Posted on 10/23/2001 8:39:39 AM PDT by spycatcher
Pre-Islamic Arabia's religion was one of superstition. Belief in jinns (genies), curse casting, magic stones, totems was the norm - and it was against this background that Allah arose. Although the Quran is claimed to be a heavenly writing with no earthly source, evidence of these very sorts of cultural influence is found in such places as Suras 55, 72, 113 and 114.
Animism, the belief that spirits inhabit rocks, trees and other elements was also very commonplace. Some of these stones were venerated and used as a focal point for the worship of a particular tribal god. No surprise, Muhammad's family had just such a stone for their own tribe - a black stone, in fact, that they kept at the Kabah (where the tribal idols were set up). The pagan rites of bowing toward Mecca, making a pilgrimage to the Kabah, running around it seven times, kissing it, then running to the river to throw stones at the devil all found there way into Islamic practice.
The final piece of the puzzle was in found in the religion of the Sabeans, an astral religion that worshipped the moon god and planned their religious rites around the lunar calendar. One such rite was fasting from crescent moon to crescent moon, a practice which would also be adopted by Muhammad.
If these things were not present before Muhammad received them from Allah (who himself is the moon god of Muhammad's tribe), why did Muhammad not have to explain what those words meant in the Quran? How would people have known who Allah was? ( or: what a jinn was? what the Kabah was? what the word Islam meant? etc.). Even the word "Islam" which many believe to mean "submission" was not an original word. In Arabic it was a secular term that denoted the strength and bravery of a desert warrior (a definition that accurately reflects the war-like tribes that founded Islam with bloodshed).
The Moon God
"Allah" is from the compound Arabic word "al-ilah" or in english "the god". Allah was known before Muhammad's time without a doubt. His name has been found in pre-islamic writings and other archeological finds. At the Kabah in Mecca over 350 gods were worshipped, but it was built especially for the chief deity - the moon god. Allah was the personal title of the moon god. Allah was married to the sun goddess. They produced three daughters, whose worship Muhammad would later make the mistake of condoning. The crescent moon symbol of Arabia came from this god.
Muhammad's family revered this particular god, and it is this idol that Muhammad declared to be the only true god. So, Allah - far from being the revealed God of the Bible as Muhammad would have us believe - is nothing more than an amplified pagan idol. Muhammad did not re-make the pagan god, he simply removed the lower deities from the rites of worship. That is why he never had to explain who Allah was. By definition, an idol converted in the 7th century into a new god cannot be the sama God revealed thousands of years earlier to Biblical prophets!
Offering the delusion of dissidents as proof of the veracity of one's claims is no proof. One could say it is even less a point and more a refutation of itself... What do I offer as proof of my claims? Your question would probably be. Well, if taken literally, your statement would imply that only the most delusional would disagree with you, thereby leaving the merely delusional in complete agreement. Are you saying that people who see things the way you do are delusional? I really don't think you meant that, which demonstrates you aren't really thinking while you type, just spewing. Try again.
Notice he doesn't condone us slaughtering all the sinners ourselves like Allah does. He alone makes the judgement of when the sinner is beyond his grace. And that table is from the posted article not from my beliefs.
Hey what it if the Amish had a violent mafia wing whose goal was to eliminate all technology?? Now that would be scary -- bin Laden would even have to watch out! ;)
But alas, they're a peaceful people and America loves em. Now, back to my sourdough pretzels.
I never attempted to justify the crusades. Guess it's easier for you to put up a false argument when you can't refute a point.
Let's try it again. If Christians were allowed to legally proselytize in islamic occupied lands, initially, more people would be given the opportunity to exercise God-given free will , and ultimately, fewer people would be born into islam (read: satanic deception).
Looks like some (little g) god is afraid of the competition.
Therefore I assert that islamic religious beliefs are not as you suggest just "a geographic or familial accident", but is in reality, brainwashing by a psychotic demon.
OWK, you make a valid point; however, that certainly doesn't make Christianity the wrong one, does it? Wouldn't you agree that's is certainly possible that we will ultimately be judged by a soveriegn God? Whether or not I/you want to acknowledge it....it is possible, is it not? regardless of history's ebb and flow...or where we were born, etc
I did not suggest that others cannot and do not manage to overcome the religious indoctrination of their youth, On they contrary. I stated quite clearly that there are certainly exceptions.
My point was simply that the religious indoctrintation of one's youth, overwhelmingly determines the religious faith of one's adulthood.
This simple truth sure seems to make some people uneasy.
Very peculiar.
I didn't suggest that it did.
I simply suggested that as a rule, people are Christian because that is the faith they were indoctrinated into as children, and that as a rule, people are Islamic because that is the faith they are indoctrinated into as children.
A relatively simple point which others seem unwilling to accept.
You seem to be suffering some kind of cognitive disfunction.
At no time did I suggest that the Judeo-Christian god was "the moon god".
And this should be of significance to me because...?
This is the kind of silliness that makes it tough to take you folks seriously.
Doing the Lord's work is thankless, eh, OWK? LOL!
You certainly earn points for patience; you've certainly got more than I do, I can tell you that!
And my ultimate point was, that each and every religious community is convinced that their faith represents the truth. And each is equally convinced that all others are false. And that each is comprised of individuals who (by an overwhelming majority) acquired their faith as a consequence of the indoctrination they recieved in their youth.
And that the odds are that any member of a given religious community, would be every bit as convinced of the "truth" of a faith he now recognizes as false, if that had been the faith he was indoctrinated into as a child.
My comments have nothing to do with the objective truth or falsehood of any of these faiths. Simply an observation.
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