'could only be sabotage'". Especially when mechanical failures can cause all sorts of bizarre things to happen.

Nothing clearly points one way or the other right now. We're still at the, "huh?" stage.