Erdogan claims: Israel will target Turkey next

Israel National News ^ | 5/16/24 | Elad Benari

[Roman_War_Criminal]

Turkish President Recep Tayyip Erdogan claimed on Wednesday that Israel would "set its sights" on Turkey if it succeeded in defeating Hamas in the Gaza Strip, AFP reported.

"Do not think that Israel will stop in Gaza," Erdogan told his party lawmakers in the parliament in the capital Ankara.

"Unless it's stopped... this rogue and terrorist state will set its sights on Anatolia sooner or later," he added, referring to the large Turkish peninsula also called Asia Minor that comprises more than half of Turkey's territory.

"We will continue to stand by Hamas, which fights for the independence of its own land and which defends Anatolia," stated Erdogan.

Erdogan has increased his verbal attacks on Israel since the start of the war in Gaza on October 7.

[Bullish]

BS from Satanic liars.

[woodpusher]

Palestine is the land of Muslims and has been the land of Muslims for millenia. The Balfour Declaration was a private letter from Lord Balfour to Lord Rothschild. d_G does not write international law. The land officially remains the unlawfully occupied territory if Palestine. If there is not such thing as Palestine, then the Balfour Declaration referred to nothing.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Balfour_Declaration

The BALFOUR DECLARATION of 1917

Foreign Office
November 2nd, 1917.

Dear Lord Rothschild,

I have much pleasure in conveying to you, on behalf of His Majesty’s Government, the following declaration of sympathy with Jewish Zionist aspirations which has been submitted to, and approved by, the Cabinet.

“His Majesty’s Government view with favour the establishment in Palestine of a national home for the Jewish people, and will use their best endeavours to facilitate the achievement of this object, it being clearly understood that nothing shall be done which may prejudice the civil and religious rights of existing non-Jewish communities in Palestine, or the rights and political status enjoyed by Jews in any other country”.

I should be grateful if you would bring this declaration to the knowledge of the Zionist Federation.

Yours sincerely,
/s/ Arthur James Balfour

[Bullish]

GET LOST!

[woodpusher]

Present day Israel is only a fraction of the originally mandated land for the nation of Israel. Nearby land surrounding Israel is unlawfully occupied by non-Jews.

Whatever law could you be talking about? Could you quote that law? Something can't be unlawful unless there is an applicable law.

[roadcat]

Palestine is the land of Muslims and has been the land of Muslims for millenia.

Lol! Hilarious! Millenia? The Jews have been there twice as long, more millennia, even before the pedophile Mohammed took a 9-year-old as his bride and founded Islam, and went on a killing spree. Your koran was fabricated hundreds of years after the New Testament was written. Jews have a historic claim to the land, long before any mooselimbs walked into the lands.

[roadcat]

Whatever law could you be talking about? Could you quote that law?

Right back at you. A declaration is not a law, and Israel was cheated out of the mandate, but created by war when the neighboring arabs invaded the newly created nation. Much of TransJordan was promised to Israel by the Balfour Declaration but usurped by the arabs. The war made Israel a legal nation, recognized under law.

[falcon99]

My mistake, you are correct. Should have said out of NATO and completely stop consideration of EU membership, though it has been stalled for a while anyway.

[Ultra Sonic 007]

Much of TransJordan was promised to Israel by the Balfour Declaration but usurped by the arabs.

I mean, it's not like the British talked out of both sides of their mouths when also promising the Arabs a state if they revolted against the Ottomans...oh wait.

(Their promises to the Arabs came before the Balfour Declaration, just for the record.)

The war made Israel a legal nation, recognized under law.

That is not how recognition of sovereignty works. (Also, just for the record, Israel actually didn't declare independence until after they were admitted to the UN.)

[Ultra Sonic 007]

Ignore the last line in parentheses for my prior post; I misread the year when looking up the dates in question. Israel’s admission to the UN was three days prior to the first anniversary of Israel’s declaration of independence. (Mea culpa.)

The overall point is unchanged: recognition of one’s sovereignty as a nation does not necessarily hold because of the outcome of a given war. The general criteria are: a settled population, a defined territory, a government, and the ability to enter into relations with other states.

(Somewhat ironic, given that much of the trouble in the Middle East is precisely over the question of what counts as a “settled population”.)

[woodpusher]

[roadcat #39] Present day Israel is only a fraction of the originally mandated land for the nation of Israel. Nearby land surrounding Israel is unlawfully occupied by non-Jews.

[woodpusher #44] Whatever law could you be talking about? Could you quote that law? Something can't be unlawful unless there is an applicable law.

[roadcat #46] Right back at you. A declaration is not a law, and Israel was cheated out of the mandate, but created by war when the neighboring arabs invaded the newly created nation. Much of TransJordan was promised to Israel by the Balfour Declaration but usurped by the arabs. The war made Israel a legal nation, recognized under law.

You said Israel is unlawfully occupied. You replied that "A declaration is not a law...." Yeah, I know. Which has nothing to do with Israel being unlawfully occupied.

The Balfour Declaration was simply a private letter from Lord Balfour to Lord Rothschild.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Balfour_Declaration

The BALFOUR DECLARATION of 1917

Foreign Office
November 2nd, 1917.

Dear Lord Rothschild,

I have much pleasure in conveying to you, on behalf of His Majesty’s Government, the following declaration of sympathy with Jewish Zionist aspirations which has been submitted to, and approved by, the Cabinet.

“His Majesty’s Government view with favour the establishment in Palestine of a national home for the Jewish people, and will use their best endeavours to facilitate the achievement of this object, it being clearly understood that nothing shall be done which may prejudice the civil and religious rights of existing non-Jewish communities in Palestine, or the rights and political status enjoyed by Jews in any other country”.

I should be grateful if you would bring this declaration to the knowledge of the Zionist Federation.

Yours sincerely,
/s/ Arthur James Balfour

Seriously, a British lord stating "His Majesty’s Government view with favour the establishment in Palestine of a national home for the Jewish people," creates a right to possession of land that does not belong to the British? The British lord had no authority to give the land to anybody. Palestine was still part of the Ottoman Empire when the Balfour Declaration was written.

The Mandate for Palestine was issued in 1922, and it was not issued on the authority of a British lord, and did not assign all of Palestine to the Jewish people to form a state.

Much of TransJordan was promised to Israel by the Balfour Declaration but usurped by the arabs.

Have you ever read the Balfour Declaration that I quoted, in full, above?

Please quote the part that you claim promised much of Trans-Jordan to Israel. Israel did not then exist.

The war made Israel a legal nation, recognized under law.

Can I have some of what you are smoking? Israel declared independence, and two hours later the United States formally recognized the State of Israel and established diplomatic relations. Before any war, Israel was a recognized nation state. Not only that, they had a fully equipped army. If Israel fought a war for independence, who did Israel become independent from?

Britain went bankrupt during World War I. They reached out to Lord Rothschild for help. And near the end of the war, Lord Balfour wrote a letter to Lord Rothschild which has been inflated into the Balfour Declaration. The only declaration was, "His Majesty’s Government view with favour the establishment in Palestine of a national home for the Jewish people...." Apparently, when His Majesty's Government view with favor, that is a contractual binding and enforceable guarantee for land that has never belonged to the British empire.

As for Israel being unlawfully occupied, your attention is invited to the undeniable fact that it is Israel which is officially unlawfully occupying Palestinian territory.

https://news.un.org/en/tags/occupied-palestinian-territory

Israeli occupation of Palestinian territory illegal: UN rights commission

20 October 2022

Human Rights

Israel’s occupation of Palestinian territory is unlawful under international law due to its permanence and the Israeli government’s de facto annexation policies, a UN-appointed Commission of Inquiry said in its first report, published on Thursday.

International law, as conveyed by the United Nations, is clear.

June 1922 The Partition of the Palestine Mandate

https://unispal.un.org/pdfs/Cmd5479.pdf

The Palestine Royal (Peel) Commission Report Cmd. 5479 (pg 38)

(3) The field in which the Jewish National Home was to be established was understood, at the time of the Balfour Declaraion, to be the whole of historic Palestine, and the Zionists were seriously disappointed when Trans-Jordan was cut away from that field under Article 25. This was done, as has been seen, in obedience to the McMahon Pledge, which was antecedent to the Balfour Declaration.

1915-1916 The McMahon-Hussein Correspondence

The McMahon–Hussein Correspondence is a series of letters that were exchanged during World War I in which the Government of the United Kingdom agreed to recognize Arab independence in a large region after the war in exchange for the Sharif of Mecca launching the Arab Revolt against the Ottoman Empire.

It was Arabs who fought to liberate Palestine from the Turkish Ottoman Empire and were promised the land.

https://www.loc.gov/item/2021666887/

League of Nations

Mandate for Palestine

And Memorandum by the British Government Relating to its Application to Trans-Jordan, Approved by the Council of the League of Nations on September 16th, 1922.

Title Page plus six pages each English and French.

MANDATE FOR PALESTINE

Whereas the Principal Allied Powers have agreed, for the purpose of giving effect to the provisions of Article 22 of the Covenant of the League of Nations, to entrust to a Mandatory selected by the said Powers the administration of the territory of Palestine, which formerly belonged to the Turkish Empire, within such boundaries as may be fixed by them; and

Whereas the Principal Allied Powers have also agreed that the Mandatory should be responsible for putting into effect the declaration originally made on November 2nd, 1917, by the Government of His Britannic Majesty, and adopted by the said Powers, in favour of the establishment in Palestine of a national home for the Jewish people, it being clearly understood that nothing should be done which might prejudice the civil and religious rights of existing non-Jewish communities in Palestine, or the rights and political status enjoyed by Jews in any other country; and

Whereas recognition has thereby been given to the historical connection of the Jewish people with Palestine and to the grounds for reconstructing their national home in that country; and

Whereas the Principal Allied Powers have selected His Britannic Majesty as the Mandatory for Palestine; and

Whereas the mandate in respect of Palestine has been formulated in the following terms and submitted to the Council of the League for approval; and

Whereas by the afore-mentioned Article 22, (paragraph 8) it is provided that the degree of authority, control or administration to be exercised by the Mandatory, not having been previously agreed upon by the Members of the League, shall be explicitly defined by the Council of the League of Nations;

Confirming the said mandate, defines its terms as follows:

Article 1

The Mandatory shall have full powers of legislation, save as they may be limited by the terms of this mandate.

Article 2

The Mandatory shall be responsible for placing the country under such political, administrative and economic conditions as wll secure the establishment of the Jewish national home, as laid down in the preamble, and the development of self-governing institutions, and also for safeguarding the civil and religious rights of all the inhabitants of Palestine, irrespective of raqce and religion

Article 3

The Mandatory shall, so far as circumstances permit, encourage local autonomy.

[...]

Article 25

In the territories lying between the Jordan and the eastern boundary of Palestine as ultimately determined, the Mandatory whall be entitled, with the consent of the Council of te League of Nations, to postpone or withhold application of such provisions of this mandate as he may consider inapplicable to the existing local conditions, and to make such provision for the administration of the territories as he may consider suitable to those conditions, provided that no action shall be taken which is inconsistent with the provisions of Articles 15, 16 and 18.

The cited Article 15, 16 and 18:

Article 15

The Mandatory shall see that complete freedom of conscience and the free exercise of all forms of worship, subject only to the maintenance of public order and morals, are ensured to all. No discrimination of any kind shall be made between the inhabitants of Palestine on the ground of race, religion or language. No person shall be excluded from Palestine on the sole ground of his religious belief.

The right of each community to maintain its own schools for the education of its own members in its own language, while conforming to such educational requirements of a general nature as the Administration may impose, shall not be denied or impaired.

Article 16

The Mandatory shall be responsible for exercising such supervision over religious or eleemosynary bodies of all faiths in Palestine as may be required for the maintenance of public order and good government. Subject to such supervision, no measures shall be taken in Palestine to obstruct or interfere with the enterprise of such bodies or to discriminate against any representative or member of them on the ground of his religion or nationality.

Article 18

The Mandatory shall see that there is no discrimination in Palestine against the nationals of any State Member of the League of Nations (including companies incorporated under its laws) as compared with those of the Mandatory or of any foreign State in matters concerning taxation, commerce or navigation, the exercise of industries or professions, or in the treatment of merchant vessels or civil aircraft. Similarly, there shall be no discrimination in Palestine against goods originating in or destined for any of the said States, and there shall be freedom of transit under equitable conditions across the mandated area.

Subject as aforesaid and to the other provisions of this mandate, the Administration of Palestine may, on the advice of the Mandatory, impose such taxes and customs duties as it may consider necessary, and take such steps as it may think best to promote the development of the natural resources of the country and to safeguard the interests of the population. It may also, on the advice of the Mandatory, conclude a special customs agreement with any State the territory of which in 1914 was wholly included in Asiatic Turkey or Arabia.

[woodpusher]

Palestine is the land of Muslims and has been the land of Muslims for millenia.

Lol! Hilarious! Millenia?

https://www.loc.gov/item/2021666887/

League of Nations

Mandate for Palestine

And Memorandum by the British Government Relating to its Application to Trans-Jordan, Approved by the Council of the League of Nations on September 16th, 1922.

Title Page plus six pages each English and French.

MANDATE FOR PALESTINE

Whereas the Principal Allied Powers have agreed, for the purpose of giving effect to the provisions of Article 22 of the Covenant of the League of Nations, to entrust to a Mandatory selected by the said Powers the administration of the territory of Palestine, which formerly belonged to the Turkish Empire, within such boundaries as may be fixed by them;

The Arabs seized control around 638 A.D. Israel had part of Palestine bestowed upon them as a mandate in the mid-twentieth century.

[roadcat]

The Arabs seized control around 638 A.D. Israel had part of Palestine bestowed upon them as a mandate in the mid-twentieth century.

Lol! The Jews have been there twice as long, more millennia, even before the pedophile Mohammed took a 9-year-old as his bride and founded Islam, and went on a killing spree. Your koran was fabricated hundreds of years after the New Testament was written. Jews have a historic claim to the land, long before any mooselimbs walked into the lands. Jews have been there for thousands of years. Long before the nomadic arabs came trespassing.

[Ultra Sonic 007]

Lol! The Jews have been there twice as long, more millennia, even before the pedophile Mohammed took a 9-year-old as his bride and founded Islam, and went on a killing spree. Your koran was fabricated hundreds of years after the New Testament was written. Jews have a historic claim to the land, long before any mooselimbs walked into the lands. Jews have been there for thousands of years. Long before the nomadic arabs came trespassing.

If you want to go even further back, the Hebrews took the land which became the Kingdom of Israel by right of conquest against the Canaanites. They were then conquered in turn by various polities like the Assyrians and the Babylonians before being allowed to return by the Persians...and then they were conquered by the Romans. Some decades after the crucifixion of Jesus, the Romans put Jerusalem to the torch, definitively crushing the Jewish presence in that city and reducing the Hebrews to a diaspora.

Then there was a Christian majority in Palestine before various revolts by the Samaritans, as well as a brief period of conquest by the Sasanians before the Eastern Roman Empire re-established their hegemony.

Then the Mohammedans came rolling into town.

TL;DR: the Jews were not the first to occupy the Land of Israel; not by a long shot.

And if you want to invoke the words of Almighty God as a reason for why their title to the land is of superior weight, maybe the Jews should have considered all of that before delivering up the Son of God—the promised Messiah—to be executed by the Romans.

[jjotto]

Heck, plenty of occupying colonist Muslims weren’t Arabs, and didn’t like fellow Muslims not like them. Saladin was a Kurd. Ottomans were Turks. There were little fiefdoms scattered around. Various Christian groups, Druze, Samaritans, Circassians, Mustarabi Jews, other Mizrachi Jews, Sefardi Jews, Ashkenazi Jews starting in the 1400s, a batch of Egyptians in the 1830s. These groups were not sitting around singing Kumbayah with Arab and Ottoman overlords.

By the 1860s, Ashkenaz Jews were buying land and setting up towns, agriculture and social institutions, thanks to Montefiore and Rothschilds dealing with the Ottoman Sultan.

[roadcat]

Then the Mohammedans came rolling into town.

That's my whole point. The Jews were there many millennia ago. Long before the muslims existed! Which tends to be ignored by ignorant people.

[woodpusher]

Israel declared independence effective at midnight (or 0001) on May 15, 1948 upon the previously announced termination of the mandate.

I should correct a minor error from my #42 where I incorrectly stated, "Israel declared independence, and two hours later the United States formally recognized the State of Israel and established diplomatic relations."

It appears it was 11 minutes later, as shown below.

On December 11, 1947 it was announced that the British Mandate would end on May 15, 1948. Eleven minutes after Israel declared independence, President Truman officially recognized Israel.

https://www.trumanlibrary.gov/education/presidential-inquiries/recognition-israel

U.S. President Harry Truman was the first world leader to officially recognize Israel as a legitimate Jewish state on May 14, 1948, only eleven minutes after its creation.

Harry Truman acted on May 14 Washington time which was May 15 Israel time.

[woodpusher]

The Arabs seized control around 638 A.D. Israel had part of Palestine bestowed upon them as a mandate in the mid-twentieth century.

Lol! The Jews have been there twice as long, more millennia,

The Jews have been in New York City for centuries and it does not mean that they owned the place. It seems they may have actually owned some delicatessens in Bensonhurst, Brighton Beach, Williamsburg, Flatbush, Wiliamsburg, and Brownsville in Brooklyn, but I don't think they have an historic claim to own Brooklyn.

Jews were in Palestine when Palestine was an Arab territory. It does not mean they owned Palestine.

Jews have a historic claim to the land

Just as the Indian tribes have an historic claim to the lower 48.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_ancient_Israel_and_Judah

According to the Hebrew Bible, a "United Monarchy" (consisting of Israel and Judah) existed as early as the 11th century BCE, under the reigns of Saul, David, and Solomon; the country later split into two kingdoms: Israel, containing the cities of Shechem and Samaria in the north, and Judah (containing Jerusalem and the Jewish Temple) in the south. The historicity of the United Monarchy is debated—as there are no archaeological remains of it that are accepted as consensus—but The Kingdom of Israel was destroyed around 720 BCE, when it was conquered by the Neo-Assyrian Empire. While the Kingdom of Judah remained intact during this time, it became a client state of first the Neo-Assyrian Empire and then the Neo-Babylonian Empire. However, Jewish revolts against the Babylonians led to the destruction of Judah in 586 BCE, under the rule of Babylonian king Nebuchadnezzar II. According to the biblical account, the armies of Nebuchadnezzar II besieged Jerusalem between 589–586 BCE, which led to the destruction of Solomon's Temple and the exile of the Jews to Babylon; this event was also recorded in the Babylonian Chronicles. The exilic period, saw the development of the Israelite religion (Yahwism) towards the monotheistic Judaism.

This ended with the fall of Babylon to the Achaemenid Persian Empire around 538 BCE. Subsequently, Persian king Cyrus the Great issued a proclamation known as the Edict of Cyrus, which authorized and encouraged exiled Jews to return to Judah. Cyrus' proclamation began the exiles' return to Zion, inaugurating the formative period in which a more distinctive Jewish identity developed in the Persian province of Yehud. During this time, the destroyed Solomon's Temple was replaced by the Second Temple, marking the beginning of the Second Temple period.

As you may observe, the Kingdom of Israel was destroyed around 720 B.C., or about seven centuries before Jesus Christ, our Lord and Savior walked the Earth, or about 2,600 years before the Jews were given a part of Palestine by the League of Nations.

https://www.loc.gov/item/2021666887/

Title

Mandate for Palestine and Memorandum by the British Government Relating to its Application to Transjordan.

Summary

After World War I, the Covenant of the League of Nations established a system by which the League was empowered to confer upon certain of the victorious powers mandates to administer territories formerly ruled by Germany or the Ottoman Empire. Mandated territories were to be governed on behalf of the League, until such time as they could become independent. On September 16, 1922, the Council of the League approved a mandate to Great Britain for Palestine, previously part of the Ottoman Empire. The mandate provided for the eventual creation of a Jewish state, as specified in Article 2: "The Mandatory shall be responsible for placing the country under such political, administrative and economic conditions as will secure the establishment of a Jewish national home, as laid down in the preamble, and the development of self-governing institutions, and also for safeguarding the civil and religious rights of all the inhabitants of Palestine, irrespective of race and religion." Successive articles dealt with Jewish immigration, public administration, access to holy places and religious buildings, public health, commerce, and other matters. Appended to the mandate was a memorandum by the British government, also approved by the Council of the League, stating its understanding that the provisions of the mandate relating to the establishment of a Jewish national home and the promotion of Jewish immigration were not to apply to that portion of the mandated territory known as Transjordan, i.e., territory east of the Jordan River. The texts are in French and English, on facing pages. The mandate is in the archives of the League, which were transferred to the United Nations in 1946 and are housed at the UN office in Geneva. The archives were inscribed on the UNESCO Memory of the World register in 2010.

[Golden Eagle]

While there have long been rumors of a plan for “Greater Israel” which encompassed parts of their neighboring states, Turkey is never shown as being affected much in those maps.

https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Greater_israel.jpg

[dfwgator]

Maybe Israel should start with Northern Cyprus.

[roadcat]

Lol! The Jews have been there twice as long, more millennia, even before the pedophile Mohammed took a 9-year-old as his bride and founded Islam, and went on a killing spree.