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Kyle Rittenhouse and The Law of the Pursuer
American Thinker.com ^ | August 30, 2020 | Civis Americanus

Posted on 08/30/2020 5:10:51 AM PDT by Kaslin

Wisconsin recently charged Kyle Rittenhouse with first degree murder for killing two people who were, from what I can see from the videos, attacking him with weapons. Whether Rittenhouse should have been in Kenosha in the first place, and with a weapon a 17-year old cannot legally carry in public, is a separate issue for courts of law to decide. The question at hand is however why he was charged with murder while his surviving alleged assailants were, as far as I know, not charged with anything.

This leads to the need to educate potential jurors (i.e. all citizens who are eligible to serve on juries) proactively about important self-defense principles. This must happen before they are called for jury duty because it is illegal to do so afterward. Jurors need to understand the simple concept of din rodef, "the law of the pursuer." This gives defense attorneys a single word – rodef -- to explain the concept if jurors are not already familiar with it.

Rodef = One Who Pursues

A rodef (plural rodfim) is somebody who pursues somebody else with the objective of causing death or serious physical injury. Din rodef entitles the one pursued, or a bystander, to use reasonable force, up to and including deadly force, to stop the rodef from completing the intended violent crime. The principle is actually very similar to most modern laws. Deadly force cannot be used if lesser force will suffice, and the rodef ceases to be a rodef the instant he desists from his violent actions. Din rodef is also reflected by the modern adages (in the context of a fight or argument) such as "Never follow anybody into the parking lot" and "Never follow the other guy home" because these are prima facie evidence of malicious and violent intent.

(Excerpt) Read more at americanthinker.com ...


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Editorial; News/Current Events; US: Wisconsin
KEYWORDS: banglist; kenosha; rittenhouse; selfdefense; wisconsin
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1 posted on 08/30/2020 5:10:51 AM PDT by Kaslin
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To: Kaslin
Excellent find. I have heard of this legal principle and am very glad to have been updated as to its applicability in modern America.

Rodef = One Who Pursues

A rodef (plural rodfim) is somebody who pursues somebody else with the objective of causing death or serious physical injury. Din rodef entitles the one pursued, or a bystander, to use reasonable force, up to and including deadly force, to stop the rodef from completing the intended violent crime. The principle is actually very similar to most modern laws.

Deadly force cannot be used if lesser force will suffice, and the rodef ceases to be a rodef the instant he desists from his violent actions. Din rodef is also reflected by the modern adages (in the context of a fight or argument) such as “Never follow anybody into the parking lot” and “Never follow the other guy home” because these are prima facie evidence of malicious and violent intent. It's hard for a rodef to claim innocence or self-defense when things go bad.

2 posted on 08/30/2020 5:20:58 AM PDT by texas booster (Join FreeRepublic's Folding@Home team (Team # 36120) Cure Alzheimer's!)
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To: Kaslin

Do we have video evidence that he was attacked prior to the first shooting? He clearly is chased and attacked by the skateboard guy. But he had shot someone in the head before that, correct? Is there a video of the first shooting? I’ve only seen the aftermath.


3 posted on 08/30/2020 5:21:17 AM PDT by Williams (Stop Tolerating The Intolerant)
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To: Kaslin

Similar, if not the same, of the Castle Doctrine.


4 posted on 08/30/2020 5:24:42 AM PDT by Road Warrior ‘04 (BOYCOTT The NFL, MLB, NBA & NASCAR! Molon Labe! Oathkeeper!)
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To: Williams
Not only is there video evidence of the Rittenhouse being attacked in the first shooting, but eye witness account from a Daily Caller reporter who used his shirt to stop the bleeding. He has stated repeatedly the first assailant chased Rittenhouse and tried to take his weapon when he was shot.
5 posted on 08/30/2020 5:25:25 AM PDT by OldGoatCPO (No Caitiff Choir of Angles will sing for me)
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To: Road Warrior ‘04
Similar, if not the same, of as the Castle Doctrine.
6 posted on 08/30/2020 5:25:49 AM PDT by Road Warrior ‘04 (BOYCOTT The NFL, MLB, NBA & NASCAR! Molon Labe! Oathkeeper!)
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To: marktwain

Thought you might appreciate this. Ping!


7 posted on 08/30/2020 5:26:51 AM PDT by RandallFlagg (Fact: Gun control laws kill innocents.)
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To: texas booster

Sounds like the Kenosha district attorney is ALSO guilty of being a rodef, considering what can happen to Kyle in custody...


8 posted on 08/30/2020 5:26:56 AM PDT by kiryandil (Chris Wallace: Because someone has to drive the Clown Car)
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To: Williams

Do we have video evidence that he was attacked prior to the first shooting? He clearly is chased and attacked by the skateboard guy. But he had shot someone in the head before that, correct? Is there a video of the first shooting? I’ve only seen the aftermath.


There are a number of videos from different sources. What I can determine he tried to leave the area but the police were pushing everyone in the same direction. He had been identified as a target by the mob and there there were gunshots (not clear if they were at him or not) but that is when he shot the first person.

Again he tried to flee and they chased him down. While on the ground they continued the attack and it is here when he shot the other two.

There is a photo of one of his assailants with a pistol.

The prosecutor did not investigate before charging him with murder.

I predict that most of the charges will be tossed.

As for someone underage with a weapon, I think it will make an interesting court case. The whole purpose of the 2nd amendment is to allow individual to be armed to defend themselves. There is no age limit on the 2nd amendment.

Actually until recent history it was perfectly normal for young men to own guns and even take them to school or scout meetings.

If a young person is not allowed to be armed during a violent riot then our laws are insane and should be overturned.


9 posted on 08/30/2020 5:33:07 AM PDT by CIB-173RDABN (I am not an expert in anything, and my opinion is just that, an opinion. I may be wrong.)
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To: Kaslin
Blackstone's Commentaries on the Laws of England, Book the Third - Chapter the First :

Self-defence therefore as it is justly called the primary law of nature, for it is not, neither can it be in fact, taken away be the law of society.

10 posted on 08/30/2020 5:33:31 AM PDT by Lonesome in Massachussets ("Women's intuition" gave us the Salem witch trials and Kavanaugh hearings. Change my mind.)
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To: Kaslin

11 posted on 08/30/2020 5:34:18 AM PDT by Travis McGee (EnemiesForeignAndDomestic.com)
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To: CIB-173RDABN

Agreed.
Kyle’s age shouldn’t be an issue.
If someone says it is, I would argue, “So because there was no law enforcement presence and because Kyle was seventeen, he deserved to be murdered for defending his life?”


12 posted on 08/30/2020 5:39:11 AM PDT by RandallFlagg (Fact: Gun control laws kill innocents.)
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To: CIB-173RDABN
Actually until recent history it was perfectly normal for young men to own guns and even take them to school or scout meetings.

I have a friend who was on the rifle team at Bishop Dubois High School in Manhattan in the 1950's. They carried their rifles at sling arms on the subway going from school to Knightsbridge Armory in the Bronx. He says he was questioned one time by a transit policeman, who didn't make an issue out of it. IIRC, even back in those halcyon days it was illegal to carry firearms on the subway

Can you imagine the reaction if a bunch of high school kids was carrying rifles on the NYC subway today? Five boroughs would be in lockdown. CNN would go into meltdown. They would be characterized as smirking little snots on every news network save one or two.

13 posted on 08/30/2020 5:40:15 AM PDT by Lonesome in Massachussets ("Women's intuition" gave us the Salem witch trials and Kavanaugh hearings. Change my mind.)
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To: Williams
Do we have video evidence that he was attacked prior to the first shooting?

It's spotty. And, the first shot is not Kyle's.

The spot vids and pics we can piece together show a confrontation between BLM'ers and folks not really opposed to BLM objectives. The latter well-armed and protecting businesses. Their motto: pillage and riot as you will, but not at the business I'm here to protect. The BLM'ers started a dumpster fire and intended to ram it into a biz (gas station?). Kyle guys used a fire extinguisher to put it out. Then, shorty bald guy gets angry and leads to him chasing Kyle. THe rest is then well-videoed.

14 posted on 08/30/2020 5:51:52 AM PDT by C210N
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To: Kaslin

“Whether Rittenhouse should have been in Kenosha in the first place, and with a weapon a 17-year old cannot legally carry in public, is a separate issue for courts of law to decide.”

Is it a fact that a 17-year old cannot legally carry such a weapon in public there? Can an adult do so?


15 posted on 08/30/2020 5:53:45 AM PDT by SoCal Pubbie
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To: Kaslin

If the DA wasn’t such a traitor, the Wisconsin governor, the Kenosha mayor, the surviving attacker of Kyle, along with as many of the Antifa/BLM terrorists as can be arrested, should be been charged with murder, just as a getaway driver is charge with murder if one of his fellow bankrobbers is killed by a bank guard.


16 posted on 08/30/2020 6:01:16 AM PDT by Carl Vehse
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To: Kaslin

Kyle was within his legal rights to carry a long rifle in Wis.


17 posted on 08/30/2020 6:01:57 AM PDT by stockpirate (Anyone who believes Epstein killed himself is a fool, and the DNC wacked Seth Rich)
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To: Williams

Yes there is video of him being attacked before the first person was shot. In fact he shot the person attacking him.


18 posted on 08/30/2020 6:03:32 AM PDT by stockpirate (Anyone who believes Epstein killed himself is a fool, and the DNC wacked Seth Rich)
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To: Kaslin
Din rodef is also reflected by the modern adages (in the context of a fight or argument) such as “Never follow anybody into the parking lot” and “Never follow the other guy home” because these are prima facie evidence of malicious and violent intent. It's hard for a rodef to claim innocence or self-defense when things go bad.

Since Rittenhouse went into a riot area, armed in violation of the law and in violation of the curfew, then can the prosecution say he can't claim innocent intent when things turned bad? I'm not saying he's guilty or innocent but wondering if that's why they charged him with murder?

19 posted on 08/30/2020 6:08:22 AM PDT by DoodleDawg
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To: CIB-173RDABN
Actually until recent history it was perfectly normal for young men to own guns and even take them to school or scout meetings.

I might be showing my age, but we used to take guns to school all the time. When dove season started, I used to take my shotgun to school on the school bus and keep it in my locker so I could go hunting after school. When I became old enough to drive to school and owned a truck, I used to keep guns in the truck in the school parking lot.

20 posted on 08/30/2020 6:10:12 AM PDT by eastexsteve
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