Posted on 07/08/2020 1:39:30 AM PDT by RomanSoldier19
The tests last year were already known, so Russia’s agenda of discussing them again may be linked to wider agenda
Turkey, a member of NATO, tested the Russian-made S-400 air defense system on US-made F-16 jets during a drill in November 2019, Russia’s state media TASS reported. The use of the S-400 against the F-16s was already reported last year, but the new details from Russian media appear to cement the claim and infer that something more was going on in those tests. Russia has an interest in knowing how well its air defense performs against US warplanes. Russia’s S-400 is the top tier of its numerous air defense systems. Some of these systems have been called into question due to mistakes. S-200s used by the Syrian regime shot down a Russian airplane by mistake in 2018. Iranian models of Russian systems have scored big in 2019 with a shoot-down of a US drone, but the Iranians also shot down a civilian jetliner in January.
In Syria there are questions about the radar and reliability of the S-300s and Pantsir and other systems abilities to track modern drones and fifth generational jets. Russia’s Pantsirs were also destroyed by Turkish drones in battles in Idlib and Libya this year.
(Excerpt) Read more at jpost.com ...
I wonder how well they do against cruise missiles.
Probably not too well.
Or lasers.
well Turks knocked of bunch of things via kmart drones : overall tech is getting buck rogers level
Turkish Drones Destroy Syrian Pantsir-S1 Air Defense ...
Search domain t-intell.com/2020/03/04/turkish-drones-destroy-syrian-pantsir-s1-air-defense-system/https://t-intell.com/2020/03/04/turkish-drones-destroy-syrian-pantsir-s1-air-defense-sys
It doesn’t make sense that a “NATO member” would use Russian anti aircraft missiles unless you realize that Turkey is not the ally that it’s cracked up to be. It’s one of the things that I don’t understand about Trump’s praise of Erdogon.
Academic exercise. Any conflict would see those systems taken out long before F-16s made an appearance
That was my point in post #2.
F-16 was developed in the early 1970’s. It won the fly off against the yf-18 and became operational early under Jimmy Carter’s administration. Design and development is more than 45 years old for this airframe.
That would be like testing a spad WWI fighter against a F-4 phantom, in time schedule.
It’s a ridiculous test, has virtually no meaning on a modern battlefield. The Russians bragging about this only demonstrate their weakness and insecurity, because they are not stupid.
In June, Turkey deployed HAWK (entered service 1959) in Libya. The F-16 entered service in 1978, first flight in 1974. I’m impressed, it only took the Russians 41 to 46 years to catch up.
The US does not need to use F-16s over Syria, regardless of whether Russians have caught up, which is likely untrue.
I believe Israeli F-16s are quite a bit different than Turkish F-16s.
Israeli planes have different avionics.
It’s not entirely “ridiculous”. Last I checked, the Air Force still has a lot of F-16s.
However, in a SEAD scenario, you’d probably expect something else to take out the S-400s before they send in the F-16s. But that is idea. It may not happen or you may not get all of them.
Just piling on i guess.
Trump had a lot of experience in New York dealing with tyrants and crooks. Occasional flattery is often the price of serious negotiation with such people. And, like it or not, Erdogan and Turkey matter. The long game for US diplomacy is to limit the damage from Erdogan and await better times when he is gone and the potential recovery of Turkey as a reliable ally and NATO member. For similar reasons, Israel has taken pains to limit its conflict with Turkey, with which it previously had a business-like relationship.
“However, in a SEAD scenario, you’d probably expect something else to take out the S-400s before they send in the F-16s. But that is idea. It may not happen or you may not get all of them.”
Bring on the Wild Weasels!
S-400 vs F16s - F16s vs S-400. Test work both ways.
A sane group of NATO leaders excluding Turkey would be saying to Turkey - either the Russian arms go or you must leave NATO.
While the NATO rules are written in such a way that (1) consensus is required (as opposed to majority vote) and (2) Turkey could not be excluded form a vote, that does not prevent the other NATO members taking independent actions that effectively excludes Turkey from all cooperation of any military kind. The U.S. can remove its military from Turkey if it wants to, including its most advanced weapons.
I think the version they were testing against was a Lockheed-Martin Block 52 F-16CJ
For air defence system the version of the airplane doesn’t make difference. Size, speed, altitude and maneuverability matters.
The Russian systems are usually rated for probability to score a hit with single munition per defined type but the type definition is vague.
Let’s say BUK is rated with 90% probability vs ‘F-15’ in level flight at distance of 42 km.
‘F-15’ in evading maneuver at 9g is 70% probability to hit with a single munition.
‘B-52’,’Huey’ are rated are 100% hit at 42 km.
HARM 60-80% at 20 km depending on altitude.
AGM86 60-80% at 26 km at altitude 6000 meters, 20 km at altitude 30 meters.
The type is fluid definition. B-52 applies to B1 and RC135, Huey to Blackhawk, F15 to F16.
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.