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To: FLT-bird; knighthawk
FLT-bird: "When the constitution was ratified, 3 states including the two largest and the two which were the leaders of their respective sections (New York and Virginia) explicitly reserved the right to unilateral secession.
Nobody at the time claimed the states' explicit reservation of the right to secede rendered their ratification of the Constitution thereby defective.
Every state understood itself to have that right."

All of such 1788 reservations were stated in terms of what's "necessary" or due to "injury or oppression".
None, not one, ever claimed a "right of secession" for any reason, or for no reason, at pleasure.
No Founder ever supported what we might call a "no-fault divorce", except by mutual consent.

Pres. James Madison, often named the "Father of the Constitution" went into this question at treat length, here.

223 posted on 10/05/2021 6:52:19 AM PDT by BroJoeK (future DDG 134 -- we remember)
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To: BroJoeK
No Founder ever supported what we might call a "no-fault divorce", except by mutual consent.

Almost all the evidence is against you. I encountered another piece of evidence against you the other day when someone on the news mentioned what was written in Article VII.

"The Ratification of the Conventions of nine States, shall be sufficient for the Establishment of this Constitution between the States so ratifying the Same."

Nine states huh? Not 13? What happened to that compulsory Union? Clearly the other four states were allowed to remain out of the Union.

Rhode Island did so until they finally threatened it with a ban on trade with it, and then it reluctantly agreed to "join" but with the same stipulation that it could leave that Virginia and New York incorporated into their ratification statements.

Again, the evidence is against your claim.

225 posted on 10/05/2021 7:04:57 AM PDT by DiogenesLamp ("of parents owing allegiance to<i> no other sovereignty.")
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To: BroJoeK
All of such 1788 reservations were stated in terms of what's "necessary" or due to "injury or oppression". None, not one, ever claimed a "right of secession" for any reason, or for no reason, at pleasure. No Founder ever supported what we might call a "no-fault divorce", except by mutual consent.

It was up to each state to determine what injury or oppression they deemed sufficient to secede.

Pres. James Madison, often named the "Father of the Constitution" went into this question at treat length here.

Oh you mean in the 1820s? LOL! Firstly what the STATES agreed to at the time is what is relevant. They were the ones who were actually parties to the contract. What does not matter is the opinion of the Madison 40 years later.

231 posted on 10/05/2021 10:26:02 AM PDT by FLT-bird
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