You seem to have ignored the point I was trying to make, I guess you were too busy calling me a shmuk.
You didn't respond to the fact that America withhelp information from Israel that it had promised in return for the waiver of Israels right to sell defence.
Second, lets not even bring up the Liberty, because everyone here basically talks out their as$ on that one. Israel didn't do it intentionally, multiple international commissions concluded that, leave your conspiracy theories for someone else.
I agree that Pollard is a traitor to America, however, the question was, why was he sentenced (and why was the sentenced changed at the last moment despite the plea bargain) so harshly in comparisson to other spies. If you don't think he was, just compare his sentence to those of communist spies.
I think it is to simple and childish to simply answer by saying, Israel owes its existence to America, America doesn't to Israel.
We all know America gets plenty from Israel for its 3 billion. Intelligence, a fortress in the middle east, a democratic ally, the attack on Saddams nuke plant in 1981 (how many American lives were saved by Saddam not being Nuclear in the Gulf War)... etc... especially considering what America gets for its money in other parts of the world.
and then their is that whole 'ideology' issue as well, although for some of you that stopped being important a long time ago.
I agree that Israel would treat spies harshly too, but i'm just saying that in past incidents (like when Americans were caught spying in Israel) things were settled behind the scenes (kind of like 'out of court'). I'm just saying this should have been no different.
Don't expect to get Pollard out. He is an American spy. Any problems about the U.S. not releasing data should have been handled diplomatically, not by a PAID spy.
BTW, I support Israel as a Christian, I just can't stand Benedict Arnolds who sell out their country for money.
Torpedo hole as seen from drydock in Malta
This web site is dedicated to the memory of thirty-four fine young men
who gave their lives on June 8, 1967, defending the USS Liberty
against a sustained air and sea attack by the armed forces of the State of Israel
During the Six Day War between Israel and the Arab States, the American intelligence ship USS Liberty was attacked for 75 minutes in international waters by Israeli aircraft and motor torpedo boats. Thirty-four men died and 171 were wounded. The attack has been a matter of controversy ever since. Survivors and many key government officials including Secretary of State Dean Rusk and former JCS Chairman Admiral Thomas Moorer say it was no accident. Israel and its supporters insist it was a "tragic case of misidentification" and charge that the survivors are either lying or too emotionally involved to see the truth.
Israel claims they mistook our ship for the out-of-service Egyptian horse carrier El Quseir and that we brought the attack upon ourselves by operating in a war zone without displaying a flag. Not so. We were in international waters, far from any fighting, and flew a bright, clean, new American flag. The flag we flew is on display at the National Cryptologic Museum, Fort Meade, Maryland and can be seen there, or in the USS Liberty Images Archive.
Our commanding officer, Captain William Loren McGonagle, received the Congressional Medal of Honor for conspicuous gallantry and intrepedity at the risk of his life above and beyond the call of duty during the attack. The Congressional Medal of Honor is the highest award our country can bestow. To avoid embarrassing our attackers, Captain McGonagle's Medal of Honor was presented in a quiet ceremony in the Washington Navy Yard instead of in the White House by the President as is customary.
The USS Liberty Web Page presents part of the story along with some historical information and links to other sources.
More about the USS Liberty.
You didn't respond to the fact that America withheld information from Israel that it had promised in return for the waiver of Israels right to sell defence. The 'fact' is irrelevent to Pollard's case. (But you have yet to provide the evidence or more importantly, a copy of the text of the alleged 'promise,' so it is hardly a 'fact.')
Here is why it is irrelevent: Pollard was not in a position to determine what the US was and was not obligated to do for Israel. Nor was he in a position to know how the information he sold was going to be used, or to whom it would be sold. Since he was not in a position to know any of these things, nor in a position of authority where he was empowered to make decisions on use of that information, he had no business appointing himself to be 'judge and jury.'
The next point is this: Pollard was a US citizen. If he holds a loyalty to Israel, he shouldn't have worked for the US or accepted a position in which his loyalties would be in conflict. He should have left the US and taken up residency in Israel, where he could in good faith swear loyalty to Israel.
But he didn't. He signed a contract and swore an oath in order to get his job with the USN. That oath was NOT to 'protect and serve Israel.'
Oaths are serious things- they are to be not to be broken. They don't have escape clauses; you are basically staking your entire being, your 'sacred honor,' to a cause by taking an oath before God. To preserve the sanctity of oaths, oath-breaking must be treated with utmost severity. Violating an oath is a voluntary act, as is taking an oath; there is never an excuse for those who break an oath.
Aside from the obvious immorality of betraying a free and trusting country, a country he had the choice of leaving, for the sake of another, and lying all along about where his loyalties were invested- the idea that he was doing something 'morally right' for the sake of a 'betrayed' Israel is totally ridiculous since he was paid (or bribed) to do it. He accepted money for the information he sold. If it was a great moral dilemma, he would have avoided accepting payment so as to keep what little integrity he had.
Some of the information Pollard sold to Israel had NOTHING to do with protecting Israel; some was the position of US ships. He may as well have threatened to murder every American on those ships, because he was certainly putting them in a position to be killed. He sold information on which USSR locations were our targets; he compromised US agents, endangering their lives. What he had was information that could be resold to any other nation and certainly used against us. His recourse if he really was in moral crisis was to look to law for a solution to his dilemma, or to quit as a matter of conscience if he could no longer work in good faith for the US.
Pollard willfully betrayed every sailor, soldier, and citizen of this country, put our security up for sale, and our lives as well. He did so knowing what he was doing, knowing the penalties for doing so, and has no reason to expect us to give him quarter. He recieved a light sentence. He should have been taken out and shot.
